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Author: Subject: A day of summer chemistry.
Syn the Sizer
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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 10:44
A day of summer chemistry.


I have a couple friends who have been interested in doing a little "fun" chemistry. I was thinking of a day project that is fun and not dangerous to do with people who aren't even hobby chemists and can demonstrate some techniques.

I was thinking start with an extraction of ASA from 20 500mg Aspirin do demonstrate and extraction. Hydrolyze half of it to salicylic acid to demonstrate hydrolysis, then re-crystallize bot to demonstrate re-crystallization and purification.

Meanwhile as the products are drying with air to speed it up. I was thinking of making basic copper carbonate with copper sulfate and sodium carbonate to demonstrate a double replacement reaction and how solubility can change by mixing 2 soluble products.

From there since the products don't need to be super dry I would demonstrate the synthesis of an organometalic compound by synthesizing copper acetylsalicylate.

To finish the day a synthesis of methylsalicylate to demonstrate fischer esterification which they can take home.

The most dangerous part is handling the sulfuric acid and HCl and everything is OTC, but I would be using 98% reagent grade sulfuric acid.

I have been in the midst of preparing to move and haven't been doing much chemistry right now but was planning in the summer running through this with a couple friends.

Any thoughts or concerns?

[Edited on 1-7-2020 by Syn the Sizer]
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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 10:52


Nice! (And happy Canada Day!)

But copper acetlysalicylate isn't organometallic- there is no copper-carbon bond present.




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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 10:58


Quote: Originally posted by DraconicAcid  
Nice! (And happy Canada Day!)

But copper acetlysalicylate isn't organometallic- there is no copper-carbon bond present.


Thanks for the correction, I will have to correct my Organic instructor lol. Is it a complex?

Thanks for the Canada Day and I don't know if you are in Canada but Happy Canada day to you too.
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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 12:37


It's a chelated complex.
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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 12:42


Yes, that makes sense.
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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 12:56


The anion may be coordinated to the copper(II) cation, but I don't see the use in considering it a complex rather than a simple carboxylate salt. Nobody calls copper(II) acetate an organometallic compound, and very few people care that it's actually dimeric and has a copper-copper bond; I suspect the acetylsalicylate has a similar structure. if it stayed coordinated in solution, then the distinction would be important, but copper(II) acetylsalicylate doesn't have much solution chemistry of importance.

If you expand your definitions of various kinds of chemistry, you dilute the usefulness of the term. If I have a book on organometallic chemistry, and it spends 75% of the text on carboxylate salts, it's not useful for organometallic chemistry.




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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 17:22


Well, I was going to suggest ASA myself, but now I don't need to.
:)
Not sure what kind of friends these are, but, if appropriate, you could always spice things up with a good old rock candy smoke bomb or two, during the reflux steps maybe.




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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 18:09


@DraconicAcid What would you consider it.

Quote: Originally posted by Chemorg42  
Well, I was going to suggest ASA myself, but now I don't need to.
:)
Not sure what kind of friends these are, but, if appropriate, you could always spice things up with a good old rock candy smoke bomb or two, during the reflux steps maybe.


I am sure these friends would love that.
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[*] posted on 1-7-2020 at 23:14


A very nice one, which I did at a kids party (12 year old kids) was a mix of 5 grams of Sr-nitrate, 2 grams of magnesium/aluminium alloy (a.k.a. magnalium), 1 gram of sulphur, 2 grams of finely powdered PVC. This mix burns with a lovely bright red flame. The PVC is essential, without it, you get a dull yellow/orange color. The chlorine from the PVC gives the red color. Any other material, containing a lot of chlorine, also can be used (e.g. chlorinated rubber). Even some SrCl2, mixed into the material, can be used.

Use fine powders. PVC powder can be made with a little saw or a file from PVC tubing. Getting 2 grams of powder does not take that much time. I think that the Mg/Al can be replaced by Mg or Al, but I used what I had available at that time. The mix must be put on a concrete tile, in a line of 20 cm or so, not on a single heap. Light the line of mix with a propane burner at one end. Fun is guaranteed!

Barium nitrate also is very nice, it gives a deep green flame, but the smoke of this is fairly toxic. With non-chemist people in a group, it is hard to avoid some inhalation of the smoke, so I decided not to do the barium variation.




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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 08:34


That sounds fun, I will consider that too. Anything with nice coloured flames is always exciting.
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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 11:58


Quote: Originally posted by Syn the Sizer  
@DraconicAcid What would you consider it.


Honestly, just a carboxylate salt.




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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 14:27


Sounds good.
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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 15:05


That sounds like a really interesting demo, woelen. I am guessing the same might be done with copper nitrate, calcium nitrate, lithium, potassium and sodium nitrates. I don't have the strontium salt (I thought I did), but I can do all the others.
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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 16:06


Reminds me of a rather more exotic demo that I did with Brain&Force several years ago. He came to visit with his lanthanides collection. We took some ytterbium and samarium powders, and some PTFE plumbing tape, and wrapped pieces of the tape tightly, lengthwise, around lines of the metal powders. Lighting one end would cause it to burn down the line like a fuse. Ytterbium yielded an intense green color and samarium a bright red.



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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 18:20


Still one of my favourites is "Miniature explosions in a test tube"
https://woelen.homescience.net/science/chem/exps/mini-expl/i...




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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 20:50


These are all great ideas. I will consider adding more to the day since what I originally planned really isn't that much.
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[*] posted on 2-7-2020 at 23:12


@j_sum1: With copper nitrate it does not work, there is too much water of crystallization in copper nitrate. With calcium nitrate and potassium nitrate the effect is not that interesting. The strength of the flame colors is not sufficient for these metals. The white of the Mg/Al and orange glow overwhelm the color of the Ca-flame or K-flame. With sodium nitrate you get an intense yellow/orange flame, and with lithium nitrate you get a red color, much like that of strontium. The strontium variation is much cheaper though. A really nice one is cesium, which gives a beautiful cyan/blue, but unfortunately Cs-salts are very expensive. I have done some flame color experiments on a small scale with Cs though:

https://woelen.homescience.net/science/chem/exps/barium_brom...

What can be interesting is using KNO3, with a little anhydrous CuCl2 added, or even better, copper oxychloride, which is a basic copper(II) chloride. The latter is a perfectly dry green powder. A mix of KNO3, copper (oxy)chloride, sulphur, Mg/Al and a little PVC most likely will give a nice green color.




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[*] posted on 26-7-2020 at 22:00


Quote: Originally posted by Texium (zts16)  
Reminds me of a rather more exotic demo that I did with Brain&Force several years ago. He came to visit with his lanthanides collection. We took some ytterbium and samarium powders, and some PTFE plumbing tape, and wrapped pieces of the tape tightly, lengthwise, around lines of the metal powders. Lighting one end would cause it to burn down the line like a fuse. Ytterbium yielded an intense green color and samarium a bright red.


Ah yes, I was thinking of this recently! I finally got access to my lanthanides again, and I have some plumbers tape...I just need a file now. I now have some erbium and thulium and I think I'll test those out as well...I just can't do it in my apartment.




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[*] posted on 27-7-2020 at 14:13


Quote: Originally posted by woelen  
A very nice one, which I did at a kids party (12 year old kids) was a mix of 5 grams of Sr-nitrate, 2 grams of magnesium/aluminium alloy (a.k.a. magnalium), 1 gram of sulphur, 2 grams of finely powdered PVC. This mix burns with a lovely bright red flame. The PVC is essential, without it, you get a dull yellow/orange color. The chlorine from the PVC gives the red color. Any other material, containing a lot of chlorine, also can be used (e.g. chlorinated rubber). Even some SrCl2, mixed into the material, can be used.

Use fine powders. PVC powder can be made with a little saw or a file from PVC tubing. Getting 2 grams of powder does not take that much time. I think that the Mg/Al can be replaced by Mg or Al, but I used what I had available at that time. The mix must be put on a concrete tile, in a line of 20 cm or so, not on a single heap. Light the line of mix with a propane burner at one end. Fun is guaranteed!

Barium nitrate also is very nice, it gives a deep green flame, but the smoke of this is fairly toxic. With non-chemist people in a group, it is hard to avoid some inhalation of the smoke, so I decided not to do the barium variation.


man, have this stuff laying around, except I have parlon instead of pvc. still a chlorine donor,




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