Sciencemadness Discussion Board

Cold fusion.

antimon - 4-11-2015 at 08:11

Hi, have anybody ever tried to make a cold fusion reactor?

I read about the Patterson power cell, and i came to "discover" cold fusion. It is electrochemistry, and also some nuclear physics (maybe).

hissingnoise - 4-11-2015 at 09:34

Pons and Fleischmann prefer the term "table-top fusion" and eschew oxymoronic phrasing . . .

antimon - 4-11-2015 at 13:24

Ok, i know that Fleichmann regret he called the reaction Cold fusion. If he hadnt done that he thought that it would have turned out for the better.

One thing i have thought about is how the power is "extracted"? How do you charge for example, a battery with it?

Thanks.

zed - 4-11-2015 at 13:48

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-h-bailey/post_10010_b_80...

F. and Pons, caught a lot of crap for their work, and the results weren't very reproducible. Still, they discovered something, or possibly a whole bunch of things. An Army physicist mentioned the work to me, a while back. "Well, something is going on."

He didn't say LENR. But, I've read that LENR has been confirmed. Maybe.

I left a link to a recent article, at the top. The details to some experiments may be sketchy. If there is a possible big payday out there, you can bet that a lot of people are being very careful about concealing their hole-cards.





[Edited on 4-11-2015 by zed]

solo - 4-11-2015 at 14:07

....there was a thread on this , perhaps it can be merged...solo

https://www.sciencemadness.org/whisper/viewthread.php?tid=60...

careysub - 4-11-2015 at 15:26

Quote: Originally posted by zed  


He didn't say LENR. But, I've read that LENR has been confirmed. Maybe.

I left a link to a recent article, at the top. The details to some experiments may be sketchy. If there is a possible big payday out there, you can bet that a lot of people are being very careful about concealing their hole-cards.


No, LENR remains unconfirmed after 25 years.

Amusingly, the idea you mention "you can bet that a lot of people are being very careful about concealing their hole-cards" is being used by the current leader of the - let me be blunt here - huckster pack, Andrea Rossi to orchestrate staged "tests". He denies any inspection of the device being "tested" and the "tests" are conducted according to his ground rules and under his control.

You see, it is of such great, great commercial value that it must remain a strict trade secret and no one can do a full examination of the test set-up, or conduct the test in any manner other than one Rossi prescribes.

The problem with this is that is trivial to cheat under these conditions, making the conclusions of observers quite useless.

There is a rich history of magicians hoodwinking scientists who are a) not familiar with what can be accomplished with simple deceptions, and b) accustomed to assume that every one is honest and c) have no experience with combatting deliberate deception.

The Uri Geller hoax at Stanford Research Institute in 1974 is famous (ironically the representatives of SRI were taken in by Rossi in the 2013 demonstration as well).

The nature of the 2013 Rossi demo is very similar to another famous energy hoax - the Keely Motor Hoax:
http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/museum/keely/keely.htm

Until someone is able to find excess energy coming out of a device consistently that is *not under the control* of the 'inventor' all this work can be relegated to "experimental error" at best.

Indeed detections of nuclear reaction products are generally always at "threshold of detection" level, consistent with them not being real, but simply being measurement anomalies. Again there is a rich literature of legitimate scientists making false discoveries based in such threshold measurements (for example Adriaan van Maanen's false measurements of galactic rotation, and Peter van de Kamp's false discovery of exoplanets).

One notable feature of all this work is the fact that the experimenters who are not obvious charlatans like Rossi admit that these claims are consistently inconsistent - no reproducible demonstration of any of these claimed phenomena exists. A common assertion is that different batches of palladium have different behavior in an unpredictable way.

This focuses the attention on why no one has ever been able to develop a procedure for preparing palladium that gives consistent behavior. Powerful tools exist to purify, measure composition, and characterize structure at the atomic level - if any of this was real someone should be able to show how to prepare samples that have the same behavior.

Even the alchemists, who understood nothing really about the processes they were manipulating could get consistent results.

[Edited on 4-11-2015 by careysub]

[Edited on 5-11-2015 by careysub]

aga - 4-11-2015 at 15:34

Sigh.

So you humans need us Lizards to do it for you Again ?

Pick up the Pace, please.

zed - 5-11-2015 at 12:47

Not Insects?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffmcmahon/2013/02/22/nasa-a-nu...

Varmint - 5-11-2015 at 15:22

I know how to get Rossi fixed up, tell a sizeable group of climate "scientists" he needs their help in making his "invention" settled science.

As long as he has "grant" money for them, they'll sell any story he wishes to tell.

careysub - 5-11-2015 at 16:29

Quote: Originally posted by Varmint  
I know how to get Rossi fixed up, tell a sizeable group of climate "scientists" he needs their help in making his "invention" settled science.

As long as he has "grant" money for them, they'll sell any story he wishes to tell.


Hoping to get a check from Exxon?

hissingnoise - 6-11-2015 at 02:54

Quote:
I know how to get Rossi fixed up, tell a sizeable group of climate "scientists" he needs their help in making his "invention" settled science.

Wow, how fucking stupid is that?

And on a science-oriented website!!!

Fulmen - 6-11-2015 at 04:38

Agreed, you can shove your "scepticism" where the sun don't shine.

Varmint - 6-11-2015 at 18:25

Sorry to crush your religion guys, but global warming is a hoax.

The trouble with this is, you'll see the perpetrators hauled off to prison for their crimes against humanity, but your religious belief is so strong you still won't understand how thoroughly you've been indoctrinated.

Pyrovus - 6-11-2015 at 19:15

Yep, there's a global conspiracy by the world's thermometer makers to trick anybody who experiments with carbon dioxide to make them think it traps heat. It goes all the way back to Galileo's first thermometer, which was specially rigged to show higher temperatures in the presence of carbon dioxide, which the lizard people controlling the Catholic Church forced him to do in exchange for them not burning him alive for heresy. Since then, the conspiracy has deepened further, with the IR spectrometer makers now firmly under control of the lizards, whose machines now insert fake absorption lines in the carbon dioxide spectrum to make people think it's really good at absorbing infrared radiation when in reality it is completely transparent to infrared. And don't forget all the physicists, who made up fake wave equations so that people would falsely calculate that carbon dioxide has vibrational modes that correspond to the infrared region of the spectrum. In fact, all science is in the service of the lizard people's sinister agenda - every single area of science is warped by the need of the conspirators to create the false impression that carbon dioxide traps heat, and as such we must throw out all science as it is clearly just all lies that our lizard overlords want us to believe.

[Edited on 7-11-2015 by Pyrovus]

hissingnoise - 7-11-2015 at 05:00
Quote:

Sorry to crush your religion guys, but global warming is a hoax.


Sorry to crush your sensibilities Varmint, but that kind of stupidity is totally out of place here!

Varmint - 7-11-2015 at 08:17

No need to chant your religious passages guys, you will find out soon enough you've been duped. The only question is: Will you have the brain-power to recognize it, or will you call for the heads of those who exposed the lie?

Actually, that's a rhetorical question. Once indoctrinated, it's nearly impossible for those who have embraced themselves as the evil destroying their own planet to recognize the truth.

I'd wish you all the best, but you won't accept that, your new religion teaches you that you deserve nothing but angst over your horrible self-centered mistreatment of the planet.

Fulmen - 7-11-2015 at 09:00

Could you please piss off, we're trying to discuss some real (at least more real than your bullshit) science here. I don't give a flying fuck about your crusade against climate science, and it's not the topic of this thread either.

mayko - 7-11-2015 at 09:02

why won't you answer my questions Varmint?

Varmint - 7-11-2015 at 09:08

Because you are a moron, mayko.

(Your link is broken)

aga - 7-11-2015 at 09:08

Quote: Originally posted by Pyrovus  
lies that our lizard overlords want us to believe.

You will believe the lies.

They are Good lies and you will learn to love them.

You can bet your scales on it.

mayko - 7-11-2015 at 09:10

It works for me; perhaps you don't have access to Whimsy.

hissingnoise - 7-11-2015 at 09:30

Jeez no ─ not Whimsy? It already has its quota of fuckwits!?!