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thors.lab
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[*] posted on 15-8-2019 at 00:36
Getting Hydrogen Peroxide 30%


So, H2O2 is pretty useful.

In particular, I'd like to have it for neutralizations of my waste chemicals by making Fenton's Reagent or Piranha.

Unfortunately, I can't find any company that will sell H2O2 30% to individuals. Additionally, it seems pretty impossible to create on a home-lab scale.

Does anybody have a solution?




Please check out my latest video: Synthesizing Nitrobenzene, and the last one:
Making Nitric Acid.
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Ubya
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[*] posted on 15-8-2019 at 01:12


http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=15881

if you search the board you'll find many threads about this topic.
you can heat the 3% solution in a spotless clean beaker to 70°C IIRC, some H2O2 will decompose, but the concentration should still rise.
another method us to use a desiccant, like sulphuric acid. put a beaker of 3% H2O2 in a desiccator( a big jar) with some concentrated sulphuric acid on the bottom and leave it in the dark, it is a slow process but it works.
anyway, search in the forum





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[*] posted on 15-8-2019 at 04:40


Quote: Originally posted by thors.lab  
So, H2O2 is pretty useful.

In particular, I'd like to have it for neutralizations of my waste chemicals by making Fenton's Reagent or Piranha.

Unfortunately, I can't find any company that will sell H2O2 30% to individuals. Additionally, it seems pretty impossible to create on a home-lab scale.

Does anybody have a solution?


Where do you live country & state? That would help a lot as to what is available.

I have an excellent source of 30, 35 and 50% food grade (or higher) H2O2 at awesome prices and depending on how much you need, I may be able to ship it to you USPS as they allow ground shipping for certain concentrations beclow a certain amount.

OTOH, UPS & Fedex offer shipping for larger amounts (gallons to to 15-20gal drums) of up to 60% IIRC, but you have to go through a Hazmat training class first. There may be a way to ship smaller amounts like 16-32 oz of < 20%.

You have other options, IDK what strength you need bt ordering sodium percarbonate supposedly makesH2O2 in solution with sodium carbonate. I've heard claims from 13.5% up to 33% which is odd b/c there is also sodium peroxyborate which produces the same H2O2% + borate - both are used n cleaning as laundry boosters or disinfectants.

Another option is buying some ureaperoxide (maybe it has a different name, IDK) but I think this has 33% H2O2 once dissolved.


Finally you can go through freezing & pouring off liquid - repeat and you'll finally get a fairl stronge peroxide. IDK if this would be faster to start with the sodium percarbonate or sodium perborate, but would be interesting to find out. Another option is to use H2O2 to dissolve the percarbonate & perborate, so the concentratin starts off 3% higher (or even more like 6-9% if you freeze concentrated your 3% H2O2 to start)

Admittedly this is a lot of work and I can tell you there ARE places that sell high "test" H2O2 to the public, please send me your city/town and general area/zipcode you use and I'll see what I can find.

How much do you need of say 35%, or even 20%?
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[*] posted on 15-8-2019 at 05:56


Baquashock (or Baquacil? Can't remember which one) is a pool chemical that is 27% H2O2. I've used that for a couple things before with success. It's a pool chemical, though, so it may have stabilizers or other ingredients that may interfere with some reactions.
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[*] posted on 15-8-2019 at 06:04


Quote: Originally posted by thors.lab  
So, H2O2 is pretty useful.

In particular, I'd like to have it for neutralizations of my waste chemicals by making Fenton's Reagent or Piranha.

Unfortunately, I can't find any company that will sell H2O2 30% to individuals. Additionally, it seems pretty impossible to create on a home-lab scale.

Does anybody have a solution?


I can sell it to you elsewhere in the world you live. FOB price (without shipping cost): USD15 a liter of 35% hydrogen peroxide 130 vol or USD20 a liter of 50% hydrogen peroxide 200 vol.

I own a Chemical Lab company and sell every kind of chemicals, even rare or exotics to individuals or other companies at domestic and international market. See my announce here:

http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=151915

Send me a U2U.

Regards,

Chemi Pharma

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RogueRose
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[*] posted on 15-8-2019 at 13:47


Just out of curiosity would Urea peroxide aka carbamide, be useful? It is 30-35% H2O2.
Also sodium percarbonate is 35% H2O2 by mass

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_peroxide_-_urea
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_percarbonate

IIRC, there might be ways to neutralize the sodium carbonate to leave you with H2O2. I would think that maybe neutralization with H2SO4 and then chilling to zero C or below (which really drops solubility of Na2SO4 a lot) leaving behind mostly H2O2 with a little Na2SO4 in solution. IDK if that would work for your application, but I would think it wouldn't if all you are doing is neutralizing some waste products. I would stay on the safe side of having excess carbonate instead of allowing it to become acidic, though IDK if that is necessary.

You should be able to find sodium percarb just about anywhere and it shouldn't have any problems with shipping restrictions.

If you want to keep the H2O2 as strong as possible, I suggest you use a pre-determined concentration of H2SO4 that will allow the water in the acid to hydrate the carbonate to the 35% while also keeping the Na2SO4 in as low a hydrate form as possible, though IDK if the acid is too strong whether it will decompose any H2O2 that is evolved/released in the process.

Anyone else know the mechanism of rehydrating Na2CO3x1.5H2O2 with something like diluted H2SO4? IS this possible w/o destroying the H2O2 in the process?

[Edited on 8-15-2019 by RogueRose]
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[*] posted on 17-8-2019 at 02:14


Hydroponics uses 29% H2O2 for sanitation and O2. Try looking in that area
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thors.lab
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[*] posted on 17-8-2019 at 10:22


Quote: Originally posted by Ubya  
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=15881

if you search the board you'll find many threads about this topic.
you can heat the 3% solution in a spotless clean beaker to 70°C IIRC, some H2O2 will decompose, but the concentration should still rise.
another method us to use a desiccant, like sulphuric acid. put a beaker of 3% H2O2 in a desiccator( a big jar) with some concentrated sulphuric acid on the bottom and leave it in the dark, it is a slow process but it works.
anyway, search in the forum


How do I test the concentration to find out of this is working?




Please check out my latest video: Synthesizing Nitrobenzene, and the last one:
Making Nitric Acid.
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thors.lab
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[*] posted on 17-8-2019 at 10:26


Quote: Originally posted by RogueRose  
Quote: Originally posted by thors.lab  
So, H2O2 is pretty useful.

In particular, I'd like to have it for neutralizations of my waste chemicals by making Fenton's Reagent or Piranha.

Unfortunately, I can't find any company that will sell H2O2 30% to individuals. Additionally, it seems pretty impossible to create on a home-lab scale.

Does anybody have a solution?


Where do you live country & state? That would help a lot as to what is available.

I have an excellent source of 30, 35 and 50% food grade (or higher) H2O2 at awesome prices and depending on how much you need, I may be able to ship it to you USPS as they allow ground shipping for certain concentrations beclow a certain amount.

OTOH, UPS & Fedex offer shipping for larger amounts (gallons to to 15-20gal drums) of up to 60% IIRC, but you have to go through a Hazmat training class first. There may be a way to ship smaller amounts like 16-32 oz of < 20%.

You have other options, IDK what strength you need bt ordering sodium percarbonate supposedly makesH2O2 in solution with sodium carbonate. I've heard claims from 13.5% up to 33% which is odd b/c there is also sodium peroxyborate which produces the same H2O2% + borate - both are used n cleaning as laundry boosters or disinfectants.

Another option is buying some ureaperoxide (maybe it has a different name, IDK) but I think this has 33% H2O2 once dissolved.


Finally you can go through freezing & pouring off liquid - repeat and you'll finally get a fairl stronge peroxide. IDK if this would be faster to start with the sodium percarbonate or sodium perborate, but would be interesting to find out. Another option is to use H2O2 to dissolve the percarbonate & perborate, so the concentratin starts off 3% higher (or even more like 6-9% if you freeze concentrated your 3% H2O2 to start)

Admittedly this is a lot of work and I can tell you there ARE places that sell high "test" H2O2 to the public, please send me your city/town and general area/zipcode you use and I'll see what I can find.

How much do you need of say 35%, or even 20%?


Thank you for your help! I live in California. I’ll PM you my area. I probably don’t need more than a liter, I just want to be able to neutralize waste as I make it (currently sitting on jars of nitrobenzene and benzene waste I want to get rid of).




Please check out my latest video: Synthesizing Nitrobenzene, and the last one:
Making Nitric Acid.
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thors.lab
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[*] posted on 17-8-2019 at 10:30


Quote: Originally posted by Chemi Pharma  
Quote: Originally posted by thors.lab  
So, H2O2 is pretty useful.

In particular, I'd like to have it for neutralizations of my waste chemicals by making Fenton's Reagent or Piranha.

Unfortunately, I can't find any company that will sell H2O2 30% to individuals. Additionally, it seems pretty impossible to create on a home-lab scale.

Does anybody have a solution?


I can sell it to you elsewhere in the world you live. FOB price (without shipping cost): USD15 a liter of 35% hydrogen peroxide 130 vol or USD20 a liter of 50% hydrogen peroxide 200 vol.

I own a Chemical Lab company and sell every kind of chemicals, even rare or exotics to individuals or other companies at domestic and international market. See my announce here:

http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=151915

Send me a U2U.

Regards,

Chemi Pharma



Thank you! Do you have an estimate of how much shipping to California would be? I'm not looking to buy in bulk so the shipping cost may outweigh the price of the chemicals themselves.




Please check out my latest video: Synthesizing Nitrobenzene, and the last one:
Making Nitric Acid.
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icelake
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[*] posted on 17-8-2019 at 11:55


Quote: Originally posted by thors.lab  

How do I test the concentration to find out of this is working?


A simple titration by potassium permanganate will do.
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[*] posted on 18-8-2019 at 08:09


Density. Concentrated peroxide can be evaporated to about anhydrous over sulfuric acid, the Russians say. This doesn't happen in the oven or in dry air, where IME concentrating the 3%, the products lose oxygen on storage until the container bursts. (I've always used the original plastic bottle that vents at the cap after developing alarming pressure.) Will a little 3% and its level of stabilizer and impurities play nice when concentrated over a lot of sulfuric acid?



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