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Author: Subject: Solar cells
overseer
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Solar cells

Not so long ago, experimenting with some natural dye based solar cells became promising and subject of interest in the "mad sci" community. Here are the two papers that might offer some help in getting started . . .

Attachment: Solar1.zip (551kB)

overseer
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Solar cells

The second paper . . .

Attachment: Solar2.zip (453kB)

Saerynide
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I cant open them....
overseer
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 Quote: Originally posted by Saerynide I cant open them....

I just re-downloaded both of them and there was no problem opening the files. Try using the right mouse button and "save target as" to save the zip-file to disk.
Saerynide
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Sorry, I didnt mean I couldnt dl them. I meant the zips seem to be corrupted.
Blind Angel
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Same thing here, which compressor do you use, maybe it's just a version incompatibility problem
overseer
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>which compressor do you use, maybe
>it's just a version incompatibility problem

The files were packed with WinZip 8.0. I see others have problems too, so I arranged with Saerynide to email the files to him. If they arrive alive and well, I hope he could re-post them. If the problems remain, I'll try to find another computer to post the files from, right after the weekend. Sorry for the inconvenience.
Saerynide
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Here they are:

first file

second file

[Edited on 17-1-2004 by Saerynide]
Blind Angel
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winzip 8.0 seem to be the problem
most compressing tool aren't retrocompatible (like winrar 3.0 isn't compatible with winrar 2.5)

/}/_//|//) /-\\/|//¬/=/_
My PGP Key Fingerprint: D4EA A609 55E4 7ADD 8529 359D D6E2 33F6 4C76 78ED
indigofuzzy
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So... no comments on the content of the files. I find them intriguing myself, and may, in the near future indulge my curiousity and build on of these organic solar panels.
BTW, I had no problem at all opening the Zip archives on my Mac
Cloner
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hmmm... i can't dl the files unfortunately, but i have some experience on organic solar cells. The bottom line is you need transparent conducting material which can survive a temperature of 400 degrees or something at which you sinter the oxide. This works with several oxides, the best of which I found was titanium oxide, but zinc oxide functions reasonably at equal conditions. This is, if I used commercialy available conducting glass. Which is pretty OTC allright - but also expensive.

For DIY production, the transparant conducting material has been a problem: glass is the only thing that comes close and you need to apply a layer of doped SnO on it. Even that isn't a problem using a spraying device, but I never succeeded in making the layer homogeneous and well conducting (way too many ohms even though it was conducting). I used a bunsen burner and microscope slides for this, the microscope slides easily cracking at the temperature change that results from the spraying. For better results, an oven that can reach 500-600 degrees must probably be used.

[Edited on 4-10-2006 by Cloner]
IrC
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I get tripod error on both files in second set. However I d/l'ed the first 2 zips and they unzip with winzip 7 just fine, and open with acrobat reader 6.0.05 just fine. No problemo.
cabrero
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I dont understant why is necessary to use a TCO (transparent conducting oxide), you can obtain similar transmitances with a simple metallic grid, or by painting the electrode (draw a grid) with graphite or metallic paste. And its by far more cheap and easy.

In order to obtain high efficiencies, its a must to use a Ruthenium-complex dye-sensitized TiO2 and a eletrolite system based on I-/I3-.
I havent seen significative efficiencies with natural dyes, or other electrolite systems.
Quince
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Solar electricity is another environmentalist scam. All the energy research money should go towards sources that actually can provide enough energy to sustain progress, like the ITER project (iter.org), not ones that will make so little that we'll have to regress, like solar, wind power, and other such maggot fodder. /vomits

[Edited on 7-12-2006 by Quince]

\"One of the surest signs of Conrad\'s genius is that women dislike his books.\" --George Orwell
chromium
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 Quote: Originally posted by Quince Solar electricity is another environmentalist scam. All the energy research money should go towards sources that actually can provide enough energy to sustain progress, like the ITER project (iter.org), not ones that will make so little that we'll have to regress, like solar, wind power, and other such maggot fodder. /vomits

Do not know about wind but solar power can be very useful. If we could convert all solar radiation from 1 m2 with 90% efficiency then we would get nearly 1 KW of power. Most private homes have enoguh area to get tens or hundreds of kilowatts even if efficiency would be only 30%.

When all think alike, then no one is thinking. - Walter Lippmann
cabrero
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The Key here is to find a easy and cheap method to capture part of this ~ 1KW/m2 of solar radiation.
Even a small efficiency, say ~5%, could solve all energy demands if the solar cell is cheap and stable;
Silicon involves expensive steps of manufacture, and the cheapest approaches tried by both cost of manuracture and materials used, Cu2O and CdS/Cu2S, result in low efficiency the former and low stability the latter.
randolph_carter
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well, hey now....

this dreamer has been producing ALL of his farm, office and home needs via solar and hydroelctricity for over THREE DECADES!!!
not a single outage the entire time...
i think not!!!
reliability is an order of magnitude better.....

as to cost....

you obviously have not added ALL the costs up....
i can understand that the gov does it's best to hide all of the costs they can.....

like the subsidies for nuclear , oil companies, overzealous tyrant's wars over energy, and a million other hidden costs that YOU YES YOU pay for at the pump, at tax time and everytime you buy a product that is made with "subsidized" traditional energy sources.....

how do you think the national debt has bloated from ~1 trillion us$under carter (pre 1st oil shortage/war...)to it's current get this....$8.75 TRILLION !!!!

check the numbers and you will find that year after year the republicans (note-clinton actually only ended on a +.32% increase in debt for his 2 terms...) have increased our debt about 9.5% per year and strangely enough it was largely to "subsidize/strongarm" for the tratditional energy/mil industrial complex concerns (GE comes to mind immediately....) in the us of not a.......

NOT on social programs....
NOT on the miniscule amount spent on "alternative energy research"......
NOT on health care.......
maybee some on pigs and their wasteful ways.....

nuclear power facility security costs PAID for yearly by the us amount to more than ALL solar and alternative energy subsidies, period!!!!

Hell the gov even pays for the boxcars that ship coal to the electric plants, through subsidies!!!!!

so maybee it is about time for MORE subsidies for alt energy....
and the removal of all "hidden" subsidies for traditional energy sources.....

if we had not of went down this thorny path, we would not be in such a sorry state of affairs in amerika.....

swims would not be killing people in i-not-raq, they could be here throwing the tyrants down.....

or maybee that is the plan eh?????

revolutions always start in the middle/lower-middle classes.......

guess who's dying in the sand........

jus a ravin my 64,382 cents worth inta the sat birds eye in da pm.........

\"......remember little ones, love is real not fade away, so pass some on today......\"
SAM4CH
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I faced a problem in my SnO2 layer, when it is good transperent its resistance is high, and If less efficiency with thick layer it is good conductive!
How can I reach good conductive with good transperent?
Eclectic
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4-5% Sb dopant...
SAM4CH
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How can I? procedure, Sb material!!?
Xenoid
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There is a long, convoluted and I believe ultimatley fruitless discussion on producing conducting SnO2 + Sb layers on titanium, toward the end of the PbO2 anode thread. I think it starts about here;

but it may be earlier. Basically you can start with Sn/Sb solder.

Regards, Xenoid
Eclectic
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Hey! My solder chloride experiments bore fruit! I've gotten 25 lbs of high purity SnCl2 from scrap lead free solder. Also SbCl3 solution ready to distill.

I just haven't gotten around to making conductive SnO2 yet, at least not on purpose, but there is plenty coating a lot of my glassware that I have to scrub off with Scotchbrite.
Xenoid
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 Quote: Originally posted by Eclectic Hey! My solder chloride experiments bore fruit! I've gotten 25 lbs of high purity SnCl2 from scrap lead free solder. Also SbCl3 solution ready to distill.

Sorry Eclectic, I didn't mean to deride your efforts, its just that I was trying to do MnO2 coating at the time and I wasn't really following the Sn/Sb angle.

It would possibly be a good idea for you to start a new thread outlining your experiments using the solder approach. The ability to coat glass with conductive SnO2 opens up all sorts of areas for the amateur experimenter. I'd certainly be interested.

Regards, Xenoid
Eclectic
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So many projects, so little time. It may be a while. I'm mainly into the chemistry and recycling to pure material. Anyway, everything you need is in that old thread, up to the point of actually forming a good coating. I'll post when I get the cooking procedure worked out.
Aqua_Fortis_100%
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Hello.

A friend of mine recently told me about this cell through this link (portuguese): http://www.cienciaviva.pt/docs/celulafotovoltaica.pdf and seems to be easy to make (except from SnO2 doped layer)..

So about the hardest part: The semicondutor SnO2 doped oxide can be of the same kind on both glass plates or do I need to use diferent doped SnO2 (n type and p type)?

Anyone sucess in making such solar cell?

Thanks

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 Sciencemadness Discussion Board » Special topics » Technochemistry » Solar cells Select A Forum Fundamentals   » Chemistry in General   » Organic Chemistry   » Reagents and Apparatus Acquisition   » Beginnings   » Responsible Practices   » Miscellaneous   » The Wiki Special topics   » Technochemistry   » Energetic Materials   » Biochemistry   » Radiochemistry   » Computational Models and Techniques   » Prepublication Non-chemistry   » Forum Matters   » Legal and Societal Issues