John paul III - 26-5-2019 at 15:48
I've heard of many solvents being discovered as appropriate for the alcohol catalyzed sodium production, but was there ever an alternative found to
dioxane for the separation of thermochemically produced sodium?
j_sum1 - 26-5-2019 at 16:03
Not as far as I am aware. Dioxane seems to just hit the sweet spot.
(Which is a real shame because my dioxane drying and purification abilities suck. My yield is embarrasingly low and the amount of polymeric gunk I
have produced is ridiculous.)
[Edited on 27-5-2019 by j_sum1]
John paul III - 27-5-2019 at 10:07
I wonder if tetrahydrofuran would work for potassium. It has a very similiar structure to dioxane, and way lower toxicity. lt's lower boiling point
would unfortunately make it unsuitable for sodium.
John paul III - 27-5-2019 at 10:32
I noticed Potassium/THF and Sodium/dioxane have the same difference between metal melting point and solvent boiling point. I wonder if this proximity
could have a favorable effect on surface energy change
[Edited on 27-5-2019 by John paul III]
clearly_not_atara - 27-5-2019 at 16:52
Time might be better spent improving the synthesis protocol for dioxane. I always assumed that its affinity for Mg2+ cations was important here.
I don’t think potassium is a reasonable replacement for sodium. Not only is it dangerous to handle, but I regularly hear people complain about not
being able to afford ordinary potassium salts in quantity, much less the hydroxide.
UC235 - 27-5-2019 at 19:35
I've not found dioxane too hard to make. Buy concentrated walmart brand antifreeze, add sulfuric acid, and distill until it starts getting black and
foamy. Yes, there is a ton of dark garbage and polymer that drops out, but everything's pretty cheap.
Potassium hydroxide is only modestly more expensive than NaOH. You just can't buy it at the hardware store. Fortunately soapmaking and biodiesel
supply websites both stock it in bulk.
DavidJR - 28-5-2019 at 03:11
Also, consider using fractional freezing as part of the purification process for dioxane.
draculic acid69 - 30-5-2019 at 14:28
Already asked that question https://www.sciencemadness.org/whisper/viewthread.php?tid=14...
But it's good to see at least here one is moving the conversation forward.
draculic acid69 - 30-5-2019 at 17:48
Im still thinking that chelating agents like diglyme or triglyme might be an alternative.where thf was suggested above as useful for K but not sodium
one might trytetrahydropyran instead of thf or higher alkylated cyclic ethers.
[Edited on 31-5-2019 by draculic acid69]
clearly_not_atara - 30-5-2019 at 19:32
There is no reason to prefer diglyme to dioxane: it’s harder to make, more expensive, harder to remove and just as carcinogenic.
draculic acid69 - 31-5-2019 at 03:56
Not sure diglyme even works it. Was just a suggestion.nothing so far has been proven to work apart from dioxane.whole point is to discover what works
and what doesnt.,figure out alternatives and understand the mechanism and process of how it all works.