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Author: Subject: Novel Ketene synthesis - First time poster, long time reader
deadrush
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[*] posted on 13-7-2023 at 04:35
Novel Ketene synthesis - First time poster, long time reader


Erbium oxide and acetic acid can be reacted to form Erbium acetate trihydrate. From there, Erbium acetate can be heated to 310°C to release ketene.
I am not an expert in chemistry (only an undergraduate degree), but from what I've read, this works. Erbium oxide is available in select (read: rare) ceramic / pottery supply shops.
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[*] posted on 13-7-2023 at 04:40


Quote: Originally posted by deadrush  
from what I've read, this works.
Where? Please cite your source.

One issue I would anticipate is that pottery grade metal oxides are often very inert, due to calcination, so erbium oxide of that grade may not dissolve in acetic acid.




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[*] posted on 13-7-2023 at 08:44


aside from the fact ketene is very dangerous.



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clearly_not_atara
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[*] posted on 13-7-2023 at 19:40


Quote:
from what I've read

From what I've read, the sky is green.

Where are you reading this, exactly?




[Edited on 04-20-1969 by clearly_not_atara]
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[*] posted on 13-7-2023 at 20:16


Whether it could be a useful preparation I don't know, but this supports ketene as a decomposition product of erbium acetate:


Erbium oxide from erbium acetate hydrate; formation, characterization and catalytic activity. G.A.M. Hussein 2001 Powder Technology, Volume 118, Issue 3, Pages 285-290,
https://doi.org/10.1016/S0032-5910(00)00384-3.

Quote:
The thermal processes involved during the decomposition course of hydrated erbium acetate (Er(CH3COO)3·4H2O) up to 800°C in an atmosphere of static air were monitored by non-isothermal gravimetry and differential thermal analyses. The gaseous decomposition products were identified by IR spectroscopy. Intermediates and final solid products were characterized by IR spectroscopy, X-ray diffraction (XRD) and scanning electron microscopy (SEM). The results showed that Er acetate dehydrates completely in one step and decomposes to Er2O3 at 590°C through three noncrystalline unstable intermediates. The volatile decomposition products from the acetate are water vapor, acetic acid, ketene and acetone. Er2O3 obtained from ErAc at 800°C has large porous particles with surface area of 55 m2/g. Er2O3 obtained catalyzes the decomposition of acetone to give methane and isobutene.



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[*] posted on 14-7-2023 at 02:18


Quote: Originally posted by arkoma  
aside from the fact ketene is very dangerous.

I assumed that was the point.
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clearly_not_atara
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[*] posted on 14-7-2023 at 04:07


Quote: Originally posted by mayko  
Whether it could be a useful preparation I don't know, but this supports ketene as a decomposition product of erbium acetate:

Well I'll be. Complete dehydration of a metal acetate is already unusual. And the DTA is quite promising. But the isolation of ketene or AA was not achieved.

The article says that the same behavior was observed in dysprosium at 355 C. Maybe some further consideration of the lanthanides is warranted.



[Edited on 14-7-2023 by clearly_not_atara]




[Edited on 04-20-1969 by clearly_not_atara]
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