Sciencemadness Discussion Board

What happened to rhodium and Hive

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solo - 6-8-2004 at 14:45

Today I've tried for over an hour both theHive and Rhodium but can't seem to make connection. doesn anyone know if they're down for repairs or are they a victim of a shut down?........solo

Reverend Necroticus Rex - 6-8-2004 at 14:53

I got the same problem about an hour or two ago, I know they had problems a while ago due them making a few tweaks to TFSE etc.

Maybe they're making more improvments/maintenance on the hive,
I haven't checked rhodium's site, is that down too?

Does not bode well...

unicorn - 6-8-2004 at 16:30

The timing of this is somewhat worrying, with roguesci going down as well.

I really hope this is some unlikely coincidence, but I'm a somewhat pessimistic and cynical person, and I'm beginning to wonder if at some point in the near pre-election future, Bush will state how he has recently overseen the shut down of major internet sites giving instructions to evil terrorists and drug manufacturers.

I don't understand how he can get away with it though, I don't know how many powers recent anti-terrorism laws over there, including the patriot act, has given the US government.

I'll try to be positive though, and hope that all sites mentioned spring back to life soon enough. :)

chemoleo - 6-8-2004 at 16:42

Yes I also think maybe we are exaggerating the problem. There is no evidence that this is related, and the fact that SM is still up ought to tell you it probably isn't.
Let's not get overly paranoid shall we?
Time will tell. And to any problem there is a solution. SM wont just disappear...regardless!

A tad worrying

Charlie - 6-8-2004 at 16:45

Both registered in Western Samoa. Is that some kind of satellite uplink? Maybe it is just a systems failure somewhere along the line.

The admins aren't stupid. If Dubya has shafted it, it will reappear somewhere. None of this 'forgot to back it up' crap.

Blind Angel - 6-8-2004 at 19:01

The-Hive and Rhodium are phenix forum (the mythical animal) they reappear from their ashes, it wouldn't be the first time that they got close. So if it's really down, just watch and wait, it'll surely pop-up somewhere else. And I opt for the server problem, since i think the two are located on the same server (supposition)

Sarevok - 6-8-2004 at 20:53

Rhodium and The Hive were probably deleted too! Damn it.

No one noticed it but, one or two weeks before Roguesci's shutdown, the URL stopped to work too.

Something big is happening. I don't know exactly why sciencemadness still exists.

[Edited on 7/8/2004 by Sarevok]

Polverone - 6-8-2004 at 21:16

People are going a little bit overboard with the paranoia-talk. The Hive and Rhodium seem to be on the same server, because in the past whenever one was inaccessible, so was the other. This is not the first time there's been a temporary outage. It's not amazing that they're down again. The main web site is not gone, and its forum has disappeared before.

Sarevok - 6-8-2004 at 21:36

And what about Roguesci? Oh, I know it, the mods forgot to pay for the domain. :rolleyes:


Quantum - 6-8-2004 at 22:11

I think what Polverone says has a bit more weight than what you do, Sarevok but I am worried. Lets wait a few days before making a super kevlar covered tinfoil hat

IvX - 7-8-2004 at 02:05

Bombshock was gone well over 2 months before roguesci went down and it's about 80% likely that it was someone the new admin(Lowman) pissed off(read my little rant thread for example).

Besides TOTSE is still up and running it's recieved possibly the most(competeing with EW)public coverage.

works fine now

Turel - 7-8-2004 at 04:40

I never experienced a down period from the Hive....

Last I logged in was 2 days ago, and it worked then; and it works now. So all appears to be well, at least for now.


The Hive and Rhodium are back.......

solo - 7-8-2004 at 09:05

Like the Blind Angel stated , they're back....I guess we all share a common concern....Freedom of speech, a concern to protect and allow other to excercise.....solo

Froud and Shit

RIPPER - 16-10-2004 at 04:05

:) & :)

Rhodium and the Hive will be off for a while.......

solo - 17-11-2004 at 17:01

Both the Hive and Rhodium will be off for a while as they posted on their general forum. From days to weeks to a month they are changing the we will just have to check in periodically to see when they return..........solo/aka...... java at the Hive

On a side note it is very nice spending my time here in leu of no Hive.......solo

need a post from the hive

cavgdad - 20-11-2004 at 11:46

what a re the of getting a zip of the hive. i am in desperate need of retrieving a post from the hive....:D

neutrino - 20-11-2004 at 14:52

You might be able to find it through Google and use the cached version.


Polverone - 20-11-2004 at 15:16

The Hive is not indexed by ordinary search engines; their robots directives say "go away" to search engine spiders. What is the post that you need?

needed post

cavgdad - 22-11-2004 at 06:45

the post i need is in reference to improved wacker process. i believe the thread was started by rhodium, and referenced a link to his site about "improved wacker with a rate increase of up to 50... or something like that. the final posts was about a "dream" of some bee, using palladium acetate. i replied to it uncer my hive name bbeeasheets. need more info?>

ref: Wanted article from Rhodium

solo - 22-11-2004 at 15:09

Improved Wacker Oxidation of Alkenes to Ketones
D.G. Miller & D.D.M.Wayner
J. Org. Chem. 1990, 55,2925-2927


An improved method for palladium(II)-catalyzed Wacker oxidation of cyclic and internal olefins is described. Addition of perchloric, sulfuric, nitric, or tetrafluoroboric acid to a chloride free solution of the Pd(II) catalyst gives rate enhancements of up to a factor of 50. The oxidation of cyclohexene to cyclohexanone, which was previously reported to give a 97 % yield after 5 h, is now accomplished in 1 h quantitatively, with only one-third of the amount of Pd(II) used. Limitations of the method are also discussed.

Attachment: Improved Wacker Oxidation of Alkenes to Ketones(J. Org. 55, 2924-2927,1990).pdf (25kB)
This file has been downloaded 2959 times

needed post

cavgdad - 22-11-2004 at 16:19

thanks solo, thats the post, but i actually need the thread from the hive, as the post contained info i need. thanks for your help and reply!

Suggestions n Thoughts

MiNd - 29-11-2004 at 01:30

I'd not be surprised if somewhere it has been said, but heres my 2 cents regarding the hive and many other BB sites:

1) One Dollah there buckeye, just a buck!
2) Anti-Spider/MassDownloading is NOT a kewl website feature.

1) First and formost, playing webmaster to a demanding site is more than a full-time job (been their, done it in past years) and consumes a persons life (time and ENERGY wise) thus I think they should be paid (becuase I would want to be personally). Additionally it would also cover the many expenses for a site (hosting, software, hardware, time, etc.). If users of nice sites like SM, the-hive, etc. supported them, such sites would likely be more reliable in remaining online. I think site admins SHOULD have a method (i.e. PayPal/similar) for recieving 'donations' AND request/suggest a dollar donation (monthly/quaterly, now-n-again, etc.) from each user who uses and appreciates that site. A buck ain't much, something easily parted with, and reasonably cheap compared to everything else in life!

Last I looked, over 5k registered users on the hive.. In a perferct world maybe 10% donated a buck a month, that $500 would pay that sites expenses and some money in the pocket of the Master which motivates'em to maintain and keep their site online.

Personally, I'm surprised to have seen the hive around so long (7 or 8 years) and treasure it, as a wealth of INFORMATION which I can't soak up enough of.. The site, hmmm, it's content, hmmmm, it's members are priceless!

2) Tryed over the past year or two many times using quite a few different spider/site-downloading apps inorder to spider the hive (download all of that sites web pages to my computer, for the layman) WITHOUT success. Too lazy and without the time, I never ventured into countless days or weeks project of coding something to snag the hive :)

I did try 8-12 of the top and best spiders/site-downloader apps under Winblows with no success and have the opinion it's a pretty decent little anti-spidering system the hive utilizes (or maybe verifying/ensuring a web browser is reqeusting the file). Never did get into exploring that project or topic, one day I'll have to..

Back on topic, site admins, DO NOT (pretty please :) prevent site-downloading. And though a reasonable concern, the potentional bandwidth demand/usage by such downloaders would not be an problem or issue for the site if site admin were utilizing suggestion #1 above. The site admin would have the funds to pay for/support whatever service and expense necessary to meet the needs n demands of the sites users.

I value just as YOU, yeah, you reading this, value having in your own possession a copy of specific information. Knowing, IF or WHEN you want it or need the info, it's sitting in your library or on a disk of yours rather than praying to the queen bee, that website is still online.

Lastly, when or should a website die for whatever reason..

YES IT'S A CONSPIRACY! lol (sadly, true both ways, literally and jokingly)

Some user with a copy of that sites content/information will setup a replacement/equivalent site containing/mirroring all the dead sites info.

Xmas wish list: It would be extra special, nice, and greatly appreciated by users (at least one, ME, hehe) if a site exported & archived it's content/data for download. (Let me have this one dream, just one, please, oh great Furby Buddha.. Praise Furby.. I worsheep thy great Furby.)

Thats my yearly post and rant all-in-one,

i would gladly pay

cavgdad - 29-11-2004 at 07:09

i would gladly donate to help out. i think most bees would... except for the nature of the hive. i believe a complete anonymous and facile method of payment would be needed. no paper trail for big brother. maybe i am just paranoid. hopefully its not too late for the hive, what a loss that would bee.

btw i have since found a copy of the info i needed from the post above.

thanks again for the help.

Organikum - 29-11-2004 at 11:12

Both the HIVE and Rhodiums page are perfectly legal.
If somebody doesnt donate referring to a username under which he has just bragged that he made heaps of speed there is no problem at all in doing so and even if he does, chances he will get trouble from this are marginal.

All this paranoia is completely away from reality. In reality ppl who make drugs get ratted out by what they thought being their "best friends" or get fucked by the good old own stupidity.

cavgdad - 29-11-2004 at 19:16

so how do we go around starting a fund drive to get rhodium and the hive back. i will be the first to donate time and money (not a huge of either... but i will start.

Organikum - 30-11-2004 at 03:36

Nobody knows up to now the reasons why the HIVE and Rhodium´s went offline.

Of course donations will be welcome all time, but senting up funds is not our business at all, but the business of the administration there.

I hope though that there will be a possibility in future to get the HIVE downloaded, as this whats happening now shows that the monopolisation of information doesnt work for but against the idea of freedom of information.
The HIVE should at least remove its restrictions for the public accessible forums to be archivied in the wayback machine.

Thats just my opinion of course.


HRH_Prince_Charles - 30-11-2004 at 15:22

Abolt made a farewell comment a day or so before The Hive went down, and I wonder whether he knew something.

Organikum - 1-12-2004 at 01:31

Either the HIVE or most of its information will show up again sooner or later.

For sure.

/ORG :o

rhodium zip

antibond - 1-12-2004 at 10:59

Anyone know when the latest zipped up version of the Rhodium site was made? Not sure if I have the latest. Is it available for download anywhere else?

Ref: Rhodium's Archived Files

solo - 1-12-2004 at 12:17

I downloaded the archives on Nov.23rd 2004, I guess that's pretty close to the most recent however its 34MB of data ......Maybe I can upload it to axhandle's FTP I need to see if it's all right to do that ....let me contact him and find out then I will upnote this post......solo

HRH_Prince_Charles - 1-12-2004 at 12:35

That would be great if you could do that solo, mine's a little out of date.

To anyone that is interested, the anonymising socks proxy, Tor, handles ftp OK for anonymous uploads/downloads. You'd need a socks compatible ftp client to do this. On Linux, the only GUI client I could find that worked was IglooFTP-PRO (I hate the command line).

solo - 1-12-2004 at 15:44

Ok then it's in the ftp on the upload file , in a zip format,.....I didn't hear from axhandle so I went ahead and uploaded ....I hope I don't get banned......solo

Thankyou my son

HRH_Prince_Charles - 1-12-2004 at 17:54

May your good karma rest eternally upon your soul.

I doubt that Axehandle will object, on account of him being one of the good guys.

Thermal - 2-12-2004 at 07:18 as of Dec 2 ish:
"Nothing here, nor will it be. Please do not write us about it. Thanks!"

Swim wasn't worried before but this doesn't give good feelings as to the sites return anytime soon.

Methinks this may not bode well.
But perhaps it's just paranoia.

Organikum - 2-12-2004 at 09:02

Thats disgusting. :mad:

Not Necessarily Bad

HRH_Prince_Charles - 2-12-2004 at 10:25

Well I can't connect to The Hive and hence don't get that message. Besides, that message could have been put there by the current server admins rather than The Hive admins. They are probably waiting for the DNS records to update completely so that requests for The Hive don't resolve to their IP address any longer.

RE. Rhodium's archive. I retrieved a copy from axehandle's server and it is old: latest update being 2004-1-23. I don't know whether this is the file solo uploaded. I have a more recent copy that could be uploaded, updated 2004-8-8.

Rhodium's site was confusing because the stated archive date was never the same as the actual archive date.

Eliteforum - 2-12-2004 at 10:42

So, how long till a re-vival? A month is my bet, any takers?

Nothing here..nor will it be

UpNatom - 2-12-2004 at 11:25

I really hope you're right about this HRH (that the message is from the host rather than the admins).:(
I was viewing a russian chemistry board recently and the hive was being discussed in a thread (babelfish translation so it was a bit garbled) but someone seemed to be suggesting that antoncho had posted at another board and the downtime may not be so temporary.
I will try and post a link and perhaps a russian speaker could enlighten us.

[edit] Here is the link:

[Edited on 2-12-2004 by UpNatom]

Mephisto - 2-12-2004 at 11:53

I've made a mirror of on 16-08-04. The compressed RAR-archive is now on axehandle's ftp (/upload/

UpNatom - 2-12-2004 at 13:16

I did some searching on the forum and according to antoncho (as of today) the hives absence is due to a hosting problem so I wouldn't pay much attention to the ominous sounding message.

enima - 2-12-2004 at 14:20

Welcome to the .WS Whois Server

Use of this service for any purpose other
than determining the availability of a domain
in the .WS TLD to be registered is strictly

Domain Name: RHODIUM.WS

Registrant: Rhodium

Domain created on 2001-07-08 22:20:38
Domain last updated on 2003-06-09 03:03:02

Name servers:

*Edited out by Polverone*
There you have it, the domains haven't been updated. *SITE REMOVED* which I assume either hosts the site or is the registrar.
[Edit: *EDITED AWAY BY POLVERONE* does seem to be hosting the site. AAA.BB.C.DDD is AAA.BB.C.EE is the *edited out*
they seem to own the entire AAA.BB.C.XXX subnet.]

Hopefully they will be up soon.
Is there anyway someone can place the .rar file on a server that is accessable by the public? I would like to make a web accessable mirror if all possible.


[Edited on 1-7-2005 by Polverone]

Thermal - 2-12-2004 at 16:18

Good to know. That was actually what I assumed at first but the message was/is kinda scary.

We'll see I suppose.
They did say the site could be down up to a month before it was shut down.

HRH_Prince_Charles - 2-12-2004 at 17:16

Mephisto has uploaded a pretty good mirror of rhodium. As well as including the pharmacology and links sections, it doesn't have the broken links that I used to find in the zip archive.

If the Hive doesn't come up for a while, hosting a forum on i2p might be a solution.

mophead - 4-12-2004 at 07:21

Originally posted by enima

Is there anyway someone can place the .rar file on a server that is accessable by the public? I would like to make a web accessable mirror if all possible.

If I had a copy of that .rar, i'd be happy to host it. PM me if you'd like.


Mephisto - 4-12-2004 at 09:21

mophead: PMed you. I hope you've got the necessary capacity for such a hosting.

mophead - 4-12-2004 at 11:17

I have a copy of rhodium as of 8/16/04 given to me by Mephisto.

It should be up sometime this weekend at

peace y'all.


anonymous01 - 4-12-2004 at 14:31

There is also a copy available at sasquotch.i2p
on the I2P net.
The site also contains a few books of interest.

mophead - 5-12-2004 at 08:27

There are a few missing files and dead links but that's to be expected. There are a few .pdf's that even webarchive does not have. If anyone has any of these following documents, please let me know.

chemistris - 5-12-2004 at 09:04

I have a number of those pdfs on my hard drive mophead.

I've tried to attach for now

Attachment: (642kB)
This file has been downloaded 1911 times

Ref: Rhodium's articles

solo - 5-12-2004 at 12:12

Here is one I converted from html to text to pdf ...some of the drawings got lost but all text is here.....solo

Attachment: Regioselectivity of the Wacker Oxidation of Propenylbenzenes.pdf (11kB)
This file has been downloaded 1834 times

Ref: Rhodium's articles

solo - 5-12-2004 at 12:32

Here is on other of those files needed fromthe rhodium's archive.....solo

Attachment: technical informationon hard get capsules.pdf (8kB)
This file has been downloaded 1641 times

site down time

runlabrun - 5-12-2004 at 13:42

Lithenal had reported for several days via banner and forum sticky that the hive would be down for several days to several weeks while they work out server issues.

This applies to both and

I dont know what "server issues" they were talking about but i assume either .ws dumped them or they are doing some major code work on the forum.

However... Lithenal assured all members that the hive and rhodium site data would be maintained and not lost in the process.

So its just a waiting game, the people at .ws have gotten the shits i presume with the people emailing in to ask about the domain according to the new message that appears when you attempt the original domains.

Waiting games suck.


bees without HIVE at

Organikum - 6-12-2004 at 02:31

Seems to be problems with *HOST REMOVED BY POLVERONE* though.

[Edited on 1-7-2005 by Polverone]


UpNatom - 6-12-2004 at 13:50

Some (all?) hyperlab pages are cached on googles servers. They can all be found using the search string hyperlab (I was going to post the URl but it won't display coorectly.)

How long does google store cached pages?

BromicAcid - 6-12-2004 at 13:52

Google stores cache's quite some time, one of my web pages that was forcibly removed is still found on a google search and it's been down for 3 months.

Most recent message

psychokitty - 7-12-2004 at 18:12

Visited once more today and this is what I got:

"Any services which used to be at this IP is relocating to another hosting provider. We have no further information. Please do not write us about it. Thanks!"

Doesn't sound so bad.

ah so!

Vitus_Verdegast - 8-12-2004 at 03:10

Let's hope they have it up and running again before the new year :D

Blind Angel - 8-12-2004 at 06:16

nice to know that some members of the-hive came here to wait!

is that a cool link

acx01b - 8-12-2004 at 10:20

is it a cool link ?

the nicest place to wait

Vitus_Verdegast - 9-12-2004 at 05:49

>>"nice to know that some members of the-hive came here to wait! "

This place is the next-best-thing when it comes to chemistry. One cannot seriously call that other place where all the stimulant forum tweakers now reside a 'chemistry forum' :P:D

trilobite - 9-12-2004 at 06:38

I disagree. The Hive has a different culture, but it certainly has it's sides. Think of the literature (article) collections and the numerous little-known synthetical methods people on that forum have unearthed during the years. There are often questions asked in scimad that have been answered and discussed well in the Hive, of which I can mention the ethyl iodide thread here where I gave a link to a method of MeI production with only MeOH/H2SO4/iodide salt. I like the board software too.

Myself, I'd prefer if the Hive was a bit more like scimad and there were less of the tweakers you mentioned. The two boards complement each other quite well.

HRH_Prince_Charles - 9-12-2004 at 10:24

I think VV was referring to 'the other place', not The Hive.

disagree with what?

Vitus_Verdegast - 9-12-2004 at 10:55

Maybe it is the language barrier, but I agree completely with what you've stated. Personally I'd like to see less tweakers on the Hive too (which is hard when you know they represent ~70% of the bee population), as we know they frequently tend to escape their confined territory and clutter the chemistry fora with mindless drivels.. ;)

Although these aforementioned tweakers have brought me many good laughs in the past, I especially love the Hive for it's other, dedicated 30%, for the huge archives of literature collections and experiments you've mentioned.

When I first came to Scimadness, I noticed immediately a difference in experimental approaches here, more particularly many things that would be rated 'dangerous' at the Hive :D such as pressurised, high temperature and gas-phase reactions being carried out at home using mcgyver'ed equipment. For example I had great pleasure when reading the posts on making alkali metals using thermite-type reactions, or when Polverone was sniffing HCN :) :D

Although you are right in stating that some of the questions asked repeatedly here have been discussed ad nauseum at the Hive, vice versa there is certainly some kind of crude but practical, 19th century approach which is often seen here and perhaps also at the Russian hyperlab that is very appealing to me and less frequently encountered at the hive, but which represents to me the true chemistry experimentalist's spirit.

HRH_Prince_Charles - 9-12-2004 at 11:41

Polverone huffing HCN is one thing but I'd be a little anxious if I thought the boy next door was making VX nerve agent in his shed.

Polverone - 9-12-2004 at 11:59

All things in moderation, right? I once posted my high-temperature alkali cyanide production procedure on the Hive, and was surprised to see it marked "dangerous." It did not involve production of any HCN, and unlike the procedure given on Rhodium's web page, it actually worked. I don't understand the metrics used to rate something dangerous. Procedures that call for LAH or BBr3 don't get marked dangerous, and it's easier to handle NaCN safely than either of those.

Maybe cyanides appear in so many murder mysteries that everyone knows they must be more dangerous than benzoyl peroxide or mercuric chloride.

Or maybe it was the high-temperature aspects that got it marked dangerous. For the most part Bees do seem wary of procedures that go hotter than 300 C or thereabouts.

Blind Angel - 9-12-2004 at 12:05

Originally posted by HRH_Prince_Charles
Polverone huffing HCN is one thing but I'd be a little anxious if I thought the boy next door was making VX nerve agent in his shed.

Maybe you should do a quick search and read some Samosa post ;)

I agree

Vitus_Verdegast - 9-12-2004 at 12:26

It's the same chemopanic one encounters everywhere. For example, at a certain European lab they make no fuss at all about alphabetically storing chemicals in the same closet, including bottles of sodium azide next to old bottles of various mercuric salts that were clearly sublimating out of the bottle and collecting outside at the bottom of the cap, nor do they make much fuss about handling these substances, but when I cautiously waved the fumes of an old 2% aq. NaCN bottle my way to check if I was able to smell the typical bitter almond odor (I am :)) they go ape on me. Any chemist should know if (s)he is able to smell HCN or not, if ever (s)he comes in an emergency situation, but of course they would not listen to reason.. :(

Although you make a good point, I think they assume it very hard for a tweeker to even safely order some LAH, while killing himself by making cyanides OTC is very well within the realm of possibilities. Maybe that could be why the process on Rh's doesn't work as presented? Although somehow I would doubt that myself..

Sociopath - 9-12-2004 at 14:16

Originally posted by Polverone
All things in moderation, right? I once posted my high-temperature alkali cyanide production procedure on the Hive, and was surprised to see it marked "dangerous." It did not involve production of any HCN, and unlike the procedure given on Rhodium's web page, it actually worked. I don't understand the metrics used to rate something dangerous. Procedures that call for LAH or BBr3 don't get marked dangerous, and it's easier to handle NaCN safely than either of those.

Maybe cyanides appear in so many murder mysteries that everyone knows they must be more dangerous than benzoyl peroxide or mercuric chloride.

Or maybe it was the high-temperature aspects that got it marked dangerous. For the most part Bees do seem wary of procedures that go hotter than 300 C or thereabouts.

I agree with your comments of rating at the hive. It is some real stupidity from time to time. There is of course useful information getting rated accordingly, but some posts that are pure crap are rated as excellent and some great posts are unrated or rated like in your case as dangerous. Does anyone care about the impurities police has found in ecstacy pills sized in Brittish Colombia? If so, search for rated as excellent posts in Serious Chemistry.

Chemistry-wise I find sciencemadness much more OTC oriented, not too much bullshit that a kitchen chemist can't reproduce. The simpler the better. In russian hyperlab there is some real oldschool chemistry to be found in its brilliant simplicity of the 19 century.

HRH_Prince_Charles - 9-12-2004 at 16:26

I'd rather converse with a Hive tweaker than most of the droids I deal with in daily life. Besides that, the Hive moderation creates a haven for free-thinking people. Overall, it is a good bunch of intelligent people: a mix of spods, misfits, wackos and boffins. I miss it.

trilobite - 10-12-2004 at 00:31

Yes, I made a mistake, so there's no disagreement!:)

acx01b - 10-12-2004 at 05:10

nobody saw my post ?

what happened to rhodium and thehive ?
there is the answer for rhodium:

thehive exists on web.archive but there is nearly nothing, only 0.1% of the site, and no posts

[Edited on 10-12-2004 by acx01b]

Organikum - 10-12-2004 at 05:49

The tweakers place Vitus is referring to is
Registration is necessary to access forums.

Its a good place for all who are mainly interested in producing a certain stimulant without fussing around with chemistry.
Its also the probably best place for information on the BIRCH on the net.
Its not a chemistry board.

Sergei_Eisenstein - 13-12-2004 at 11:59

Originally posted by Vitus_VerdegastAlthough you are right in stating that some of the questions asked repeatedly here have been discussed ad nauseum at the Hive, vice versa there is certainly some kind of crude but practical, 19th century approach which is often seen here and perhaps also at the Russian hyperlab that is very appealing to me and less frequently encountered at the hive, but which represents to me the true chemistry experimentalist's spirit.

We, Rrrrrrrussians, have a certain way of adding the necessary amount of drama in handling flasks and beakers.

Those tweakers indeed are quite something. And they all think they're going to win a Nobel prize with their newest GAKKinator xtraction pill HCI fluxing tube.

The Hive Needs YOU!

UpNatom - 14-12-2004 at 15:22

This update on the Hive situation was posted by antoncho on a few days ago:

Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 09:57:00 -0800 (PST)
Subject: update of current situation


I thought I'd write to you all, not only to create a nice, fuzzy community- face
feeling, but also to provide the same information for everybody at the same

First of all, when currently trying to access our site you May have seen the
error message displayed, which have been set up by our former web host. They
have explained that this was neccessary due to them being swamped by emails
asking about the site's whereabouts and because quite a lot of these emails
ended up in the mailboxes of people who shouldn't know that the site was even

Our current situation is that we have a well thought-out plan to get our server
back online, but, it is not yet possible to set the dates when we can put it
into practice.
It has come to my knowledge that several of our panicking members have made
offers to host the site. However well intended, these offers are not of interest
since that would mean going back to a lessened control of our server. What we do
need is donations to cover the hardware costs of a professional server. In
addition, donations would probably help speeding up the timeline as well.

Evidently, someone has put a mirror at this location, which is nice if it comes
to any use for those who need it:

Have you heard what phantastic rumours have begun flourishing around the world
becuse of our downtime? Here is one example:

- - -
From: brian (
Subject: Re: rhodium, rhodium, o wherefore art thou, rhodium?
Newsgroups: alt.drugs.chemistry
Date: 2004-11-30 09:06:43 PST

They're not coming back. The federal program initiated from within the DEA has
lost funding for this somewhat contoversial program. It was designed to keep
internet drugs manufacturing information in one place so as to monitor and
control it as much as possible.
Go to WorldLingo End of
Translation Translate text after this point
Some people felt that they were allowing too
much information to be passed along to users who's IP's couldn't be traced.
- - -

If anyone of you wishes to have all their incoming mail encrypted, don't forget
to send your PGP-key to my mailbox (something that is good to have anyhow,
should I ever need to send something of sensitive character).

Take care, everybody!
And enjoy your "holiday".

Version: PGP 7.0.4


And Antonchos follow-up post:

Briefly, about which it here writes FraktalFlauer (Rodiyevskaya girl friend, if che):

1. Everything in the order, but is unknown as soon.

2. Money necessary.

3. The archive of rhodium lies according to the reference cm. it is above.

Apropos of denekkk. If someone desires to help, on/a can write either straight Fraktal or to me (4 it will transmit:)).

So that this.... the very.... on the whole, here.


[Edited on 12-21-2004 by Polverone]

Blind Angel - 14-12-2004 at 15:33

This may be out of the admin mind, but maybe we could put a banner for a month or two somewhere on the site (not too evident though) with the some of the money going to The Hive Foundation (I do not encourage publicity on this website though, since it's perfect like it is, but it may not be a bad idea if it's only for a small amount of time)

The Hive needs COMPETENCE

Mephisto - 14-12-2004 at 17:08

What we do need is donations to cover the hardware costs of a professional server. In addition, donations would probably help speeding up the timeline as well.
The person who is hosting offered free web-hosting for the hive and Rhodium's site. This offer was delivered from me to Organikum, who delivered it to the hive admin Lilienthal. Till today nobody answered this offer, what is in my opinion not only irrational, but quite impolite.
This offer implied a traffic volume of max. 190 GB per month, so nobody can say this hosting would be unprofessional. A web-presence could be realized fast, probably within two days, even if this offer would be used only for a transitional period.
Further, in my opinion, this downtime is home-made by the incompetence of the decision-maker(s) of both sites.
Nevertheless I wish the best for the future for the hive and Rhodium's site.


chemoleo - 14-12-2004 at 17:23

Although I am not really a bee, I suspect it's a matter of who controls the information. Hosting it elsewhere would mean relenting some control, and the site owners probably don't want that.

Mephisto - 14-12-2004 at 22:29

If the alternative to this "risky" hosting is no web-presence, than that's a poor choice, IMHO. However, there's no rational reason, why someone who is already hosting some projects, should manipulate one of the sites, he's hosting. Just to make hoax and ruin his reputation? Further, the link between the hive/rhodium domain and the hosting-server could be cut immediately in such cases.

Polverone - 14-12-2004 at 23:11

Yes, but letting it be hosted on another machine means that someone could copy the forum database, read private messages, monitor all visitor traffic, try to break people's passwords and use them on email accounts, etc. Of course this is always the case unless the machine is physically secured under the watchful eye of the site operator. I wouldn't accept a random offer of hosting for this site either unless it was from somebody I had already known for some time.

Still, the fund-driving request for a new server strikes me as a bit odd. The hosting costs for a site as busy as the Hive must be pretty substantial. How are they paying for that, and why can't the same money be used to buy computer hardware? Adequate server hardware is almost certainly going to be cheaper than a year of service. There seem to be enough computer enthusiasts among the Hive powers-that-be that at least one of them should already have enough spare parts lying around to build a beefy web server and (if necessary) separate database server to support the web server.

Mephisto - 15-12-2004 at 04:10

This password argument is a good point. It depends, whether the passwords are saved as plain text or if something like the crypt method is used (in which the user-passwords aren't saved, but rather a hash of them).

As said, those disadvantages exist in the same manner, if a firm hosts the site. Thinking, that those employers won't fail, because they are paid for the hosting is a misbelief.

HRH_Prince_Charles - 15-12-2004 at 06:00

I suspect that is why The Hive is taking so long to find a host. It can't just be any host.

Ref. Value of forum Archives

solo - 15-12-2004 at 11:57

If one had to put on a price for the contents of the Hive and Rhodium's complete with all the pdf's indexed what would that price be......I think that over time one can see the monitary value of this valuable asset now think of the value of the science madness forum content along with the associated ftp......

Now that the Hive has been put on hold one sees the value of such forums and how fortunate we are to be part of it.......solo

greetings kamrad Eisenstein!

Vitus_Verdegast - 16-12-2004 at 05:41


We, Rrrrrrrussians, have a certain way of adding the necessary amount of drama in handling flasks and beakers.

Seeing Dennis_Pro succesfully decarboxylating tryptophan in a FBF on his stove, this can only be possible after making a pact with the devil. He's the Rachmaninov of hyperlab.. :D

Rhodium mirror

Chemcraze - 16-12-2004 at 09:06

I've found this rhodium mirror:
Rhodium mirror

freedom of information

Organikum - 17-12-2004 at 06:43

All this security brimborium of the-hive staff and antoncho posting all admins e-mail addresses which are otherwise top-secret openly on some drug-forum! :D Oh, my god!

Actually I dont want ANYBODY to control the information of the-hive, this control psychosis is one of the reasons for this information gone and it will get repeated as history repeats itself when not learned from it.

I WANT the-hive in the wayback machine, I want the information mirrored all over the net!
Thats what freedom of information is all about, isnt it?

The offer which came over mephisto was a serious one I am fucking sure, my question is now:
How to wind the information, our information which it is, how to wind this information out of the hands of those who dare to patronize us all?

question my be regarded partially solved/hypothetical :P (dont ask)


Rhodium bee's some hope

solo - 26-12-2004 at 07:09

Recently posted at WD

Starting Dreamer
Posted - Dec 26 2004 :  06:56:08 AM      

As the kids of today get greedier every year, Santa couldn't fit any server in his reindeer-powered transportational vehicle, so we're currently at the North Pole trying to negotiate a second delivery round.

It's cold where we are (being at the North Pole and all), but we're thinking about you all and hope you've had a wonderful Christmas celebration with your loved ones.

with love, Fractalflower and Rhodium

Mods editing posts

UpNatom - 27-12-2004 at 13:55


All this security brimborium of the-hive staff and antoncho posting all admins e-mail addresses which are otherwise top-secret openly on some drug-forum

In an email that was apparently reaching out to hive members and appreciators to donate to help speed the return of the site, don't you think maybe those email addresses were included deliberately as a means for people who don't have the hive mods addresses to get in touch/donate.

I have no idea if that is the case or not but it seems feasible at least. It is the reason I chose not to remove them when I originally cut and pasted the message to here.

I bring this up so late after the original post because I have only just become aware that others on another...chemistry[ahem!] board were getting rather opinionated about this matter, demanding the removal of the email addresses [Edit:] from this site and on checking back on the earlier parts of the thread I find they have in fact been removed from my post. Are the mods of wetdreams also moderating sciencemadness too now?

I sincerely hope someone made a point of contacting Antoncho to see if removing the email addresses was in keeping with his intentions.
Antoncho has not removed them from his original post.

[Edited on 27-12-2004 by UpNatom]

it was me

Organikum - 28-12-2004 at 03:52

Antoncho posted the e-mail addresses NOT intentional.
the-hive staff has a strict rule against this it was said.

I was asked by a quite pissed moderator of the-hive if I could do anything to get the addresses removed here, I contacted Polverone and for this certain moderator is a nice and helpful person his wish was fulfilled as it seems.

I am very sure that moderators here and at wetdreams are not identical.

There is absolute no reason to get angry as I believe, yes?


UpNatom - 29-12-2004 at 11:23


I don't understand why you're so out of sorts about this
There is no need to get angry as I believe, yes?

Well I'm not really (is it the bold text perhaps? That was to highlight the edit rather than denote anger.)
I was just standing up for the integrity of the information, I thought it was supposed to be that way. I was completely unaware others were going ballistic about it. A u2u would have been quite appropriate in this case....however it is done.

I sincerely hope it doesn't impact negatively on any hive staff. I would certainly not want that.

If_6_was_9 - 31-12-2004 at 17:44

The hive will never be what it used to be because of threads like this

Here's a picture of Vitus the terrorist. Police come and arrest him.

If_6_was_9 - 31-12-2004 at 17:48

Another thing I want all of you to know is that I reported threads like this to the FBI, the CIA, the Swedish Embassy (the server was in Sweden) in Washington DC, and the ISP that hosts the hive. Yes that's right. I did it.

JohnWW - 31-12-2004 at 17:59

Originally posted by If_6_was_9:
Another thing I want all of you to know is that I reported threads like this to the FBI, the CIA, the Swedish Embassy (the server was in Sweden) in Washington DC, and the ISP that hosts the hive. Yes that's right. I did it.

You interfering "do-gooder"! You should have kept out of things that do not concern you. You are now "blacklisted" across the entire internet. Or are you, in fact, a CIA or FBI agent?

Ref: If_6_was_9 comments.....Ref:

solo - 31-12-2004 at 19:05

If_6_was_9......and if you were a man , then you would see how much of a fool you are. Do you believe in the bull the gov dishes out and as a good boy scout you are doing your are nothing but a poor blind sheep.....solo

neutrino - 31-12-2004 at 20:12

Maybe you're fools for believing this guy…

Sam I am

Icarus - 1-1-2005 at 01:43

Organikum - 1-1-2005 at 04:34

The-hive will never be again what it was because now Polythene_Sam will be banned for life I suppose and with right I want to say.
Thats a pity somehow.

Sam, someday you will go out and shoot somebody who looks like a arab and then you will wind up in jail or - because of your families influence - in a mental institution. You are obviously suffering from an open psychosis - get some fucking professional help!


vulture - 1-1-2005 at 09:52


Another thing I want all of you to know is that I reported threads like this to the FBI, the CIA, the Swedish Embassy (the server was in Sweden) in Washington DC, and the ISP that hosts the hive. Yes that's right. I did it.

If you really did this, then you are pathetic. If you can't see the difference between a joke and serious intentions, there's no hope for you.

More importantly, some people are going to be fucking pissed off at you. So pissed off they might do something stupid and start an internet smear campaign.

So, when are you going to report us for the whimsey section? Hmm? Get a life.

On the other hand, somebody at the swedish embassy probably pissed their pants while laughing their ass off at your pathetic email.

[Edited on 1-1-2005 by vulture]

Organikum - 1-1-2005 at 10:13

But somebody at *HOST REMOVED BY POLVERONE* might have realized what they are hosting and thrown the-hive out. So we know who is to blame for the-hive being down and who is liable to do this to other boards in the next future.

Gladly it is not hard to track down Sam´s real name and publishing his "collected works" (drugs and politics) might be a not so bad idea then. "Smear campaign" is such a ugly word for this.....
I feel tempted, I admit, but I wont do it. But my tolerance is stressed to the utmost limit now I have to add.


[Edited on 1-7-2005 by Polverone]

trilobite - 1-1-2005 at 14:06

Some time ago the web site of the Chechen rebels, , got closed pretty much because the Finnish authorities didn't like the fact that someone in Finland hosted a site so strongly politically opposed to the Russia. There was nothing illegal on that website, but it didn't take a court order to close it -- only self-censorship which is the typical way stuff like that is dealt with in that country. I think it was the secret service SUPO calling the person who hosted the site, who then decided he didn't want the pressure and publicity.

After that the site opened up again in Sweden where the Swedish secret service SÄPO reviewed the contents of the site and decided they should do nothing about it as there was nothing illegal. After that it has been hosted there, as it is of now. Traceroute it if you want.

So Sam, your call to the Swedish embassy is most likely as good as nothing because they actually have freedom of speech over there, which you seem to oppose. I'm sure you would have made a good East-German citizen, keeping an eye open at those citizens who are unpatrio... I mean enemies of the revolution, and then telling STASI about it. That's pretty much the way people were controlled in Eastern block countries, you know.

Edit: One more thing: this is why you telling about your call to the embassy made me laugh out loud!

[Edited on 1-1-2005 by trilobite]

vulture - 1-1-2005 at 14:30

I think If_6_was_9 envied a job at NSA or CIA, got depressed when rejected, then tried his luck at the TIPS program which was shutdown and now he's stuck reporting websites to the government and copy pasting gibberish into forums.
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