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Mr.Alkyne
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thumbup.gif posted on 5-10-2010 at 18:25
Chemicals


Hello everyone,

I am trying to get rid of some chemicals for a friend.
The two chemicals I have left are:

- 1Kg NaBH4 (98%+ purity) --RE-PACKAGED--
- 1Kg AlCl3 anhydrous. (Sigma Aldrich ReagentPlus®, anhydrous, ≥99.9% trace metals basis) --UNOPENED--

Message me if you are interested. I will send you the price, give you details on how to place the order, payment etc.

Thanks!


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spirocycle
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 14:27


i'd imagine that suspicious chemicals like this might be hard to sell with absolutely no reputation here
but I might be wrong

are these chemicals regulated at all?
can just anyone buy them?
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ScienceSquirrel
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 14:47


Aluminium chloride is unrestricted as far as I know in the EU.
Sodium borohydride is legal and purchasable, you have to show professional qualifications or a need to buy but it has lots of uses in art restoration, etc as a strong reductant so it is not highly restricted.
I can buy both chemicals legally without fuss.
Mr Zyklon's user name is to say the least a slight put off for me!
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Mr.Alkyne
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 14:58


I am not sure what you mean by suspicious chemicals. Like many chemicals they have a wide range of uses.
These chemicals are only regulated as being hazardous for transport. To be shipped they need to be sent by ground shipping. Shipping will most likely require hazadous material fees. "can just anyone buy them?" Yea, I will sell to anyone in North America or South America...I dont see why not.
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Mr.Alkyne
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 15:03


Its just a user name I came up with randomly...i can see what you mean though...maybe i should change it.
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mewrox99
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 20:27


Yeah change your user name The term Zyklon is highly associated with the holocaust because it was the name of the pesticide used to produce HCN in the gas chambers
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Picene
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 20:41


Completely unrelated to the original topic, a few years ago the Seimens corporation attempted to registed the trademark "Zyklon" for a range of gas ovens.

This was even worse because they manufactured equipment used by the nazis and used concentration camp slave labor during world war 2.

Naturally some people got offended. You have to wonder what the fuck they were thinknig
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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 21:15


You have to wonder what they were thinking, but at the same time, Jews aren't the centre of the universe (and neither is anyone else, for that matter).

I'm more worried about the chemicals than offending anyone.




“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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peach
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[*] posted on 6-10-2010 at 23:37


I was going to make a joke about Zyklon and the AlCl3 being in a can, but thought I'd watch and wait for the predictable response to the borohydride. :D

Quite a few of the big name chemical companies were merged into IG Farben, who worked with Zkylon. The cans were then produced by another company under a different name, but the directors owned something like 50% of that company. I've been to Poland and visited the death camps, and seen the cans of it, and literally rooms full of bits of hair, glasses, clothes, a big tub of dust (full of dead people remains from the ovens, which I could help but touch), and the ovens. It's a very, very strange place and atmosphere; there will be hundreds of people stood there, shocked into silence (even the hundreds of school kids) as the guy explains what's in front of them. Only made stranger still by the place being set in the idyllic countryside. The people producing Zyklon then split back into sub companies after the war; BASF, Agfa, Bayer, Hoechst. IG Farben ended up at a millitary tribunal (the Nuremberg trials). Some directors went to jail, others were sentenced and have since been directors of the sub companies. Rudolf Höss, the director of the camp, was hung not long after, right beside the entrance to the ovens and immediately in front of the house where he and his family had lived at the camp. The gallows built for him are still there.

There is plaque on the IG building clearly stating the involvement.

You'd probably have more luck selling those if you let us all know the price upfront.

Ownership is certainly not illegal in most place. It's the assumed intent that is illegal. If all you have at your house and all you're doing is related to drugs and explosives, you're buying known materials for a known illegal process; the intent and act is illegal, the chemical isn't.

[Edited on 7-10-2010 by peach]




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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 01:55


Quote:
You'd probably have more luck selling those if you let us all know the price upfront.

Shipping all the way from Bogotá . . . ?


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Mr.Alkyne
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 06:56


Well it definitely makes me fell less comfortable selling something that can be used to make explosives or drugs. Then again I assume NaOH, muriatic acid/HCl, nitric acid etc... Which also has many uses can be used for the same thing. If I don’t sell these here I will just give them back to my friend and let him deal with it.

Anyway, here are the prices (without shipping);

- 250USD for the 1Kg NaBH4
- 150USD for the 1Kg Anhydrous AlCl3

Yes, I know the exact AlCl3 can be purchased from Sigma Aldrich for like half that, but my friend wants me to sell it for 150USD...I’d understand if it wont sell.

I am shipping from Canada. Does anyone recommend a specific courier company for shipping chemicals?

---

About the user name...
I asked the admin to change it for me...unless someone can tell me how, since I cant seem to figure it out myself.
I had no intention in offending anyone. I am not racist or anything...and I definitely DONT like what the damn Nazis did to the Jewish people.
Knowing more of the history behind it...selling a damn oven with the name Zyklon would be pretty damn horrible. I assume they went out of business. Lol

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Mr.Alkyne
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 07:08


It looks like shipping chemicals is alot harder then I though it would be... sorry to say this, but I think I would like to ship within Canada only.
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 10:40


Quote: Originally posted by Mr.Zyklon  
It looks like shipping chemicals is alot harder then I though it would be... sorry to say this, but I think I would like to ship within Canada only.


You need a dangerous goods account with a courier.
Also you can ship the USA, Ground service too.
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undead_alchemist
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 10:47


Just checked with Transport Canada.
AlCl3 can be shipped with no problems. It is a limited Quantity shipment. (ORM-D)
Can be shipped ground for Canada and the USA.
http://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/saf-sec-sur/3/sched1-ann1/schedule1r...
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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 11:25


Yeah it is hard - and usually not because of the customer base.
Now you know how hardware stores feel with regulations telling them that they can't sell spirits of salts because it's too concentrated.




“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 12:49


I visited the camps last year. Interestingly - I think as a sort of defence mechanism - whilst in the gas chambers I was thinking about the chemistry behind the blue stains on the walls, rather than on the events that had taken place in those rooms 70 years previously. I felt a bit callous because of that afterwards.

Zyklon B wasn't the original chemical used in the gas chambers. For the first year or so they used CO (produced by IC engines).
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 13:47


With only a few posts to "lose" it may be better if you simply drop the contentious forum tag name and let that one lapse as you use another name.
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 15:12


Good Idea!

Mr.Zyklon ====> Mr.StinkyGas lol ...hopefully this new username will just be funny and not offend anyone.
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 15:18


Quote: Originally posted by Mr.Zyklon  
Its just a user name I came up with randomly...i can see what you mean though...maybe i should change it.
Randomly? What were you thinking? Were you thinking? Despite your protestations I don't see how anyone could have chosen a name associated only with genocide just for the heck of it.

There's definitely something stinky here.
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ChemichaelRXN
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 15:33


I was going for a name to do with a toxic gas...didnt think about that fact it could offend others until after. I was just in a rush to make a profile so I can post my friends chemicals for sale. Thats what happened.

Other then my new username what is so stinky?


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entropy51
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 15:37


Quote: Originally posted by Mr.StinkyGas  
I was going for a name to do with a toxic gas...didnt think about that fact it could offend others until after. I was just in a rush to make a profile so I can post my friends chemicals for sale. Thats what happened.

Other then my new username what is so stinky?


Embracing a perversion of chemistry that was used for the genocide of Jews, Gypsies, Gays and Lord only knows who else.



Better to remain silent and appear a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
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ChemichaelRXN
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 15:40


Yes, not something I thought of on the spot...let it rest will you.



[Edited on 7-10-2010 by Mr.StinkyGas]
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 19:45


User renamed.



PGP Key and corresponding e-mail address
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psychokinetic
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 21:09


I knew the word Zyklon as a song before I knew anything about
If you're going to ban one murder, ban them all. But we can't do that, so let's pick on the one that killed Jews.




“If Edison had a needle to find in a haystack, he would proceed at once with the diligence of the bee to examine straw after straw until he found the object of his search.
I was a sorry witness of such doings, knowing that a little theory and calculation would have saved him ninety per cent of his labor.”
-Tesla
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[*] posted on 7-10-2010 at 22:34


Could you split the containers? The borohydride in particular, that's really expensive stuff.

After me talking about the death camps and saying how uneasy they make one feel, I also agree with Psychokinetic and already had an idea for why Mr.S.Gas had chosen that name.

There are tons of people on these forums with names related to explosives, nerve gases or death in some other way, and tons of people going on about it.

Zyklon... yeah... maybe an iffy one. But still, I can see he probably just chose that because it's a very well known, toxic chemical, and so many enjoy having toxic / contentious / dangerous / explosive related chemicals as their username. Zyklon came in tins a lot like the AlCl3, and the fumes from it, as some of you will be aware, produce a similar effect.

As mossydie says, Zyklon was one of the ways they did it. They used quite a few different methods and didn't always use purpose built gas chambers.

Jews were his prime targets, but Adolf would gladly gas a number of other people, including Germans, if they displayed none superior or impure characteristics. All because his painting were shit and no one gave him a slap early on hey...

A tourists guy to death and dining out in Poland

I was actually in Poland on a bee keepers tour and we only stopped at the camps because the coach was going past, but I'd highly recommend a visit if your in Poland. Then visit the Wieliczka salt mine. I bought bee suits whilst I was there, lots of us did, and they were about 1/4 the price of the UK ones, and better. And the guy was so happy we'd bought so much, he gave us combs of honey and wine afterwards to say thanks. The tourist guide on the coach was one of the Bob Ross's of the world, so we collected £10's together, hid them in a fluffy toy and gave him quite a lot of Zloty's at the end of the two weeks.

A definite high scorer for a holiday destination.

I've been in this room, there's lots more of these examples;


I've also been in this one. There would be clawing marks on the walls and the people would pile themselves into stacks in the room trying to climb away from the gas. Pellets dropped in through holes at the top;


And this one. ONE of the cathedrals in the salt mine (it's a lot bigger than this photo shows, with statues carved into the walls), which would take literally months to fully get round on foot. There is also a huge dining hall where Batman served us subterranean dinner in a Bond like setting;


Amusing Poland holiday trivia;

One of the women with us was an old German lady who's parents had been moved to the US as the war was ending. That tended to happen if they were trying to avoid a trial. Hmmmmmmmmm

Another woman had an episode coming out of the gas chambers and then going into the airlock in the mine. Everyone has to pack into a corridor as they close the doors at each end and count, then wait. They count to make sure people don't get lost and all mines are full of special doors, strategically positioned to keep the air flowing through the tunnels correctly. Unluckily for her, as it was 30C+ outside and the bus was like a microwave, it was nice and cool down there.

Stanley Milgram devised a psychological experiment after the war to see how easy it'd be to get everyday people, including doctors and teachers, to murder people as they did in the camps. The results.... not good. Surprisingly, given what girls think of them, men, given their more confrontational nature, are less likely to do it on demand.

[Edited on 8-10-2010 by peach]




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