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Author: Subject: Why was Anders Hoveland banned?
entropy51
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 16:31


Quote: Originally posted by Hoveland  

It just happens that the name "Anarchist cookbook" happens to be well known amongst young adults. Using this as a title might be a way to reach them, as they probably are not familiar where to search to find a high quality energetic compound discussion.
Do we really want to reach those idiots whose only connection to chemisty is the "Anarchist Cookbook"?
Quote: Originally posted by Hoveland  
Can you respect my opinion that there should be racial segregation, so long as it does not increase economic oppression?
As one of those minorities you would like to oppress, I don't friggin respect anything about you, you piece of shit. How dare you tell me about economic oppression? God bless Polverone for banning you.
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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:16


"Why was Anders Hoveland Banned?"


Oh jolly. See, I go offline for a couple of weeks and ALL the fun stuff happens.




“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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Hoveland
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:18


I do not wish to oppress any minorities. I just beleive that people are generally happier living amongst other people that are culturally similar to themselves, and similar in appearance. And I realize that this is already happening to some extent and is one of many causes of economic inequality. I said that was unfair, and that I was not in favor of implementing any such changes until the secondary effects could be eliminated. Why do you have such a problem with that?

It is not that I hate other people. I just do not like the effects of crowding: noise, pollution, long lines, high costs of living. If I do have to be crowded with other people, I would prefer that those people be of the same race.

And unless you are a vegetarian, I believe you are a hypocrite. You think animals do not deserve any better than to be imprisoned, tortured, and finally eaten, but somehow you are offended that someone else would want to treat you just a little tiny ammount differently, even though this other person wants you to have rights which you currently do not enjoy?
I do not want to make you angy, but I am expressing my beliefs; and I can tell you there is a big portion of other people who simply plain dislike minorities, but keep quiet about it, for fear of the type of outbursts and lebeling you are making.

I would also hope that the administrators would not count my supposed "racism" against me. It is ignorant to go to great lengths to try to appease other people that are easily offended. It is fairly likely that any suggestion from someone that people be treated differently because of their race, will immediately label the originator as "bad","offensive",or "uncaring".
I would hope this is not the case.

entropy51, it seems you are behaving as the "troll" at this time.

If I am incorrect in my opinion, then, by all means, explain to my why I should think differently. I am quite open to changing opinions after discussions that present strong evidence. As I have stated, I have concern for ALL creatures.

I have no intention of causing any disturbance on this forum, or annoying, or intentionally offending anyone.


[Edited on 21-7-2010 by Hoveland]
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entropy51
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:23


Quote: Originally posted by Hoveland  
I do not wish to oppress any minorities. I simply want them to live in a different neigborhood.
Piece of shit and a troll to boot! Truth be told, I doubt that you can afford to live in my neighborhood, so don't lose any sleep over it Goldie Locks.
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watson.fawkes
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:26


Quote: Originally posted by Hoveland  
I can see that this forum does not value potentially useful ideas [...]
I value potentially useful ideas. It's just that I didn't see any in what you posted.

Reality is knocking. Are you going to answer the door?
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:28


Quote: Originally posted by Hoveland  
It is ignorant to go to great lengths to try to appease other groups that are easily offended. It is fairly likely that any suggestion from someone that people be treated differently because of their race, will immediately label the originator as "bad","offensive",or "uncaring".]


Yes, but you aren't helping.




“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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entropy51
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:30


Knock knock.

Who's there?

Anders!

Anders who?

And ders a troll at your door.:o
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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 17:33


*puts entropy in the PUNishment box*



“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 19:32


Quote:
I just beleive that people are generally happier living amongst other people that are culturally similar to themselves
This may be true in some cases but in today's day and age, especially in larger cities, culture has little to do with race. People tend to hang out with other people who share their interests regardless of race. Take the field of chemistry for example, if one chemist doesn't like another chemist simply because they are a different race that is called 'racism.' That is what you are Anders! But this is not necessarily a bad thing because there are other racists in the world. And we need people like you in the world to laugh at and critisize. All you need to do is find these other racists and share your common interests in racism-based activities, such as nigger hunting and eating sand-nigger sandwiches. I suggest you use Google to look up discussion forums dedicated to racism and then maybe you will find happiness among 'other people that are culturally similar' to you.

Quote:
I just do not like the effects of crowding: noise, pollution, long lines, high costs of living.
Then don't live in a crowded place. The world isn't going to change for Anders Hoveland. You're nothing. You're like a little speck of dust on my butthole.

Quote:
You think animals do not deserve any better than to be imprisoned, tortured, and finally eaten
Well if I was a cow or a chicken then I might think that. But I'm a human so I must support the advancement of the human race which means imprisoning cows and chickens, torturing them and finally, eating them.

Quote:
I am expressing my beliefs
Most of the people here find your beliefs offensive. Go to a neo-Nazi discussion forum or some other type of discussion forum that is filled with people who have very low IQ's, closed minds, small brains, even smaller penises and are very angry about it.

Quote:
there is a big portion of other people who simply plain dislike minorities
No there isn't. Unless by big you mean 1 out of 5000. Yes I guess that is big considering that usually a mild form of retardation or dementia is a prerequisite to become racist.

Quote:
I would also hope that the administrators would not count my supposed "racism" against me.
Of course they will silly! Do you think if a pedophile came here touting the benefits of molesting children, that administrators are going to welcome that? Get real!

Quote:
It is ignorant to go to great lengths to try to appease other people that are easily offended.
Actually just the opposite. So far everybody thinks you're a troll and wants you gone. It would be ignorant to let you stay.

Quote:
I would hope this is not the case.
It is the case.

Quote:
explain to my why I should think differently. I am quite open to changing opinions
Anyone who hasn't figured it out by the time they reach adulthood, probably never will.

Quote:
I have no intention of causing any disturbance on this forum, or annoying, or intentionally offending anyone.
Well you have and you did. So make like Michael Jackson and beat it.
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[*] posted on 20-7-2010 at 20:00


Anders, if you want to participate in this forum and be taken seriously I suggest registering a new account under an innocuous name and breaking the posting habits that make people think you're trolling. If you can't learn from example or direct instruction what to do and what not to do, I suppose you can keep re-registering and getting banned until you grow tired of it.

This forum is not opposed to theoretical and novel energetic materials. If you want to see examples of past posters who have shared well-received theories and speculation about energetic materials, look up the posts of Engager or Philou Zrealone.

If instead you want to be banned as fast as possible, keep posting about racial segregation.




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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 03:25


LOL I think I now have a good understanding on why he was banned



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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 05:38


Actually no; the I'm fairly sure the banning was entirely inspired by the content of the chemistry posts - not related to politics at all.
I share some of Anders' politics but recognize that this is not the place for such inflammatory discussions. The fact that some of the posts in Whimsy or Legal/Societal touch on politics does not mean that this is an appropriate venue for posting radical views.

IMO the basic problem was high-volume, low-quality wild speculation. Some of it dangerous. But I believe it was Polverone that banned him so if you want precise reasons refer to his posts or PM him.
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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 08:32


Quote: Originally posted by bbartlog  
Actually no; the I'm fairly sure the banning was entirely inspired by the content of the chemistry posts - not related to politics at all.
I share some of Anders' politics but recognize that this is not the place for such inflammatory discussions. The fact that some of the posts in Whimsy or Legal/Societal touch on politics does not mean that this is an appropriate venue for posting radical views.

IMO the basic problem was high-volume, low-quality wild speculation. Some of it dangerous. But I believe it was Polverone that banned him so if you want precise reasons refer to his posts or PM him.




Low quality? How about factual inaccuracies (lies)

QUOTE:
"My local government wants to ban guns, but the truth is, it is only all the poor immigrants that are shooting each other, unintentionally prompting the wider government to take away more of the rights and freedoms of everyone else."

Or:
"I hear slaughterhouses in Nebraska, USA are worse than the hollocaust. Some animals get skinned and boiled alive. Would you rather be die a slow horrible death, or at least be eaten."
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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 13:04


The high volume and over-all worthlessness of his posts, caused me to quickly ignore them. Big waste of time to even read them.

The peril of such material, is that its massive accumulation crowds-out useful posts.

Kind of like a senatorial filibuster. Wherein the minority senators block the vote on legislation, by endlessly babbling-on about nothing. Reading from a phonebook is not an unknown tactic, and unless the filibuster is somehow circumvented.....the diversion goes on forever.



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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 17:47


Quicksilver: Hoveland's comments about slaughterhouses are quite true (unlike most of his rubbish). This isn't the thread for it, but the things people will do to other creatures for the sake of their taste buds baffles, and saddens, me.

zed: Is the rule not that all they have to do is say they are filibustering? Babbling no longer required?




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Sedit
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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 20:25


Anyone that worrys about the culturing of cattle as a feed stock need to get there head screwed on a little tighter. This science, learn the food chain! We are advanced as we are as humans because we master the beast not give them a home in a four star hotel and hope there life is good.

Vegitarians are malnutritioned and look sickly because they are missing vital parts of there diet to appease a misguided belief that we should not eat meat.

Now if you excuse me I must go cook up a nice healthy steak on the grill and sin against all animal kind.





Knowledge is useless to useless people...

"I see a lot of patterns in our behavior as a nation that parallel a lot of other historical processes. The fall of Rome, the fall of Germany — the fall of the ruling country, the people who think they can do whatever they want without anybody else's consent. I've seen this story before."~Maynard James Keenan
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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 21-7-2010 at 23:04


I'm higher in the food chain, but I'd rather eat happy meat.



“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 07:10


Quote: Originally posted by Oxydro  
Quicksilver: Hoveland's comments about slaughterhouses are quite true (unlike most of his rubbish). This isn't the thread for it, but the things people will do to other creatures for the sake of their taste buds baffles, and saddens, me.


I believe that you are aware that there are abuses of animals within slaughter-houses and that there are situations wherein animals suffer -- which I do not doubt.

But the statement he made was not only a gross generalization & an over simplification for the attempt at shock value. It is a statement of an issue that he knows NOTHING about.
Was he born and raised on a working ranch? Was he a 4H and FFA member? Did he raise cattle, sheep, pigs, etc to market them and understand the process (& abuses)?
NO. {Or he would not have made that statement; believe me.}
"I hear" Is not only an unsubstantiated method of making a generalization & sweeping statement, but it does a disservice to the issue as a whole.

Could you please show me substantiated & documented proof that the state of Nebraska has a pointed agenda to boil cattle alive and maintain a debauchery of cruelty as policy?

It doesn't exist; naturally. That's because in the childish way of framing the statement, the underpinnings of actual abuse are ruined.
Gross generalizations are indefensible and do an extreme disservice to any policy that could be changed for the better.


I do understand the heart-felt issues here. I am pointing out the problems of him framing them in a foolish context. I also do not enjoy seeing animals suffer. I understand the sentiment AND I understand the issues from a very powerful first-person perspective. IF I was going to address the issue so as to make a positive contribution I would not make generalizations and inaccuracies and I would not correlate the suffering of animals with the concept of genocide as state policy.

Let me explain a bit more so that you understand where I (& perhaps many others are coming from). There is a patten of childishness and lack of maturity to both his statements on science & social phenomenon. Should it be one post or three, it's really not a big deal should it stop there. But it was a constant theme.

On occasion bigot's & elitists believe their remarks are quite covert, yet when a pattern emerges they become quite transparent.
The cruelty to an animal is a shameful thing however the use of correlations to genocides or a holocaust is a backhanded slight toward those who may have reason to feel even more; as is the comparison to cattle, etc.
Not only did he offend people; he did a disservice toward the suffering of animals. The pathetic thing is that, so ingrained is his bigotry that he may not have seen the transparency of his elitist verbiage.
Some people do not have conversations. They do not listen when others speak. They simply wait their turn to talk. This has been a problem with a long history.






[Edited on 22-7-2010 by quicksilver]




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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 11:02


Quote: Originally posted by Sedit  
Vegitarians are malnutritioned and look sickly [...]

Unfortunately not. :(
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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 12:23


Didn't know that Sauron had a son...



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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 12:53


IIRC, he has a stepson but what has that to do with the appearance of malnourished Vegans?
As for Sauron himself, it'd be nice to see him resume posting. . .

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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 20:28


I gotta agree with you hissingnoise. Sauron was a hard worker, with a real interest in chemistry.

He used to heap abuse on people, but he could also heap-on helpfulness. He provided lots of good references, and he was a major asset.

Hopefully, he is in good health and his lack of posting corresponds with his being busy with other projects.
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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 21:04


Quote: Originally posted by turd  
Quote: Originally posted by Sedit  
Vegitarians are malnutritioned and look sickly [...]

Unfortunately not. :(


BS.

Without daily vitamine supliments they look like herion addicts with funky skin color and bags under there eyes. Meat is basis of human health else we would not have evolved the teeth to chew it.

There are theorys that those with overbites are a reminent of a past form of human that was mainly a root eater but its just that a theory. Homosapians need protien they can only get from meat. All else is just PETA dogma

[Edited on 23-7-2010 by Sedit]





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[*] posted on 22-7-2010 at 23:29


I was referring to the book "Slaughterhouse: The Shocking Story of Greed, Neglect, and Inhumane Treatment Inside the U.S. Meat Industry" by Gail A. Eisnitz, which is available in many libraries; the book can be seen here:
http://www.amazon.com/Slaughterhouse-Shocking-Inhumane-Treat...

This book does happen to include hogs being boiled alive, and cows being skinned alive. The treatment of the poor human employees does not seem to be much better.

There are countless reports that abuse is widespread in the industry in the USA. Just one of them:
http://www.mercyforanimals.org/investigations.aspx

I am sure it is somewhat debatable whether these are just frequent isolated incidences, or an industry-wide problem, but one thing that is less in doubt is that the people in the interior of North America are far less concerned with the well-being of animals than residents in the coastal cities.

Vegetarians are likely to be about as healthy as everyone else, but their diet-related problems are different. Instead of worrying about consuming too much fat and cholesterol, and not enough fiber, vegetarians can easily not get enough protein and have blood sugar problems if they simply eat what everyone else is eating minus the meat. When you hear of "vegetarians being healthier than the average person" this really refers to vegetarians that have adopted a diet of foods virtually forgoten in the late twentieth century (steamed greenbeans, chickpeas, sorghum, whole grain bread) and exotic health foods from various other cultures (tofu, amaranth, quinoa, seaweed, hemp seed)

quote by Zed: "The high volume and over-all worthlessness of his posts, caused me to quickly ignore them. Big waste of time to even read them. The peril of such material, is that its massive accumulation crowds-out useful posts."

Of course, I am dissappointed to hear this. Anyone who felt this way could have sent me a u2u, but I was unaware that this was such a problem, or that there were a significant number of people inconvenienced. I should have put all speculation into one topic, so that those not interested in the less substantiated ideas and unestablished energetic compounds could avoid what they do not wish to read.

quote by quicksilver: "There is a patten of childishness and lack of maturity to both his statements on science & social phenomenon. Should it be one post or three, it's really not a big deal should it stop there. But it was a constant theme"

I only count three posts that have any commentary on social phenomena, so presumably you would not have much of a problem with that one aspect at least?




[Edited on 23-7-2010 by Hoveland]
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[*] posted on 23-7-2010 at 01:38


Why was Anders Hoveland banned?

Well, he made over 200 posts in less than 30days.

Many were voluminous, and from what I could see, they lacked meaningful content.

His posts were completely atypical of the quality that members here usually produce.

I was bored rather than offended. And, I wondered what action(if any) Science Madness might have to take, to stem the flood of nonsense.
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