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SM2
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[*] posted on 15-9-2012 at 12:15
We all know that talking about how to make


illicit drugs on these bulletin boards is taboo. Never less, there is some side discussion and refinements. Allusions to the drug or precursor. And that drug is almost always an amphetaminel Which is so boring. Why is there not stealthy discussion regarding opioids?
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Rogeryermaw
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[*] posted on 15-9-2012 at 17:24


or psychedelics or cannabinoids for that matter? because meth is an epidemic. the customer base for meth is huge and the profit margin is extremely wide. many dealers who have dealt in pot or coke, who have added meth to their lineup have dropped other drugs to concentrate on meth. that is also, usually, when they get sloppy and end up in prison. and forget about opioids and psychedelics, from the high cost to procure to the spotty availability, dealers won't bother. that's why all the kiddie cooks who come sniffing around here want to ask about meth. it is one of the easiest to synthesize, easiest to get precursors for and easiest to make money on.

that said, i don't know why any talk about it at all is ever permitted. it is chemistry, yes. but it is also responsible for tremendous loss of life.
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hyfalcon
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[*] posted on 16-9-2012 at 03:05


Rogeryermaw, let them cook. This old earth is groaning under over 6 billion people. The herd is in need of thinning. If they want to activate their very own Darwin award, more power to them I say. I won't be touching THAT poison. Now the others that were brought up.....
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cyanureeves
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[*] posted on 16-9-2012 at 06:04


it is the nature of the drug that is why. opioid users are a different type,they are mellow and hide in other circles. speeders are like tornadoes and heroin users just eventually die with the exception of keith richards.psychedelics are unpredictable and users dont really drop acid and go to work. i extracted DMT from mimsoa hostilis after hearing about spirituality visions and such on youtube and found it to be a ghastly Frightening experience.personally i think entheogenics are a way of plants to keep from being eaten by animals. i suffered six hours of severe chest pains when i took hawaiian baby woodrose seeds but i kid you not that it cured a headache i had for years that tylenol couldn't.i have always been curious how all the procedures of meth making fall into place especially the ammonia and lithium. that youtube video (Solvation of Electrons in Ammonia)by reaction factory is the best thing i have seen and put a curve on my curiousity search for illegal crap and good thing too.
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Endimion17
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[*] posted on 16-9-2012 at 06:50


If the policy of this forum would ever change to allow drug cooking discussions (especially meth), I'd leave immediately. I have a very low tolerance for things that undermine the society.
SM's rules are already too meek regarding ramblings in favor of American nationalism and pseudoscience, and there's no infraction system installed, allowing trolls to keep trolling. Meth cooking would certainly be "a litre that spilled the glass".

If someone wants to talk about easy meth oven, there are probably forums built around it. SM is about science. Let's keep it clean.




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woelen
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SM2
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[*] posted on 16-9-2012 at 17:21


There are powerful narcotics which are far easier than meth, to synth.
Quote: Originally posted by Rogeryermaw  
or psychedelics or cannabinoids for that matter? because meth is an epidemic. the customer base for meth is huge and the profit margin is extremely wide. many dealers who have dealt in pot or coke, who have added meth to their lineup have dropped other drugs to concentrate on meth. that is also, usually, when they get sloppy and end up in prison. and forget about opioids and psychedelics, from the high cost to procure to the spotty availability, dealers won't bother. that's why all the kiddie cooks who come sniffing around here want to ask about meth. it is one of the easiest to synthesize, easiest to get precursors for and easiest to make money on.

that said, i don't know why any talk about it at all is ever permitted. it is chemistry, yes. but it is also responsible for tremendous loss of life.
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Rogeryermaw
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[*] posted on 16-9-2012 at 19:18


i don't really see all drug discussion as detrimental to what we do here. i think some of it is actually quite relevant to legit chemistry. in addition, there are many compounds that have been outlawed that have perfectly legitimate pharmaceutical uses. the only "wrong" they have done is to cut into the pockets of the rich elite. i'm not trying to advocate the undermining of the forum rules, just saying that discussion of some psychoactive compounds is quite fascinating, from their discovery, to their chemical manipulation and their activity on different receptors in the brain. even the way the body disposes of chemicals and what metabolites end up in which secretions. sure, if i wanted a complete synthesis of mescaline sulfate, i could easily find it on erowid or the shroomery, but if i want a truly scientific discussion from people with actual education and the ability to give clear, concise answers, i can't go where everyone is swim or a friend of my dog's pet turtle or some retarded shit. all i can get there are anecdotes that may have never occurred.
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[*] posted on 25-9-2012 at 10:15


I suppose you may talk about it's effects on the neuroreceptors but not about how to make it. this is the way some people have shattered the way others view chemistry :( .



there may be bugs in gfind

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[*] posted on 25-9-2012 at 10:34


The topic regarded the de-polymerization and recycling of a common polymer. Then all hell blew loose in here.
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Mildronate
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[*] posted on 25-9-2012 at 22:58


There are other forums!
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Rogeryermaw
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[*] posted on 25-9-2012 at 23:38


yes, there are. but with the same level of chemical expertise as sciencemadness? not by a long shot. in no way am i saying that means people should come here looking to be spoon fed dope cookery recipes. but look at it this way: there is a whole sub-forum here dedicated to energetic materials including in-depth analysis of synthesis, handling and storage techniques. those materials are just as illegal in unlicensed hands and capable of doing far greater damage to life and limb than a few grams of extracted delta-9 t.h.c.
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[*] posted on 25-9-2012 at 23:45


I wonder if illicett drug labs do much R&D. itd be funny if some underground compound turned out to cure cancer.. :)
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[*] posted on 26-9-2012 at 04:41


MDMA for depression.
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[*] posted on 26-9-2012 at 06:09


whatever the case, never nice to be greedy with your info, like a chef leaving his secret weapon out of a recipe. And like a broken record, UTFSE. That can get old too. There are a couple specific things, not drug related, but polymer related, Specifically, to the recycling of said polymer. I'd love more insight, but not at the risk of stirring the SM Honet's net (OUCH!)

ALSO REMEMBER, for people like myself, it's all for the fun of it. One would have to be a little crazy and very self confident consuming one's own product, but people are going down the path to hell if they in any way negatively effect someones else livelihood.

Then there are those who think they are greater than some god, and I somehow find this to be highly delusional thinking. Usually the above coupled with anti-social mannerisms on this board, I guess they are afraid of going one step further. That is cowardly and wrong in the 1st place.

[Edited on 26-9-2012 by Fennel Ass Ih Tone]
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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 01:35


If you lived in the 60's and were just old enough to really get into home chemistry you would understand why I despise every single thread about how to make drugs. Quite simply the community which includes LEO were amused and amazed at the occasional mad scientist they encountered. The local druggist would go out of their way to help you acquire random exotic compounds and items, chemistry sets were for sale everywhere. I used to save my lawn mowing money to make a trip to the local hobby store to buy glassware and tubing (both glass and rubber), stoppers, small Chemcraft bottles of chemicals. You name it the sky was nearly the limit. Neighbors did not complain over random odors, bangs, plumes of smoke and so forth nor did they call the police so long as the minor bangs were at reasonable hours.

Smashing doors in by jack booted thugs was nonexistent. Hiding your pursuits was not in your mindset and even your school science teacher was willing to provide help and supplies from their very well stocked closets at school. I cannot possibly convey with words the wonderful experience these pursuits provided. Look at the way things are today. Very rarely do you see raids on home chemists in relation to anything terrorist related. Yet tactical teams exist in every community today just hoping to find someone like any one of us.

I blame the drug cooks for this not the terrorists. Decades before terror attacks were common going back to the late 70's and specifically the 80's I could see the way things were changing and at the time it was 100 percent related to the rise in numbers of small clandestine drug labs. Terror attacks were things you read about every few years related mostly to things going on in the middle east, not here. Yet I saw the change accelerating rapidly through the 80's and for the U.S. it was completely driven by the illegal manufacture of drugs and absolutely nothing else. I despise what has happened here because of these cooks in terms of the public outlook on our hobby including the way the law has changed. Both in terms of what we can no longer get and in the need to hide and suppress what we do in our own little local world as it relates to all aspects of our pursuits.

Gone forever are the days I can buy Phosphorus, Iodine, and any one of a daily increasing list of chemicals now watched and outlawed which for many years no one had the slightest concern. The drug cooks have forever destroyed my hobby and every day their continued activities cause even more destruction of a way of life which was at one time free and quite fun. As I said I blame the drug cooks for every iota of all of this and since this is a public forum I will refrain from stating my real opinion of what should be done to them. Jail obviously but this is not my first wish for them believe me.





"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" Richard Feynman
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 04:45


Quote:
Jail obviously but this is not my first wish for them believe me.

And that first wish would be . . . ?

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IrC
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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 07:01


From your question one can only assume English is not your first language. Otherwise you would have comprehended the words "since this is a public forum I will refrain from stating my real opinion".

In simple terms this means what I think is none of your business unless I choose to state it. Perhaps you think others cannot think on higher levels than you are able to understand. If you do not like it you are always able to lick it and stick it.




"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" Richard Feynman
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 08:29


Quote:
From your question one can only assume English is not your first language.

Oh come on IrC, the question was plainly rhetorical?
But your assumption is rather puzzling since you know (or knew) me pretty well from differences we've had in previous threads!
And from what <i>you've</i> said, I have to assume that you understand less than nothing when it comes to the WOD!
As to punishment to be meted out to 'cooks' who might inadvertently complicate your reagent acquisition efforts, would 'hanging, drawing and quartering suffice?

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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 08:36


Not only have the cooks wrecked the physical aspect of amatur chemistry but they are slowly working their way into the info-sharing realms as well, flooding once-respectable forums with their illegitimate garbage and even being so bold as to come up with clever screennames related to the manufacture of illicit substances.

Just as the 1980s began the era of "Smashing doors in by jack booted thugs", the 2100s will begin the era of governmental crackdown on the share of this information online. The way things are going, I have no doubt that this as well as many other sites will eventually be shut down because of the negative attention these idiots create.

I don't know if it's just kids trying to be "edgy" or what, but if these folks were at all interested in real chemistry they would work to preserve what we have rather than constantly trying to bring up this crap about clandestine and listed materials. Better to have something than nothing at all!

IMO, if you're interested in drugs, go somewhere else or figure it out yourself. You can't keep bullsh*tting stuff like "self-use only" or "for depression". It's crap and we all know it. Has anyone ever noticed that the most argumentative people tend to be those with the "f**k the system, talk about drugs, yeah!" attitude? That kind of mentality is going to kill this for everybody.

As for the UTFSE comments, they cannot be helped. One has two ears and one mouth... and they should be used in that proportion. It's the lack of conditioning the newbies receive that gives rise to all this other garbage anyway.




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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 09:28


I think all information should be readily available. If you disagree it's because you come from a place of conditioned thought or fear. You don't want certain information to be shared because you fear the consequences, or you don't want it available, "just because" or it's "bad". These are ideologically conditioned responses.

Remember, it's not the explosive makers or drug cooks who are limiting, watching, and removing the reagents you want from the market. Nor is it these "cooks" who are ruining amateur chem. It is the governing institutions whom you have a problem with. These are the regulators, the gate keepers and the rule makers.
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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 11:32


"Nor is it these "cooks" who are ruining amateur chem. It is the governing institutions whom you have a problem with. These are the regulators, the gate keepers and the rule makers."

The most fundamental property in understanding science is the realization of 'cause and effect'. If one cannot grasp this then one should give up science, go back to eating shrooms and watching MTV. You have just posted the most profound example of this lack of understanding I have ever read. Doug is right.

Hissing it's not my fault, you always irritate me.


[Edited on 10-7-2012 by IrC]




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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 12:06


I have a problem with the low-life fucktards who perpetuate the obscenity that is the prohibition of recreational substances, who support it, and who acquiesce in its continuing imposition . . .
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Hissing it's not my fault, you always irritate me.

Whew IrC, for a while there, I thought you might have mislaid the plot entirely!

Oh, and it's mutual, BTW!

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[*] posted on 7-10-2012 at 16:42
Opiods


Quote: Originally posted by Fennel Ass Ih Tone  
illicit drugs on these bulletin boards is taboo. Never less, there is some side discussion and refinements. Allusions to the drug or precursor. And that drug is almost always an amphetaminel Which is so boring. Why is there not stealthy discussion regarding opioids?


Because, most of us who have any experience with them know how destructive they are and to what end they bring anyone messing with them.
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