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Author: Subject: Most corrosive agent?
budullewraagh
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thumbdown.gif posted on 10-8-2004 at 09:23


why the bloody hell would you ever have a want for KCN?



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MadHatter
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 09:36
Corrosive to what ?


It's a matter of what material you want to attack. If it's glass then I'll go with
hydrofluoric acid and cesium hydroxide - both will attack glass easily.
If it's gold then aqua reqia or cyanides.




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Saerynide
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 09:46


*Why* would they have:
Metallic Sodium
Bromine
White Phosphorus (this was not something to play with!)
Potassium Cyanide
Mercury Chloride
Arsenic
Thallium
in a pharymacy?? :o:D

[Edit]: typo

[Edited on 11-8-2004 by Saerynide]




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MadHatter
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 10:25
Unusal


Saerynide, that would seem strange for a pharmacy given how dangerous
those materials are. It's definitely suspicious. Are we dealing with a troll here ?




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Hang-Man
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 14:28


Potassium Cyanide? ThioCyanide maybe.
Quote:

And yes, it is true that I don't have advanced chemistry-knowledges

Quote:
I'm knowing what i'm doing, and I have done experiments with much more dangerous chemicals than HF.


Anyone see a problem?

What the hell is more dangerous than HF? The KCN you ordered at the pharmacy? ( <--Sarcasm, in response to below. You can’t just order KCN, I agree, he's a troll.)Perhaps you don't understand. IF YOU SPILL IT, YOU WILL DIE.

[Edited on 10-8-2004 by Hang-Man]




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MadHatter
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 15:06
Hang-Man


Since when do pharmacies carry such lethal matierals ? I still smell a troll !



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Marvin
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 16:22


MadHatter,

Though dont, but its quite possible places would sell them to a pharmacy.

Hang-Man,

KCN is not quite that toxic. If you get it on your skin you need to wash it off. Its only life threatening if it gets in a cut, or you injest it, or you add acid and breathe in the HCN. It did used to be just another lab chemical.

Conc HF on the other hand, if you spilt on you my understanding is the toxicity could well kill you.
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Hang-Man
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[*] posted on 10-8-2004 at 16:41


yes, when I said 'if you spill it you will die' I was refering to the HF not the KCN.



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[*] posted on 11-8-2004 at 03:20


Quote:
Originally posted by Saerynide
*Why* they have:
Metallic Sodium
Bromine
White Phosphorus (this was not something to play with!)
Potassium Cyanide
Mercury Chloride
Arsenic
Thallium
in a pharymacy??


Maybe they sell do-it yourself home euthanasia kits?

[Edited on 11-8-2004 by Pyrovus]




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Saerynide
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[*] posted on 11-8-2004 at 04:37


LOL :D

I don't think anyone would want to use any of those to commit suicide.




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Hang-Man
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[*] posted on 11-8-2004 at 09:32


KCN wouldn't be a bad way to go. Eating sodium metal, white P or Br on the other hand.......

Seems our deceitful friend went AWAL when we exposed his fraud. :rolleyes:




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[*] posted on 11-8-2004 at 11:33


Well, the pharmacys, does not handle these chemicals. But when I worked there, I've access to order chemicals from the biggest chem-company in Sweden, without questions & restrictions.
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Hang-Man
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[*] posted on 11-8-2004 at 12:47


And what was it you handled that was more dangerous than HF?



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[*] posted on 13-8-2004 at 15:04


I have heard of pharmacies, in the past, selling compounds of arsenic and thallium, along with strychnine, and I think KCN, for use as poisons to kill rats and other vermin. Buyers had to sign poisons books. However, this has just about ended, due to the widespread availability of rat and other vermin poisons containing warfarin and other coumarone derivatives, or "1080" (sodium fluoroacetate), which are much more easily treated with antidotes if accidentally ingested.

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[*] posted on 13-8-2004 at 17:04


An aside: sodium fluoroacetate is among the deadliest pesticides in use. It is not easily degraded and will poison animals that eat the corpses of poisoned animals. There is no accepted antidote for it. KCN is fairly benign by comparison.



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JohnWW
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[*] posted on 14-8-2004 at 01:38


Tha is why fluoroacetate is used in poison pellets, made of cereal and dyed green to avoid the attentions of birds, and often dropped by air, for the introduced Australian opossum here in New Zealand, where it is the number one pest, ravaging native forests. However, KCN or NaCN is still used in poison paste (apple jam) for quick kills at bait stations where it is desired to collect the opossum carcases for their skins. There must be an antidote for it, however, as I have heard of veterinary surgeons successfully treating (with an antidote, along with stomach pumping) dogs which had eaten fluoroacetate-poisoned opossums.

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[*] posted on 14-8-2004 at 10:32


I did see a few links that mentioned treatment of fluoroacetate poisoning, but they all looked to be research endeavors. I know that my (1950s) references on fluoroacetic acid and derivatives say there's no antidote, in contrast with cyanides and acetylchloinesterase inhibitors, but it's not surprising that something could have been discovered in the last 50 years. Still, I saw many MSDS sheets that warned "there is no antidote," so I suspect that this is a fairly recent innovation.

[Edited on 8-14-2004 by Polverone]




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[*] posted on 18-8-2004 at 01:20


Talking about poisons, when I was at vacation in Hungary I could buy 1 Kilo bags of a 60% NaF and 30% Sodiumdichromate mix with 10% of a other unknown nasty :D

Logically my dad would'nt let me buy it :P
(Not that I wanted it, I would wet my pants trying to open the casing, let alone carrying it back in the car to Holland :o )




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[*] posted on 19-8-2004 at 18:51


The term "aqua regalis" actually sounds oddly familiar to me. Whether it is called aqua regia or the former I would just like to ask a few questions about this mixture. I would like test this mixture on some mild steels. Basically I've had first hand experience with concentrated Nitric, and Sulphuric acid. I guess I'm just curious about experimenting with acids that burn through metals instantly. After experimenting with strong oxidizing acids I figured that acids that burn through metals were just from the movies.

[Edited on 20-8-2004 by tom haggen]




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[*] posted on 19-8-2004 at 20:07


I have been looking for detailed info on sodium fluoroacetate for a while can any of you point me towards some good resources (my interest was peaked when reading a novel where it mentioned it was was of the strongest poisons know to man:D )
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[*] posted on 6-9-2004 at 08:58


Is it right,that Pb is not attacked by HF?I made KF from HF and K2CO3 and I want to get the solid salt from the solution.But it attacks glas because of thaces of HF and perhaps the KF reacts with the glas,too.
I thought I could make a dish from Pb to evaporate the water.Or are there other possibilities?
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[*] posted on 6-9-2004 at 09:22


Both nickel and lead are impervous to KF because of passivation.



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[*] posted on 7-9-2004 at 15:30


So you could cast a container out of lead or nickel and use that to store HF/KF?



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[*] posted on 8-9-2004 at 01:48


@superacids....why not H2SO4 + another lewis acid like ZnCl2 or FeCl3 instead of SbF5 ? - SbF5 might be first choice in being a strong lewis acid, but i think ZnCl2 or FeCl3 might also work nicely.

Did anyone mention the pKa of Caro´s acid here(for comparison):P?....i was wondering whether it would make sense trying to calculate the super-acid-strength using pKa-Values of the H2SO4 and the lewis acid?! :o
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[*] posted on 8-9-2004 at 05:51


Hello!

I suppose you won´t have acess to Lewis-Acids, so what are you going to do with the corrosive chemicals? When you want to corrode metal (writing on it) you can make a little bit of boric acid on it and heat it with a gas-Burner. For Glass is hydoflouric acid great, but its dangerous. Other metals or combinations of them (i`ve forgotten the word:(, e.g. woods.....)can be corroded with a little hot sodium hydroxid-Solution. When you want to burn letters in Messing (Zn+Cu), nitric acid is good.

Edit: SbF5 is very expensive.

What is the english php-code for writing letters low? [tief] [/tief] ist the german but it dont work...

[Edited on 8-9-2004 by Caesium-137]
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