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Author: Subject: terrorist dirty bomb? no gov. idiots!
The WiZard is In
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[*] posted on 16-8-2010 at 07:00
terrorist dirty bomb? no gov. idiots!


High rise chemical spill snarls NY's Times Square
2 hrs 37 mins ago
[Text16viii10]

NEW YORK (Reuters) – Several blocks of New York's Times Square
were closed down on Sunday night, creating chaos in the packed
tourist district after an accidental hazardous materials spill in a
high rise building, authorities said.

The west side of 7th Avenue from 44th Street to 47th Street was
closed down to vehicular and pedestrian traffic shortly after 9 p.m.
after a machine malfunctioned, spilling about 30 gallons (136.5
liters) of hydrogen peroxide on a high floor at 1515 Broadway, a
New York Police Department spokesman said.


Two workers using the machine were decontaminated at the scene
and refused further medical attention, and no other injuries were
reported.

Fire Department and other emergency services vehicles snarled
several blocks hours later, drawing crowds of onlookers in the
city's prime tourist spot and recalling a frightening incident earlier
this year when a car bomb was driven into Times Square on a
Saturday night.
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MagicJigPipe
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[*] posted on 16-8-2010 at 12:49


Why was the street closed down? Just extreme paranoia or so it would be easier to get cleanup teams up and down the street?



"There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. ... We know that the only way to avoid error is to detect it and that the only way to detect it is to be free to inquire. And we know that as long as men are free to ask what they must, free to say what they think, free to think what they will, freedom can never be lost, and science can never regress." -J. Robert Oppenheimer
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The WiZard is In
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[*] posted on 16-8-2010 at 15:56


Quote: Originally posted by MagicJigPipe  
Why was the street closed down? Just extreme paranoia or so it would be easier to get cleanup teams up and down the street?


Clean up?!

Pouring 5-10 gallons of water on it would dilute it beyond the what
little danger there was... if any.

Remember — MSDS are written by lawyers not chemists.


Spilled Some Salt? Call 0SHA

By MICHAEL M. SEGAL
Letter to the editor. Wall Street Journal 9viiI91

Decent people believe we should warn employees about
hazardous materials on the job. Governments at all levels have en-
dorsed such a "right to know" for employees, and the
Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) has written
laboratory safety rules with this in mind. Unfortunately, the results
of the rules provide some textbook cases of how good intentions
can go awry.

I first became aware there was a problem when I read the label
on one of my laboratory chemicals. It read: "WARNING: CAUSES
IRRITATION. Avoid contact with eyes, skin or clothing. Avoid
breathing dust. Wash thoroughly after handling." This "hazardous"
chemical was sodium chloride, ordinary table salt. The supplier
was carrying out its OSHA obligation to warn of potential hazards.
There is nothing wrong with careful handling of sodium chloride.
The danger comes from a situation in which hazardous and safe
substances carry similar warnings, leading to scant attention being
paid to all.

As an example, a warning about skin contact is also provided
with tetrodotoxin, the highly potent poison present in some fish that
is rumored to be the active ingredient in the "zombie powder"
Haitian voodoo practitioners throw to paralyze victims. For many
years, tetrodotoxin was one of the few substances to come with a
sheet of paper warning about hazards.

Now, OSHA requires chemical suppliers to prepare and provide
a two-page "Material Safety Data Sheet" for all chemicals that
might be hazardous. There are even such sheets for sodium
chloride, advising the laboratory worker to "Wear [a I respirator,
chemical safety goggles, rubber boots and heavy rubber gloves" in
the event that some salt spills. Although the warning on
tetrodotoxin is more severe than that for salt, the effect of turning
up the intensity of warnings on low-risk chemicals is to blur the
distinction between high and low risk.

The warnings about salt are not an isolated example of one
chemical supplier worried about liability. Here's another company's
advisory about a different chemical: "After contact with skin, wash
immediately with plenty of soap and water, . . . Special Firefighting
Procedures: Wear self-contained breathing apparatus and
protective clothing to prevent contact with skin or eyes. . . . Waste
Disposal Method: Dissolve or mix the material with a combustible
solvent and burn in a chemical incinerator equipped with an after-
burner and scrubber. Observe all federal, state and local
environmental regulations." This "hazardous" chemical is paraffin
wax-what ordinary candles are made of.

Now over-labeling is spreading from individual chemicals to
entire labs. I am currently being asked to hang a sign on my
laboratory door reading "RESTRICTED AREA: CARCINOGENS,
REPRODUCTIVE TOXINS AND ACUTELY TOXIC CHEMICALS IN
USE."

A warning of acutely toxic chemicals is reasonable for my
research lab, but the warning about birth defects and cancer is
overblown. It is required because my lab contains a bottle of the
drug phenytoin. Phenytoin is one of the most commonly prescribed
anti-seizure medications. It is on the OSHA warning lists because
pregnant women taking several hundred milligrams of the drug a
day have a small danger of having children with birth defects and
there may be a small danger of tumors in the child. But these risks
are low compared with the risks to the fetus of maternal seizures.
So, although it is recommended that I, as a neurologist, continue
to prescribe phenytoin through a woman's pregnancy, I must now
post an alarming notice on my door warning of cancer and birth
defects because the same substance is used in tiny quantities in
my lab.

An institution can choose not to post room signs for certain drugs
on the OSHA warning lists. To do this, however, the institution
would have to make a determination that such a warning is not
"appropriate." An OSHA spokeswoman cautioned that since
enforcement is done by OSHA inspectors, it would be "prudent" to
label all rooms that contain any drugs on the OSHA lists. If the
labeling of salt and wax by chemical companies is any guide, we
can expect to see a lot of over-labeling of labs at corporations and
universities.

There are several positive features of the OSHA rules: The best
example is the mandated "Chemical Hygiene Plan" safety books
that are a welcome addition to the information that employees
receive about hazards.

There are also costs to the regulations: New administrators are
being hired to carry them out. The taxpayers are signing a blank
check to pick up the tab for the increased costs at university labs,
because such "indirect costs" get tacked onto federal research
grants. The large indirect costs billed by universities have less to
do with cedar closets for presidents houses than they do with
universities lacking incentives to agitate for cost effectiveness of
regulations.

I'm sure that those who drafted the OSHA rules don't put hazard
labels on their salt shakers and don't wash their hands after
touching candles. But when "right to know" rules are combined with
vague regulations, corporations and universities will limit their
liability by over warning. Such "Crying wolf" over trivia risks lowers
our vigilance for real risks. I is important to restore a sense of
proportion.

Dr. Segal is a neurologist and neuroscientist at Harvard Medical
School.



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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 16-8-2010 at 18:42


In biochemistry, we're always warned about the dangers of 1 mol/L HCl

In chemistry, they just make sure we don't drink the 8 mol/L HCl.




“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 17-8-2010 at 01:46


As an antidote to people who wildly overreact at the slightest provocation. . .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-10996471

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unionised
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[*] posted on 17-8-2010 at 10:40


"a machine malfunctioned, spilling about 30 gallons (136.5 liters) of hydrogen peroxide "

"Clean up?!
Pouring 5-10 gallons of water on it would dilute it beyond the what
little danger there was... if any."

75% to 85% H2O2 still isn't nice.

Of course, God knows what the original concentration was.

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[*] posted on 17-8-2010 at 11:23


Quote: Originally posted by unionised  
"a machine malfunctioned, spilling about 30 gallons (136.5 liters) of hydrogen peroxide "

"Clean up?!
Pouring 5-10 gallons of water on it would dilute it beyond the what
little danger there was... if any."

75% to 85% H2O2 still isn't nice.

Of course, God knows what the original concentration was.




Granted H2O2 for economic reasons is shipped at %70 264 volume
strength. Unless you are buying by the tank car the chances of
getting any over 35% 132 volume is not good.

http://www.h2orange2.com/products-genl-pur-cleaning.asp

A check of several MSDS for products from the above company
show max. strength 5-8% H2O2 Drug store is 3% 10 volume,
bleaching (hair) is 6% 20 volume.

Some news reports say 10 gallons, even at 8% it is hard to see
the hazard. However, the NY FD has this really fancy Hazmat
truck — so any bureaucrat hates to see the tax payers money
wasted, especially if they can take credit, so......

After the WTC parking garage bombing the ATF brought up
their impressive bomb scene investigation truck. The FBI
brought a wheel-barrel full of money to NYC and rented
lab space at Leaman College, CUNY. As far as I know they
were never able to detect anything, a burst large water pipe
didn't help.

Reminds upon me. After the bombing the Newark, N.J. office of the
FBI sends to the New York office at 26 Federal Plaza a sample
nitroglycerin they confiscated.... someone sez Oh Shit or
same such... they then called the NYPD bomb squad to come and
remove it from the building.

Reminds me too - the FBI bomb squad was storing munitions
in the JEH building in Washington... they caught fire one night!
Someone gave me a heads-up on this years ago. A good account
was published a few ears ago in Soldier of Fortune, sorry to
say I deacquisitioned all my issues 4-years or so ago.


djh
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Three biggest lies.

I will not cum in the mail.
The check is in you mouth.
We are from the government and are here to help you.

[Edited on 17-8-2010 by The WiZard is In]
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[*] posted on 17-8-2010 at 19:39
Peroxide Spill


Depends on the purity of the H2O2. 2% would be a joke but 90% could be extremely
dangerous. At 90%, it's excellent for rocket cars by itself utilizing a silver nitrate
catalyst. I saw this combination used in the Vanishing Point rocket car. It produced
5000 LBS of thrust.

As for the 200 BlackCat firecrackers, that is a joke ! Those bureaucrats are so full
of shit they need an enema !




From opening of NCIS New Orleans - It goes a BOOM ! BOOM ! BOOM ! MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !
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[*] posted on 22-9-2010 at 05:36


you would need a shaped charge to clear an asshole so full of shit.



The practice of storing bottles of milk or beer in laboratory refrigerators is to be strongly condemned encouraged
-Vogels Textbook of Practical Organic Chemistry
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[*] posted on 25-9-2010 at 07:49


I cannot fucking believe that fireworks are illegal in the UK. Well, I can believe it but... Jesus ...

I better get off here before I black out and wake up covered in other people's blood. Again...

But wait...

If our ultimate goal is maximum safety I wonder why we haven't required people to wear helmets at all times to protect them from things (falling rocks, metorites, pianos, etc...) and themselves (falling down the stairs, texting while mountain climbing, eating cold fish etc...) We could also require people to wear thick rubber boots for the remote possibility that they will find a live wire and, not knowing of course what electricity is, touch it. Also, why even have fireworks at all? There's always a small chance something could go wrong. Let's ban hot liquids while we're at it. A few years from now a law like: "Possession of a liquid in which its atoms/molecules possess such a high average kinetic energy so as to give it a "temperature" of 50*C or greater, shall be punishable by..." may not be so absurd. 50 years ago I'm sure a lot of people would've laughed to know that 2 non-radiactive (one of them virtually harmless in its red allotrope) chemical elements would be essentially banned from private ownership.

Also, all food should be processed and premasticated before it gets to grocery store shelves to reduce the risk that someone could use a homemade knife (b/c knives should be illegal anyway) to cut food. All food will now be drinkable with a straw to prevent fork and spoon accidents. Also, since the straws can "put an eye out" they will be made of soft, hypoallergenic, flame resistent, green, non-toxic imitation rubber plastic material.

Rambling... I'll stop now.

[Edited on 9-25-2010 by MagicJigPipe]




"There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. ... We know that the only way to avoid error is to detect it and that the only way to detect it is to be free to inquire. And we know that as long as men are free to ask what they must, free to say what they think, free to think what they will, freedom can never be lost, and science can never regress." -J. Robert Oppenheimer
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[*] posted on 25-9-2010 at 09:48


Quote: Originally posted by MagicJigPipe  

If our ultimate goal is maximum safety I wonder why we haven't [snip]


New Scientist
9 vi 01

EACH YEAR around this time Feedback's favourite government report
appears-the Home and Leisure Accident Surveillance System report from
Britain's Department of Trade and Industry. It gives figures for accidents reported
by people admitted to a sample group of British hospitals and then gives
extrapolated estimates for the country as a whole.

First the bad news in this year's report, which is based on 1999 data: the toll of
accidents caused by tea cosies is up again, with a national estimate of 37 tea
cosy injuries, compared with 20 the previous year. Equally alarming, the number
of accidents caused by place mats-a menace we have paid too little attention to
in the past-is up from 157 to 165 across the country as a whole.

These worrying figures are somewhat balanced by a welcome decline in
another area of concern-sponge and loofah accidents. The shocking previous
total of 996 nationwide is now down to 787.

But the major causes of concern are still with us. The number of people
hospitalised after a trouser accident (up from 5137 to 5945) is worryingly high,
while the drop in injuries inflicted by armchairs (down from 18,690 to 16,662)
leaves little room for complacency. Hospitalisations caused by socks and tights
have also risen (10,773 compared to 9843 previously), while injuries inflicted by
vegetables remain unacceptably high at 13,132 compared with the previous
year's 12,362.

The number of accidents involving tree trunks has also risen from 1777 to
1810, while leaf accidents have soared from 664 to 1171, with a similar increase
in birdbath accidents from 117 to 311.

Many people will also be shocked by the number of accidents caused by
beanbags, which has risen from 957 to 1317. The seriousness of this menace
becomes clear when measured against the 329 injuries caused by meat cleavers
or the 439 caused by rat or mouse poison.

In fact, the report makes it clearer than ever that our homes are full of
unacknowledged dangers. It identifies 3421 people nationwide as having been
injured by clothes baskets, while other threats include dust pans (146 injuries),
bread bins (91), talcum powder (73), toiletroll holders (329), clogs (622), false
teeth (933) and wellington boots (5615).

As in the past, printed magazines like New Scientist caused far more injuries
than chainsaws-4371 compared with 1207.

So remember-you can't be too careful.


[Edited on 25-9-2010 by The WiZard is In]
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