BromicAcid
International Hazard
Posts: 3227
Registered: 13-7-2003
Location: Wisconsin
Member Is Offline
Mood: Rock n' Roll
|
|
Salt Bridges, A simplification?
I was thumbing though one of my new chemistry books on Analytical Chemistry and came across a nice little passage on an easy to construct salt bridge:
| Quote: | | A salt bridge is easily constructed by filling a U-tube with a conducting gel prepared by heating about 5 g of agar in about 100 ml of an aqueous
solution containing about 35 g of potassium chloride. When the liquid cools, it sets into a gel that is a good conductor but prevents the two
solutions at the ends of the tube from mixing. If either of the ions in the potassium chloride interfere with the measurement process, ammonium
nitrate may be used as the electrolyte in salt bridges. |
Skoog, Douglas A.; West, Donald M.; Holler, James F.; Crouch, Stanley R. Fundamentals of Analytical Chemistry 8th ed. Thompson Learning, 2004
I like this idea, filling a flexible plastic tube with the mixture would give a good salt bridge that would not need refilling or tinkering with.
There are of course the other salt bridges, involving U-Tubes full of liquid that have cotton/glasswool plugs or fritted glass ends. But those have
always seemed a hassle, so I figured I'd share this with everyone. Or you could soak an unglazed clay pot in 6 M HNO3 and use it to house one of
the electrodes with the other on the outside, technically I think that would count as a salt bridge.
Regardless, may all of your solutions keep to their respective sides from now on!
|
|
|
chemoleo
Biochemicus Energeticus
Posts: 3005
Registered: 23-7-2003
Location: England Germany
Member Is Offline
Mood: crystalline
|
|
Yes, it's a nice idea.
I guess one could also use normal gelatine, or anything that solidifies a solution of salts?
Agar is of course the material of choice, it being used all the time for DNA electrophoreses.
Another one is polyacrylamide - but much less useful for the amateur chemist.
At last, one idea is alginate - although I haven't tried it, it also makes a water-based solid medium. Alginate is widely available from arts
supplies.
Never Stop to Begin, and Never Begin to Stop...
Tolerance is good. But not with the intolerant! (Wilhelm Busch)
|
|
|
Twospoons
International Hazard
Posts: 1281
Registered: 26-7-2004
Location: Middle Earth
Member Is Offline
Mood: A trace of hope...
|
|
Funny, the agar idea occured to me the other day too. Though I had thought of making it into a membrane by casting the gel onto plastic mesh for
support, giving shorter path and more area (= better conductivity).
Polyacrylamide can be bought from garden stores as "water storing crystals". Why wouldn't it be useful for the amatuer?
|
|
|
Esplosivo
Hazard to Others
Posts: 491
Registered: 7-2-2004
Location: Mediterranean
Member Is Offline
Mood: Quantized
|
|
This is the way I have always seen salt bridges set up (and set them up myself a couple of times), though I used potassium nitrate instead of
potassium chloride. It works marvellously and can hold for quite a long time (although with time the 'jelly' will become softer and break up
into smaller pieces which would mess up everything).
| Quote: |
Polyacrylamide can be bought from garden stores as "water storing crystals". Why wouldn't it be useful for the amatuer?
|
Are you sure about that? I mean, it could be anything from agar to its purified form agarose, but not polyacrylamide! It could also be one of those
types of very absorbent polyols. Chemoleo referred to polyacrylamide as not useful to the amateur chemist since it is expensive - I
can confirm that.
[Edited on 20-10-2004 by Esplosivo]
Theory guides, experiment decides.
|
|
|
Hermes_Trismegistus
National Hazard
Posts: 602
Registered: 27-11-2003
Location: Greece, Ancient
Member Is Offline
Mood: conformation:ga
|
|
No. Not neccessarily; unless we all have different views on expensive...but no-one here lists "ass end of ethiopa" as their
location (yet)
I've found it sold for 5 bucks a pound granular. It's also sold in blocks. Farmers are now using it in the field. Google polyacrilymide and
furrow.
(although if you want it from a chemsupply....then again, look up the price for acs grade NaCl.)
Arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics; even if you win: you\'re still retarded.
|
|
|
Organikum
resurrected
Posts: 2329
Registered: 12-10-2002
Location: Europe
Member Is Offline
Mood: busy and in love
|
|
The salt bridges are basically cell-dividers I think. I am experimenting with fine-glasswool inbetween a supporting lattice for cell dividers now,
better than claypots this is for sure!
The glasswool has to be freed from the glue which makes the yellow color by heating before use, the material of the support depends on the reaction of
course, for Cl2 from NaCl/HCl PVC works ok as long the temperatur isnt to high.
I believe the glasswool could be doted too for ion/anion selectivity, but thats future.
|
|
|
Twospoons
International Hazard
Posts: 1281
Registered: 26-7-2004
Location: Middle Earth
Member Is Offline
Mood: A trace of hope...
|
|
"Polyacrylamide" is what is written on the side of the container of water storing granules I've bought. Probably cheap because its not
reagent grade, but I'd have thought it perfectly OK for us bucket chemists!
Anyone know what this stuff dissolves in? The granular form isn't particularly useful...
|
|
|
Saerynide
National Hazard
Posts: 954
Registered: 17-11-2003
Location: The Void
Member Is Offline
Mood: Ionic
|
|
hmmm... So, If I wanna electrolyze MgSO4 like that, it would make sense to fill the agar in the salt bridge with MgSO4 instead of KCl right?
Otherwise, I would end up with a bit of Cl2 and KOH, right?
"Microsoft reserves the right at all times to monitor communications on the Service and disclose any information Microsoft deems necessary to...
satisfy any applicable law, regulation or legal process"
|
|
|
chemoleo
Biochemicus Energeticus
Posts: 3005
Registered: 23-7-2003
Location: England Germany
Member Is Offline
Mood: crystalline
|
|
Just to point out, polyacrylamide is used in the biochemical sciences for running SDS - gels.
Basically what is done is that acrylamide (the monomer) is mixed with buffer and polymerised in a form/mould for the gel. Once it has finished
reacting, it's a great gelatinous material (clear as glass), whose hardness can be determined by the percentage of acrylamide. Gels normally are
in the range of 4-20%.
Anyway -the point is that the gel is made from the monomer - and I am not sure whehter dry polymerised polyacrylamide can be redissolved and
gelatinated.
While monomeric acrylamide is hard to get, and supertoxic (carcinogenic).
Another possibilty for a gelatinous conductor is alginate (dental/arts supplies)
Never Stop to Begin, and Never Begin to Stop...
Tolerance is good. But not with the intolerant! (Wilhelm Busch)
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xpblue/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
