Sciencemadness Discussion Board - Wrappolite

Wrappolite

Laboratory of Liptakov - 13-1-2018 at 13:27

Here I am trying to introduce some invention of prof. Liptakov. The basic idea is two aluminum foils that seal hermetically the energy material inside. Aluminum foil fulfills 3 basic functions. 1) Handling carrier film, 2) secondary fuel 3) moisture barrier. But also against evaporation, depending on the type of EM inside. The basic design is 2 Alu foils of 0.05 mm thick. Between their are AN crystals + EG in stechiomeric ratio. Foil and grain create air pockets that are important for proper function. During roll-up in the form of a condenser, additional air pockets are formed between the outer sides of the foil. This ensures that the low density is maintained during scrolling. Usually in the shape of a thick cylinder. Foil tape is possible easy divide for right weight of use. Or easily to edit to cube shape or rectangle. Or any shape without loss of properties. Within a certain range of density, of course.
EM inside can be also almost anything that evaporates or is liquid. Alu foil fully replaces fine aluminum powder. Therefore, the foil is counted in the oxygen balance.
The exact details of the ratios, manufacturing process and all the possibilities of use will not be given for understandable reasons.
Dr...... :cool:

Bert - 13-1-2018 at 15:50

In my experience, Aluminum foils are very easily pierced, torn or just develop pin holes where they have been bent.

When wrapping up the item, how do.you deal with either the interior foil (tighter curve) from becoming corrugated and leaking, or the outer foil (must cover longer distance) from tearing?

Agree on the foil becoming part of the fuel or even providing a thermobaric effect for any reasonably hot, brissant explosive filling-

IT'S THE JELLY ROLL OF DEATH!!!

Laboratory of Liptakov - 13-1-2018 at 16:16

During rolling to shape capacitor arises more air gaps on insides layer. EG works as oil. Better is always roll on bigger basic start diameter from 4 cm. At thickness 0,5 mm / 40mm Is effect dilatation between inside and outside Alu foil small. Of course, that someplace arises piercing points. But if is grains under 0,2 mm, is piercing almost nothing. It s not some proffesional device. But works from No. 8. Always.
Thermobaric effect ? Of course. Also Always ............. :cool:

roXefeller - 15-1-2018 at 14:54

Do you have any experience with critical diameter? I wonder if it has application as det cord. I know its almost untenable though.

[Edited on 15-1-2018 by roXefeller]

Laboratory of Liptakov - 16-1-2018 at 00:46

Minimal 3 cm diameter is condition. Maybe as thick detcord should by works. With AN - EG. But 1 meter long charge it was not tried.

Microtek - 18-1-2018 at 23:04

A member here on SM (I don't remember who, exactly) experimented with thermobaric devices based on this design. IIRC, the energetic he used was a fairly fast one (ETN, PETN or maybe RDX). There was pictures of a test he made.

NeonPulse - 18-1-2018 at 23:24

https://www.sciencemadness.org/whisper/viewthread.php?tid=33... This is the thread I presume. It was a great idea.

Rocinante - 19-1-2018 at 10:35

For RDX: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S001021801...

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/292989139_Thermobar...

joseph6355 - 28-1-2018 at 03:14

So this is basically Detcord, but with aluminum foil?
The idea seems nice at first.

The main purpose of detcord is to detonate other explosives. I don't see how a thermobaric device would help on that.
I think that Liptakov has other uses in mind besides detcord.

Laboratory of Liptakov - 28-1-2018 at 09:41

If someone wants to beat a tree, the biggest problem is placing the charge around the tree. From all sides. Because if the charge is from all sides, it is most effective. Thus, less EM grams is necessary. Wrappolite is used as an adhesive tape. Use is same as bandage. Inside can be almost anything. For example KClO3 + WD40. Full strenght from No.8 . Even 2cm diameter only. Incredible powerful........ :cool:

Bert - 10-2-2018 at 13:57

I have seen the results of wrapping a tree with several wraps (recall it was 5 or 6 times around the tree) of fairly heavy det cord (40 grains/foot). All it did was remove the bark and a small ammount of wood directly under the wrapping of cord- this was on a young oak tree about 8" thick. That would work out to about 8 grams of PETN, if it had been drilled into center of tree and the hole stemmed, would have done more dammage.

How much would 24" of the 2cm Chlorate:WD40 aluminum foiled charge weigh?

I was taught to drill the tree mostly through, tamp the charge to expand it against the bored hole, then stem with clay, wet sand, etc.

joseph6355 - 10-2-2018 at 14:28

Quote: Originally posted by Bert

I have seen the results of wrapping a tree with several wraps (recall it was 5 or 6 times around the tree) of fairly heavy det cord (40 grains/foot). All it did was remove the bark and a small ammount of wood directly under the wrapping of cord- this was on a young oak tree about 8" thick. That would work out to about 8 grams of PETN, if it had been drilled into center of tree and the hole stemmed, would have done more dammage.

How much would 24" of the 2cm Chlorate:WD40 aluminum foiled charge weigh?

I was taught to drill the tree mostly through, tamp the charge to expand it against the bored hole, then stem with clay, wet sand, etc.

The problem is that most of the energy delivered by the exploson is dispersed in the air, and not focused on the tree.
If you drill a hole in the middle of the stump and then pack and close it with HE, all of the energy will be used to shred it in hundreds of pieces.
Detcord on the other hand, will disperse its energy at all directions instead of focusing it in a specifc spot or area.

I don't know how the wrappolite would perform. I'm certain that a higher amount of HE would do more damage obviously, but would it be enough?

[Edited on 10/2/18 by joseph6355]

Laboratory of Liptakov - 10-2-2018 at 15:29

Explosion from central hole is of course much more efficiency. If we can use electric tools, drills, we can use also electric saw or next tools on the wood. It what is on picture works. AN + EG or PCh + WD40. In stechio balance on - 20. Foil is about 10% of mass. Density low, less than 1. Can be even 0,5g/cc. 20 cm tree is pretty enough. On it is better use central hole. Because weight of EM is neccessary counting EM2 from diameter.