Sciencemadness Discussion Board - Pthtalic acid OTC

Pthtalic acid OTC

Random - 10-4-2011 at 01:33

I saw on some threads that phtalic acid can be obtained by saponification of ester whihc is in vinyl gloves. I Tried to find those gloves, but I can only find white latex gloves everywhere.

Now, is there some other PVC product that has a lot of that ester, maybe PVC wire isolation or something else?

Megamarko94 - 10-4-2011 at 04:00

you saw it on nurdrage's channel
and i don't know where you can find something like that.
I probably wont be able to find them either

ItalianChemist - 10-4-2011 at 05:12

I obtained pthalic acid from hydrolisys of pthalic anhydride!
I put some phtalic anhydride in a few ml of water and I refluxed the mixture until the phtalic anhydride disappeared. Then I cold the solution in an ice bath and the pthalic acid precipitated.
I think that with other PVC materials the extraction and basic hydrolisys doesn't work, because diethylexylphtalate is used in gloes to make them more soft!

Magpie - 10-4-2011 at 12:04

Quote: Originally posted by Random

Now, is there some other PVC product that has a lot of that ester, maybe PVC wire isolation or something else?

PVC shower curtain.

Also see:

http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=6573&a...

hkparker - 10-4-2011 at 12:48

Shower curtains can be really inefficient to extract from. See UnintentionalChaos's youtube video about it.

Part 1, 2 and 3:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cooRCFa3J3s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qESSbS2EM-I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlf4kbs0y7Q

Magpie - 10-4-2011 at 14:06

Quote: Originally posted by hkparker

Shower curtains can be really inefficient to extract from.

I have to agree. I checked my notebook and see that the yield was terrible.

--------

I watched the U-tube videos: wonderful! But I don't remember a yield of PA being stated - did I miss it?

[Edited on 10-4-2011 by Magpie]

redox - 10-4-2011 at 16:49

Well, it might be possible (if you had the time, money, apparatus, etc) to oxidize o-xylene to phthalic acid, no?

Mixed isomer xylene can be had at any well-stocked hardware store (Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace)

Just a suggestion, however inconvenient.

[Edited on 11-4-2011 by redox]

hkparker - 10-4-2011 at 16:55

Quote: Originally posted by Magpie

I don't remember a yield of PA being stated - did I miss it?
[Edited on 10-4-2011 by Magpie]

I don't think it was stated, but this was adressed because he doesn't know for sure what fatty alcohol groups were attached the the phtalate group, so yield cannot be calculated. When he titrates to find out what fatty alcohol group it was then I bet we'll hear what the yeild was.

jamit - 10-4-2011 at 21:52

Where do you get PVC gloves? Does it have to say PVC or can it be any vinyl gloves? thanks.

kuro96inlaila - 10-4-2011 at 22:00

Is there a way to get phthalic acid from potassium hydrogen phthalate?

Potassium hydrogen phthalate is easier to get than phthalic acid (well,some people may having these problem.).

ItalianChemist - 12-4-2011 at 02:48

Quote: Originally posted by kuro96inlaila

Is there a way to get phthalic acid from potassium hydrogen phthalate?

Potassium hydrogen phthalate is easier to get than phthalic acid (well,some people may having these problem.).

It's very simple, you have to add some concentrated HCl to a solution of potassium hydrogen pthalate and then pthalic acid crystallize out!

kuro96inlaila - 12-4-2011 at 06:28

I never expect it to be so simple!

Thanks ItalianChemist!

ItalianChemist - 12-4-2011 at 08:33

Quote: Originally posted by kuro96inlaila

I never expect it to be so simple!

Thanks ItalianChemist!

If you want I can try and take some photographs!

EDIT:
Ok, I've just tried!
I used:
-Phtalic acid(made from pure pthalic anhydride and water)
-Potassium hydroxide
-Bromotymol blue
-Sulphuric acid 95%

I neutralized te phtalic acid with a concentrate solution of potassium hydroxide, I add a drop of bromotymol blue to take the pH acid.

Then I filtered the solution to remove unreacted pthalic acid and I add 5ml of concentrated sulphuric acid, The pthalic acid cristallized out!

[Edited on 12-4-2011 by ItalianChemist]

[Edited on 12-4-2011 by ItalianChemist]