Sciencemadness Discussion Board - depleted uranium

depleted uranium

merrlin - 28-8-2009 at 12:45

Does anybody know of a seller of depleted uranium (as oxide or metal), other than United Nuclear?

kclo4 - 28-8-2009 at 12:50

If you are interested, you can get uranium ore off of ebay. This would be a huge pain though to refine it, but I can't find any other uranium source.

Ozonelabs - 28-8-2009 at 13:10

Should you wish to purchase a Uranium Salt, we have Uranium Nitrate available.

Feel free to contact us here, or to contact our Head of Organic Chemistry, Mike, at mike.ozonelabs@googlemail.com.

Regards,

The Ozonelabs Team

JohnWW - 28-8-2009 at 13:58

Would that be, in fact, uranyl(VI) nitrate, UO2(NO3)2 ?

BTW uranium ore (pitchblende and uraninite, chiefly), in which the U-238 has about half decayed in Earth's geological history of 4.6 x 10^9 years, and in which almost all the U-235, U-233, and Pu-244 has decayed although leaving small amounts, would be full of resulting chemical impurities and potentially dangerous radioactive decay products, particularly alpha-emitters like Po-210, along with the likes of Ra-226 and gaseous Rn-222. Unless you are very well-equipped to avoid radioactive contamination, it would be probably too dangerous for an amateur to try to refine the stuff. About 100 years ago, the pioneering Curies both died of radiation-induced cancers resulting from their refining pitchblende to isolate the highly radioactive radium and polonium.

merrlin - 28-8-2009 at 14:45

SPI Supplies (http://www.2spi.com/catalog/chem/depleted-uranium-products.h...) carries a number of uranium compounds, but not uranyl sulfate or uranium sulfate. On their page concerning depleted uranium they had the following:

"Historically, the enrichment process has produced more DU than is being used. Consequently, the Department of Energy has produced a large stockpile of material, estimated at 300,000 to 500,000 metric tons, in the form of uranium hexafluoride (UF6). This waste by-product of the enrichment process becomes the basic raw material in the production of DU metal, which is readily available and inexpensive."

Members here have provided me with information reqarding uranium compound preparation, so if depleted uranium really is "readily available and inexpensive" it would be worthwhile preparing the salts myself. I have contacted SPI Supplies to see if they can provide a source for DU metal. The metal would also be useful as a soluble anode. I have purchased from United Nuclear, but I do not think $9/gr qualifies as inexpensive.

entropy51 - 28-8-2009 at 15:06

Quote: Originally posted by JohnWW

About 100 years ago, the pioneering Curies both died of radiation-induced cancers resulting from their refining pitchblende to isolate the highly radioactive radium and polonium.

No, Pierre Curie was killed when run down by a horse drawn wagon on the street.

Marie Curie died of aplastic anemia at age 66 (not exactly premature death) which may have been caused by exposure to strong (curie quantities) of radium, polonium etc. Marie was notoriously sloppy in her handling of highly radioactive sources (her cookbooks at home were found to be highly contaminated with radioactivity from her hands!)

The danger to anyone playing with gram quantities of natural uranium is negligible, as long as you don't eat the stuff. Gram quantities of uranium will not contain hazardous amounts of daughters such as Po. The major toxicity of uranium is chemical toxicity to the kidneys, not radiation injury. The electron microscopy group that worked for me used uranyl salts on a daily basis with no precautions beyond hoods, gloves and lab coats, all approved by the institutional radiation safety officer.

[Edited on 28-8-2009 by entropy51]

[Edited on 28-8-2009 by entropy51]

Ozonelabs - 28-8-2009 at 15:13

Yes, UO2(NO3)2.

Apologies for the lack of clarity.

zed - 28-8-2009 at 21:05

Depends on what you want it for. If DU alloys will suffice, it might be possible to attain such material from surplus ammo. Though availability here in the U.S. could be very limited.

If you happen to be living in Iraq, on the other hand, availability could be quite good. Just take a shovel, a rake, and some screens, and sift some soil from an area that has been subjected to a recent aerial assault.

The soil could be full of DU bullets, and bullet fragments.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/du....

[Edited on 29-8-2009 by zed]

kclo4 - 28-8-2009 at 21:44

Aren't the DU bullets huge and ignite on impact? doesn't seem like you'd be able to find fragments of one to me.

zed - 29-8-2009 at 00:37

Follow the link, and read the material. It would appear that DU projectiles, may disintegrate and ignite, if they strike something very hard.

They have the ability to pierce through a tank's armor plating, then disintegrate and ignite inside of the tanks interior. Must be very unpleasant, for the folks inside the tank.

On the other hand, the material in the link, suggests that if a DU projectile doesn't strike a really hard surface, it may just bury itself in the soil, and remain relatively intact.

[Edited on 29-8-2009 by zed]

Bobross - 30-8-2009 at 02:59

Quote: Originally posted by zed

If you happen to be living in Iraq, on the other hand, availability could be quite good. Just take a shovel, a rake, and some screens, and sift some soil from an area that has been subjected to a recent aerial assault.

The soil could be full of DU bullets, and bullet fragments.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/du....

[Edited on 29-8-2009 by zed]

And cluster bomblets....

[Edited on 30-8-2009 by Jhonbus]

zed - 30-8-2009 at 13:19

Such is life. The denizens of many war torn areas, take big chances. Some, salvage unexploded bombs for scrap metal.

I would imagine scavenged DU projectiles, would command a lot better scrap price, than mere ferrous metal.

Why, with a little ingenuity, such folks could cut out the middlemen, and sell their salvaged DU, directly to you.

psychokinetic - 30-8-2009 at 23:03

Quote: Originally posted by merrlin

Does anybody know of a seller of depleted uranium (as oxide or metal), other than United Nuclear?

Other than United Nuclear? I actually found this forum via an article about them, why can't/won't you go to them might I ask?

JohnWW - 31-8-2009 at 02:35

Quote: Originally posted by merrlin

Does anybody know of a seller of depleted uranium (as oxide or metal), other than United Nuclear?

If you are interested in obtainng U metal from its compounds, this patent may be of use:
Method for converting uranium oxides to uranium metal:
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/4717420/description.html

JohnWW - 31-8-2009 at 02:49

Quote: Originally posted by zed

If you happen to be living in Iraq, on the other hand, availability could be quite good. Just take a shovel, a rake, and some screens, and sift some soil from an area that has been subjected to a recent aerial assault.
The soil could be full of DU bullets, and bullet fragments.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/du....

Uranium, and even more so many of its simpler binary compounds and alloys, including lower oxides, sulfide, selenide, telluride, carbide, nitride, hydride, boride, silicide, phosphide, arsenide, and germanide, are ferromagnetic, due to the several unpaired 5f electrons. (Plutonium is even more strongly ferromagnetic). So you may be able to recover DU bullets and fragments (especially partly oxidized ones) by driving over former battlefields in Iraq in a truck on which is mounted a powerful electromagnet, similar to magnet trucks used on roads to pick up nails. However, this would also pick up any pieces of steel and other ferromagnetic metals and alloys left behind as discarded military hardware.

merrlin - 31-8-2009 at 12:52

Quote: Originally posted by psychokinetic

Quote: Originally posted by merrlin

Does anybody know of a seller of depleted uranium (as oxide or metal), other than United Nuclear?

Other than United Nuclear? I actually found this forum via an article about them, why can't/won't you go to them might I ask?

As previously disclosed, I have purchased depleted uranium from United Nuclear, although I have not yet had it analyzed. Apart from the cost, I thought that it might be a good idea to find a second source after learning a little bit about United Nuclear from Wikipedia. I have only seen small amounts for sale and the equivalent price per pound is around $4,000. This seems a bit odd in view of the potential for salvage discussed by others here.

psychokinetic - 31-8-2009 at 17:26

I see. Sorry, I should read more thoroughly

Good point, if it's so salvageable you'd think you could pick it up almost anywhere!