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Author: Subject: Unconventional Shaped Charges
Bikemaster
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[*] posted on 10-11-2009 at 11:33


Is this one of us???? because it seem pready similar to what project of making.

Two Students Noted For Explosives Research
SOCORRO, N.M. November 10, 2009 – New Mexico Tech students Shaun Geerts and Micah Wild won third place for their research poster at the national American Indian Society of Science and Engineering conference in Portland in late October.

The mechanical engineering students were honored for their poster titled “A Study of the Effects of Shaped-Charge Liner Design.”
Geerts, the president of the Explosives Club on campus, said he and Wild completed the project with the intention of presenting at the International Society of Explosives Engineers in Orlando in February.

While they haven’t heard if their paper has been accepted for the ISEE conference, the Tech chapter did receive an award to help students attend.

A “shaped charge” is an explosive charge with a lined cavity that generates a jet of metal when detonated. The standard design includes a liner that collapses in a fashion that creates a high-velocity jet of ejecta. Geerts said he and Wild tested a theory that a second liner would create a more powerful jet.

“We came up with an idea to implement an inner liner,” Geerts said. “Instead of a single liner, you have an additional liner inside and the goal was to add more material to a certain part of the jet to increase its effectiveness. If you have more mass, it can penetrate further.”

The students theorized that one thicker line wouldn’t allow the same initial velocity, but a second liner may allow the jet to form, then add material as the shaped charge exits the cone.

They tested their theory nine times at the Energetic Materials Research and Testing Center at New Mexico Tech. Two of their designs penetrated a target object just as far as the conventional shaped charge, but none of their designs outperformed the standard cone, Geerts said.

The national organization gave the club $1,000 to help students pay travel costs to attend the conference. The Explosives Club has about 50 members and Geerts hopes that 10 to 12 students will attend the conference in Florida.

– NMT –

By Thomas Guengerich/New Mexico Tech

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[*] posted on 10-11-2009 at 15:59


I get a good feeling reading this, let me explain myself.
I think it is a general acceptance that explosives are only for military/government.
There seems to be a major problem with amateurs/student that experiment with explosive materials.
It is good to hear that there actually is room for this :)

@on topic
The idea behind a double liner isn't that dumb, even tough it did not outperform the commercial charge.
I can imagine that there are limits to a single liner and thus there is a frontier in the current method.
A nice way of thinking around the problem.
Too bad my insights in this kind of physics are limited at this point.




What a fine day for chemistry this is.
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 11-11-2009 at 15:28


Quote: Originally posted by Bikemaster  

Two of their designs penetrated a target object just as far as the conventional shaped charge, but none of their designs outperformed the standard cone, Geerts said.

A non-event, then?


[Edited on 11-11-2009 by hissingnoise]
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[*] posted on 20-11-2009 at 10:11


Nothing ventured nothin gained my pessimistic friend!:D

I agree it is heartening to see non governmental folks sponsored and even allowed to test thier theorys.Even in failure something learned something gained."Negative waves
man".:cool:

'Kelly's Hero's?

Theres a link there somewhere?Like the prize goes to those willing to take chances/try new things.Maybe Edisons a better example.Far more failures than successes.Stubborn SOB and still a Famous name.Likely more stubborn than genius. Early Happy holidays.




[Edited on 20-11-2009 by grndpndr]
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[*] posted on 2-1-2010 at 09:46


Couldn't resist since I had one coppercone left... :D

32 mm diameter spunformed copperliner, 60 deg apex, 0.8mm thick. Headheight used was only 0.6 CD to reduce the amount of PBX needed. No waveshaper this time. Charge was fired against 23 cm solid aluminium target using 2.5 CD standoff.

Charge was filled with 34 grams of PETN/PIB/plasticizer, rolled until at near theoretical density of ~1.6g/cm3 for 8% inerts. PETN was recrystallized slowly from hot acetone and blendered in water to give estimated 20-50 micron sized spherical crystals.

19.3 cm penetration in total, nice! :D

Attachment: 32mm shaped charge vs aluminium small.avi (886kB)
This file has been downloaded 1028 times 32 mm shaped charge vs aluminium small.jpg - 288kB

[Edited on 2-1-2010 by nitro-genes]
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[*] posted on 2-1-2010 at 10:26


Nice! I bet that put a smile on your face ;)
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 2-1-2010 at 12:08


The aluminium looks well satisfied too. . .
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[*] posted on 14-1-2010 at 10:32
Bought on eBay


Someone on eBay is selling a CD-ROM with over 640 patent pdfs relating to shaped charges. The listing is #360225030621. Here's the blurb from the listing:

Quote:
Shaped charge explosive devices allow the energy released in the explosion to be focused either to a point, a line or an arc (such as in the familiar CLAYMORE mine) or plane. In addition, the metal liners that are part of these devices are converted into a super hot 'explosive formed penetrator' jets that can punch through armor plate, sheet steel, reinforced concrete walls, unexploded bombs & much more. Shaped charge explosive devices are the first choice of military weapons designers in the following areas:

- Mines (anti-armor & anti-personnel)
- Grenades
- Missile & artillery shell warheads
- Aerospace
- Anti-armor infantry weapons such as the BAZOOKA
- Autonomous sub-munition tank killer bomblets
- Devices to breach walls & hardened defensive emplacements

And much more!

This patent collection gives the student of military technology, explosives & mechanical design a ready reference on the design & manufacturing techniques used to create these awesome devices!

The patents in this collection are in Adobe pdf file format and are viewable, printable & searchable on any PC-type computer with a CD drive & Adobe Acrobat Reader (free download).



I purchased same & it's a pretty complete patent search with some very good info on manufacture & use of shaped charges, EFPs, etc.



[Edited on 14-1-2010 by Ritter]




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[*] posted on 14-1-2010 at 13:29


Ritter: Will a .iso of said CD be appearing on Rapidshare for us? Sharing IS caring...



If you give a man a match he will be warm for a moment. Set him alight and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
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Ritter
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[*] posted on 14-1-2010 at 17:31


Quote: Originally posted by -=HeX=-  
Ritter: Will a .iso of said CD be appearing on Rapidshare for us? Sharing IS caring...


Yes, but its label says it's copyrighted. eBay (and myself) take a dim view of violating copyright laws, such as posting such material for uncompensated view.

[Edited on 15-1-2010 by Ritter]




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[*] posted on 15-1-2010 at 22:37


@ Ritter
The name of the product can be copyrighted.
Patents are public documents and are not
subject to anyone's copyright nor would it
be granted. For example a travel guide, the
places described therein are not subject to
the author or publishers right of commerce,
only reproduction of the printed presentation.
Post the list of numbers only if you have qualms.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=36022...

.
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[*] posted on 16-1-2010 at 07:55


Quote: Originally posted by franklyn  
@ Ritter
The name of the product can be copyrighted.
Patents are public documents and are not
subject to anyone's copyright nor would it
be granted. For example a travel guide, the
places described therein are not subject to
the author or publishers right of commerce,
only reproduction of the printed presentation.
Post the list of numbers only if you have qualms.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=36022...

.


While you are correct that patents are public documents, the final product of a patent SEARCH is not a public document. The contents of this disc are the product of both time & talent & are correctly entitled to copyright, as would be a list of the patent numbers obtained through this search.

It's somewhat distressing that the spirit of amateur experimentalism appears to include the apparent desire to get something for nothing as well as the apparent DEMAND that I provide same because I own it & others don't.



[Edited on 16-1-2010 by Ritter]




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[*] posted on 16-1-2010 at 08:25


Ritter, I think 'demand' is too strong a word here.
Posting the numbers shouldn't hurt anyone much.
And members here are unlikely to use them for profit?
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[*] posted on 16-1-2010 at 08:32


Quote: Originally posted by hissingnoise  
Posting the numbers shouldn't hurt anyone much.
And members here are unlikely to use them for profit?


In think you are still missing the point. If a purchaser of this data disseeminates it to interested parties at no charge, where is the incentive for the original author to continue prioducing such works? These requests are ill advised & overall counterproductive.




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[*] posted on 16-1-2010 at 08:55


I don't think anyone is looking for all 640 numbers but a few numbers would be welcome and you wouldn't be committing a great offense.
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[*] posted on 16-1-2010 at 11:54


Quote: Originally posted by hissingnoise  
I don't think anyone is looking for all 640 numbers but a few numbers would be welcome and you wouldn't be committing a great offense.


Here are 3 US patent numbers dealing with the manufacture of shaped charges:

3034393
3924510
4250792




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[*] posted on 16-1-2010 at 13:15


Thanks Ritter, the earlier two are pre-'75 and don't come up on USPTO search but I got a plethora of interesting patents which are related to those early ones.


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[*] posted on 17-1-2010 at 03:54


Here are URLs for the 2 earlier patents. You'll need one of the TIFF viewer plugins to get full image.

http://tinyurl.com/ybyx7qx
http://tinyurl.com/y8uflap

[Edited on 17-1-2010 by Ritter]




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[*] posted on 21-1-2010 at 09:48


Don't know where to post this, but I think this topic is the most suitable.

Today I tested a nitric acid plastique mixture of KIPE (Tim Lewis) : Nitric acid / polystyrene.
I distilled the NA (not with destillator but with frying pan and bottles, it fumed heavily) and mixed it with polystyrene beans (28 gr NA, 5 gr PS). I stirred the mixture for half an hour in a water bath 40°C, but it was still liquid, not plastique. I added 1 gr Nitromethane.
I tried to det it with 4 gr cast ETN, but of course, it didn't go off. I allready expected it, but tried it to be sure because I couldn't find anything on it on the internet. I lost quite lot of time and my conclusion is : all the books of Tim Lewis are filled with crap. I wish I had never downloaded them.
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[*] posted on 21-1-2010 at 09:58


It could be worse - some people forked out good money for Ledgard's stupid manual!
And what's more, I'll never fucking learn. . .

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[*] posted on 24-1-2010 at 11:56


Hey Hey ,
I'm talking Federov , Beilstein Hauptwerk , Journal für Praktische Chemie
and you think you got taken bad _
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=7553&a...

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[*] posted on 23-2-2010 at 02:32


Nitro-genes:

Damn, I'm all jealous now

Excellent work. Full credit.

BTW, what was the classical piece used as the soundtrack.
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[*] posted on 23-2-2010 at 10:55


I tested the ANNMSA mixture of Axt. Det with 6 gr ETN. It's powerful, but I think it isn't better than ANNM 30%.
Here is the vid : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIsZBo6ZIs8
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[*] posted on 24-2-2010 at 02:17


I wonder if any one would like a full pdf copy of "Liners for Shaped Charges" by Professor Manfred Held.

It was published in Journal Of Battlefield Technology, Vol 4, No 3, November 2001.

Abstract:
The penetration potential of shaped charges is proportional to the jet length and the square root of the jet density. The bulk-sound velocities of the liner materials define the maximum possible jet tip velocities. The jet tip velocities and breakup, or particulation, times determine the jet length. For shaped-charge optimisations these parameters have to be considered.

After a brief discussion of these issues, this paper outlines the potential of a range of materials for use as possible shaped-charge liners.

It is further noted that, as well as the selection of optimal materials, a number of other factors have be taken into account, such as quality of the raw material, homogeneity, and grain-size distribution.

Finally, the paper describes the different production possibilities for copper liners, identifying the advantages and disadvantages of each. In particular, the flow-turning process is discussed with its potential for spin compensation.


The article is 1.7 Mb, 7 pages in length.
Here is the link

Mods: Apologies if this is the wrong place to offer this but I don't have access to References.


[Edited on 25-2-2010 by devongrrl]
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[*] posted on 24-2-2010 at 14:38


Thanks,

And yes, it's a shame (though in many other ways probably a good thing ;)) that only some institutions have a subscription to these kinds of journals...

The music in the clip was the 3rd movement of Bruch's violin concerto nr.1 in G minor, can't recall the violinist...
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