Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Anthranilic Acid

Triflic Acid - 5-11-2020 at 17:50

Making anthranilic acid is a long process starting from diethylhexyl phthalate. At my local Home Depot, they sell methyl anthranilate as a bird repellent, and I can find it off ebay too. A simple saponification makes the anthranilic acid. Also, I don't plan on doing anything illegal if I do try to get anthranilic acid.

Texium - 5-11-2020 at 21:35

This is a statement.

Triflic Acid - 6-11-2020 at 09:46

@ Texium What do you mean?

stoichiometric_steve - 6-11-2020 at 10:15

I think he means (in a polite way) that you could as well have kept that to yourself since nobody gives a shit

Texium - 6-11-2020 at 10:19

No need to be rude, Steve.

What I meant was that you didn’t ask any sort of question in your post, although it seems like maybe there is one hiding in there. If so, please be direct about it rather than making us guess what you’re wanting to hear. If not, well, Steve is not entirely wrong.

Triflic Acid - 6-11-2020 at 12:07

Maybe I should reword. Is there a reason that I didn't find anything about getting anthranilic acid this way on SS? Or is it just my bad searching skills?

arkoma - 6-11-2020 at 15:55

best UTFSE here is site:sciencemadness.org <search term> in a google search bar. on-site search sucks rocks.

unionised - 6-11-2020 at 16:08

Quote: Originally posted by Texium (zts16)  
This is a statement.

Is this a rhetorical question?

Texium - 6-11-2020 at 16:11

I would expect the saponification to work just fine. I think the reason that it isn't typically employed is because these bird repellant products are expensive and are not pure methyl anthranilate. I don't know if it's the same product that you have seen, but the "Bird Stop" that I saw on Home Depot's website is a whopping $90 per gallon, and only contains 26% methyl anthranilate. Who knows what else is the balance.

The synthesis from phthalic anhydride is dependable, cheap, and fun if you can obtain phthalic anhydride directly rather than using gloves. The other reagents required, urea, sodium hydroxide, and hypochlorite, are also readily available and inexpensive. All of the reagents, as well as the intermediate phthalimide, are useful for many things in organic synthesis, so the synthesis is extremely worthwhile.

Triflic Acid - 6-11-2020 at 22:14

@ Texium I was looking at Bird Stop too. Buying it in bulk might make it economical. On another note, ebay sells methyl anthranilate: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p23862...
But at the end of the day, I think the phalate route is best.

Cou - 6-11-2020 at 22:33

Quote: Originally posted by Texium (zts16)  
No need to be rude, Steve.

What I meant was that you didn’t ask any sort of question in your post, although it seems like maybe there is one hiding in there. If so, please be direct about it rather than making us guess what you’re wanting to hear. If not, well, Steve is not entirely wrong.


Well, I give a shit. I was pleasantly surprised to find out that Home Depot sells methyl anthranilate. Steve was being rude.

karlos³ - 7-11-2020 at 00:01

I never knew that stuff is used as bird repellant?
If the smell of grapes repels birds, then how comes that they still plunder the majority of grapes until they got ripe? :o
Maybe the birds it repels are a different kind than those stealing all the grapes, or what...?

Tsjerk - 7-11-2020 at 12:31

Apperantly methyl anthranilate binds pain receptors in the avian trigeminal nerve.

Something similar happens with capsaicin, birds are not effected by it while mammals are. This aids in the dispersal of the pepper seeds, as birds won't damage the seeds by chewing on them while for example mammals would.



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karlos³ - 7-11-2020 at 13:17

My apologies for being lazy and not searching that out myself, and thank you very much Tsjerk.

mackolol - 7-11-2020 at 13:33

Quote: Originally posted by karlos³  
I never knew that stuff is used as bird repellant?
If the smell of grapes repels birds, then how comes that they still plunder the majority of grapes until they got ripe? :o
Maybe the birds it repels are a different kind than those stealing all the grapes, or what...?


Methyl anthranilate acts as an insect repellent too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insect_repellent

I doubt that it is very effective, but I didn't try it myself so maybe I'm wrong.