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wessonsmith
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Firecracker Mix ( high VOD binary composition)
Here is a link to the VERY impressive and relatively safe mixture. NHN and ETN when properly heat treated produce a very
interesting, safe to handle, and stable binary composition. Mixed in the proper proportions the synergy between the two maximize the performance.
https://youtu.be/3HU6_bhXeks
Here is what the solid composition looks like inside the firecracker tube after proper heat treatment and once it has hardened again.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xePesyF4VLQkyfDQUZfJOAMNS3u...
And yes to answer the question will this firecracker set off my plastic, it will.
here is another video showing the firecracker's power from a different perspective. Notice how jagged the can's edges are. That's high brisance.
https://youtu.be/4nZmQ6DULxU
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
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Tsjerk
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How do you know it detonates?
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wessonsmith
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The damage it does to a piece 2 x 4 wood is similar to the damage that my #8 detonator does. I have been detonating melt-cast ETN for 3 years and the
explosive force that I witness is similar. I am sure you know the difference between detonation and deflagration when you see it, hear it, and feel
it.
I encourage you to try the mixture, in the same ratio with the same temperature and time, then you can report back at the AMAZING detonation you
witnessed
The reason I chose the cans and put them far away from the firecracker was to show the relative force generated. If I would have attached the
firecracker to the can, the most powerful version would have fragmented the can beyond meaningful comparison. The most powerful version nearly cut
the can in half at the distance shown. Plus you saw the damage that the NHN only did and NHN by it'self is considerably more powerful than flash
powder. The difference between the NHN only and the most powerful version was night and day as the can's showed.
I should note that my #8 detonator is more powerful (700mg Melt-cast ETN, 200mg powdered ETN, and 300mg NHN) as compared to the firecracker (690mg
melted ETN and 460mg NHN) but not by much.
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wessonsmith
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here is another video showing the firecracker's power from a different perspective. Notice how jagged the can's edges are. That's high brisance.
https://youtu.be/4nZmQ6DULxU
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twelti
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Are you saying that this performs better than just the ETN? If not, then why not just use the NHN as a conventional initiator for the ETN, as opposed
to mixing them together? In my experiments so far, I am using a VERY thin layer of inert material (Saran wrap or similar) between the initiator and
charge, just to prevent any possible incompatibility. it is also convenient, as it allows me to make the main charge and primary in separate tubes
and just slide them together at the end, after any pressing. The smaller initiator tube fits easily in the larger main charge tube so minimal force
is required. Then i use epoxy to hold it together and add additional strain relief on the fuse. I'm a little paranoid about incompatibility with the
epoxy however, and looking into non-amine hardeners.
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wessonsmith
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Quote: Originally posted by twelti  | | Are you saying that this performs better than just the ETN? If not, then why not just use the NHN as a conventional initiator for the ETN, as opposed
to mixing them together? In my experiments so far, I am using a VERY thin layer of inert material (Saran wrap or similar) between the initiator and
charge, just to prevent any possible incompatibility. it is also convenient, as it allows me to make the main charge and primary in separate tubes
and just slide them together at the end, after any pressing. The smaller initiator tube fits easily in the larger main charge tube so minimal force
is required. Then i use epoxy to hold it together and add additional strain relief on the fuse. I'm a little paranoid about incompatibility with the
epoxy however, and looking into non-amine hardeners. |
The firecracker is ETN so it's the same power however this is for my paper firecracker tubes only. My det tubes use Melt-cast ETN, powdered ETN and
NHN all pressed one on top of the other. ETN and NHN do not negatively react with one another so no need to separate them. What I have done here is
made the most powerful firecracker you can make which is safer to mix and load than flash powder. Even if you filled the tube with LA, this cracker
would be more powerful, and that's saying something.
What makes it powerful is how the melting ETN and NHN combine to form a solid that when properly heated detonates with a Visco fuse.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
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underground
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Why does heating increase the power ? It removes traces of water or what ?
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wessonsmith
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| Quote: Originally posted by twelti | | Are you saying that this performs better than just the ETN? If not, then why not just use the NHN as a conventional initiator for the ETN, as opposed
to mixing them together? In my experiments so far, I am using a VERY thin layer of inert material (Saran wrap or similar) between the initiator and
charge, just to prevent any possible incompatibility. it is also convenient, as it allows me to make the main charge and primary in separate tubes
and just slide them together at the end, after any pressing. The smaller initiator tube fits easily in the larger main charge tube so minimal force
is required. Then i use epoxy to hold it together and add additional strain relief on the fuse. I'm a little paranoid about incompatibility with the
epoxy however, and looking into non-amine hardeners. |
I use this Epoxy with my det tubes. The Melt-cast ETN touches it. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006945SS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b...
I have tubes that are 2 yrs old, no issues.
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twelti
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| Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith | | Quote: Originally posted by twelti | | Are you saying that this performs better than just the ETN? If not, then why not just use the NHN as a conventional initiator for the ETN, as opposed
to mixing them together? In my experiments so far, I am using a VERY thin layer of inert material (Saran wrap or similar) between the initiator and
charge, just to prevent any possible incompatibility. it is also convenient, as it allows me to make the main charge and primary in separate tubes
and just slide them together at the end, after any pressing. The smaller initiator tube fits easily in the larger main charge tube so minimal force
is required. Then i use epoxy to hold it together and add additional strain relief on the fuse. I'm a little paranoid about incompatibility with the
epoxy however, and looking into non-amine hardeners. |
The firecracker is ETN so it's the same power however this is for my paper firecracker tubes only. My det tubes use Melt-cast ETN, powdered ETN and
NHN all pressed one on top of the other. ETN and NHN do not negatively react with one another so no need to separate them. What I have done here is
made the most powerful firecracker you can make which is safer to mix and load than flash powder. Even if you filled the tube with LA, this cracker
would be more powerful, and that's saying something.
What makes it powerful is how the melting ETN and NHN combine to form a solid that when properly heated detonates with a Visco fuse.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith] |
I'm not sure you answered my question though. is the mixed NHN/ETN more powerful than the straight cast ETN? ...and what is the advantage of it
being solid? Does the density go up? Are you thinking of making shaped charges?
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twelti
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| Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith | | Quote: Originally posted by twelti | | Are you saying that this performs better than just the ETN? If not, then why not just use the NHN as a conventional initiator for the ETN, as opposed
to mixing them together? In my experiments so far, I am using a VERY thin layer of inert material (Saran wrap or similar) between the initiator and
charge, just to prevent any possible incompatibility. it is also convenient, as it allows me to make the main charge and primary in separate tubes
and just slide them together at the end, after any pressing. The smaller initiator tube fits easily in the larger main charge tube so minimal force
is required. Then i use epoxy to hold it together and add additional strain relief on the fuse. I'm a little paranoid about incompatibility with the
epoxy however, and looking into non-amine hardeners. |
I use this Epoxy with my det tubes. The Melt-cast ETN touches it. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006945SS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b...
I have tubes that are 2 yrs old, no issues. |
I like the putty for all kinds of stuff, but have been using a more flowing epoxy for dets 9the way i make them anyways). So far no issues, but i did
read in Agrawal about some possible reactivity of amine hardeners.
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wessonsmith
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No, the heating as best as I can tell creates a pores bone like solid that somehow allows the mixture to detonate. As my video shows, not getting the
heating right will result in a failure. The one that was heated at a 200F performed worse than the one heated at 185F. If it's heated too fast the
ETN melts in such a way as to ruin the porous structure which is allowing the detonation to take place.
Believe me, I was shocked when I saw it first detonate with the proper heat treatment applied.
Both powders are dry when mixed, so no water is present when heated. As you saw the non-heated version exploded but was very weak as compared to the
heat-treated version.
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wessonsmith
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Image of the poreous solid
Here is what the composition looks like inside the firecracker tube. Notice the porous nature of the solid. It's this porosity that allows it to
detonate.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xePesyF4VLQkyfDQUZfJOAMNS3u...
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wessonsmith
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| Quote: Originally posted by twelti | | Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith | | Quote: Originally posted by twelti | | Are you saying that this performs better than just the ETN? If not, then why not just use the NHN as a conventional initiator for the ETN, as opposed
to mixing them together? In my experiments so far, I am using a VERY thin layer of inert material (Saran wrap or similar) between the initiator and
charge, just to prevent any possible incompatibility. it is also convenient, as it allows me to make the main charge and primary in separate tubes
and just slide them together at the end, after any pressing. The smaller initiator tube fits easily in the larger main charge tube so minimal force
is required. Then i use epoxy to hold it together and add additional strain relief on the fuse. I'm a little paranoid about incompatibility with the
epoxy however, and looking into non-amine hardeners. |
The firecracker is ETN so it's the same power however this is for my paper firecracker tubes only. My det tubes use Melt-cast ETN, powdered ETN and
NHN all pressed one on top of the other. ETN and NHN do not negatively react with one another so no need to separate them. What I have done here is
made the most powerful firecracker you can make which is safer to mix and load than flash powder. Even if you filled the tube with LA, this cracker
would be more powerful, and that's saying something.
What makes it powerful is how the melting ETN and NHN combine to form a solid that when properly heated detonates with a Visco fuse.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith] |
I'm not sure you answered my question though. is the mixed NHN/ETN more powerful than the straight cast ETN? ...and what is the advantage of it
being solid? Does the density go up? Are you thinking of making shaped charges? |
So the whole point to this composition is to have something that can detonate in a paper tube. NHN pressed on top of ETN in a paper tube will not
detonate the ETN. NHN needs stronger confinement for it to work. Straight melt-cast is stronger but you would need something like LA to set it off in
a paper tube. I suppose I can use a chunk of this melted sold composition as the initiator for the melt cast but too much extra effort for not that
much more power.
What makes this composition shine is its simplicity. Add the powder to the tub, press down and heat, that's it. It will detonate from a Visco fuse.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
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twelti
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I assume these results are repeatable?
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wessonsmith
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I have tested 20+ so far and every time BOOOM! So, yes absolutely repeatable.
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Tsjerk
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Not saying anything.
Can you put finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminium powder (same weight) in the same tube and repeat the experiments? The fact it has high
brisance doesn't convince me it actually detonates.
Edit: when you have an idea you forgot to post, you can use the "edit" function.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by Tsjerk]
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twelti
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| Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith | | Quote: Originally posted by twelti | | Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith |
I'm not sure you answered my question though. is the mixed NHN/ETN more powerful than the straight cast ETN? ...and what is the advantage of it
being solid? Does the density go up? Are you thinking of making shaped charges? |
So the whole point to this composition is to have something that can detonate in a paper tube. NHN pressed on top of ETN in a paper tube will not
detonate the ETN. NHN needs stronger confinement for it to work. Straight melt-cast is stronger but you would need something like LA to set it off in
a paper tube. I suppose I can use a chunk of this melted sold composition has the initiator for the melt cast but too much extra effort for not that
much more power.
What makes this composition shine is its simplicity. Add the powdered to the tub, press down and heat, that's it. It will detonate from a Visco
fuse. |
Ah, I see. I'm going to try my AQNP on some ETN in a straw. I think it would detonate it. Of course, it depends on the amount. I'm been using
maybe 50 mg recently, sometimes up to 70, of AQNP. |
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underground
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Interesting. Although CHP composition from LL is still very attractive. The only downside is the use of perchlorate salts but still better that
hydrazine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV9Pv3Jdtak
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by underground]
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wessonsmith
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| Quote: Originally posted by Tsjerk |
Not saying anything.
Can you put finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminium powder (same weight) in the same tube and repeat the experiments? The fact it has high
brisance doesn't convince me it actually detonates.
Edit: when you have an idea you forgot to post, you can use the "edit" function.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by Tsjerk] |
No need for me to do that. NHN by its self is more powerful than finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder so the fact that the heated
composition outperforms NHN CONSIDERABLY would mean that it would also outperform finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder.
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Tsjerk
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| Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith |
No need for me to do that. NHN by its self is more powerful than finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder so the fact that the heated
composition outperforms NHN CONSIDERABLY would mean that it would also outperform finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder.
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Did you test it?
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underground
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1g of loose CHP will detonate w/o any confinement
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wessonsmith
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| Quote: Originally posted by Tsjerk | | Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith |
No need for me to do that. NHN by its self is more powerful than finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder so the fact that the heated
composition outperforms NHN CONSIDERABLY would mean that it would also outperform finely powdered KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder.
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Did you test it? |
No I did not test it. I am basing my assumption on one, the most powerful flash powder mixture that I know of was the US military’s M80
composition. Which had a reported .8 RE factor. FYI, the US military stopped using that composition because it was way too dangerous.
And NHN has an RE factor of 1.05 and the NHN/ETN composition mixture when melted has an RE factor of approximately 1.35. Are you suggesting that
KClO4 / dark German aluminum powder has an RE factor greater than 1?
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
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wessonsmith
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I just watched LL's CHP video. I didn't see him detonate CHP in the open. Heated in Aluminum foil, it did detonate, but then again so will ETN.
My composition is detonating with Visco fuse only in a paper tube.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
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underground
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| Quote: Originally posted by wessonsmith |
I just watched LL's CHP video. I didn't see him detonate CHP in the open. Heated in Aluminum foil, it did detonate, but then again so will ETN.
My composition is detonating with Visco fuse only in a paper tube.
[Edited on 1-7-2019 by wessonsmith] |
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTYNiabQl8w
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wessonsmith
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FYI that still qualifies as confinement. LL is a great contributor to SM.
1 g of NHN in a plastic straw. No need for the NHN/ETN test, that stuff is WAYYY more powerful.
https://youtu.be/ZKkYYBPkC2M
| Quote: |
CHP requires solid (usually metal) cavity for reliable Deflagration - Detonation Transfer (DDT or D2D marked). With inner diameter 4 - 8 mm. Usually
1/4 inch (6,35 mm). Details were described here on S-M.... ...LL
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NHN/ETN heat treated does not. I am in no way trying to dimish CHP. It's an amazing energetic that is easy to make. Contributors like LL make this
community what it is
[Edited on 2-7-2019 by wessonsmith]
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