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I Like Dots
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[*] posted on 28-11-2013 at 19:59
What some interesting dangerous chemicals?


I've been browsing through the blog "things I won't work with" and I love reading about dangerous compounds.

I'd say my 'favourites' are volatile sources of metal like Nickel Carbonyl, Dimethyl Mercury, and Osmium Tetroxide(I guess that's your sample on wikipedia Woelen!).. very sinister!

So, what are your favorite deadly chemicals?
(Changed question from "what will you not work with")

[Edited on 29-11-2013 by I Like Dots]

[Edited on 29-11-2013 by I Like Dots]




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plante1999
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[*] posted on 28-11-2013 at 20:08


1,2,3 triazo propane and similar compounds
fluorophosphate derivatives
maybe diazomethane

Things I would work with:
maybe diazomethane
Fluorine
Soluble Hg Salts (and mostly all heavy metals)
Various Energetic material mentioned in the blog
Iodine azide (in solution)
Sodium chloride
Hydrogen cyanide
phosphorus
N2O5
etc




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[*] posted on 28-11-2013 at 20:17


Quote: Originally posted by plante1999  

Things I would work with:
maybe diazomethane
Fluorine
Soluble Hg Salts (and mostly all heavy metals)
Various Energetic material mentioned in the blog
Iodine azide (in solution)
Sodium chloride
Hydrogen cyanide
phosphorus
N2O5
etc

You badass!




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plante1999
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[*] posted on 28-11-2013 at 20:28


Sodium chloride is very heavy stuff fallowing some people, they freak for a few mg of it...

Although I believe it is a better idea to mention heavy stuff you would work with rather then the opposite. More productive




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[*] posted on 28-11-2013 at 21:38


I will not work with osmium compounds ever again. I never want to smell that stench, ever.

I don't work with mercury any more. It's not worth the hassle.




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 04:39


Cesium auride
Osmiun tetroxide
astantine
Polonium azide




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 09:19


Thats what I meant by saying that telling what you would work with instead would be more efficient, we would not get stupid compound you would not work wit like polonium azide or astantine...



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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 09:25


Of course not sorry.
I don't think that was the point of the thread though.




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 10:00


Quote: Originally posted by plante1999  

maybe diazomethane


From Wikipedia:
Quote:

Deaths from diazomethane poisoning have been reported. In one instance a laboratory worker consumed a hamburger near a fumehood where he was generating a large quantity of diazomethane, and died four days later from fulminating pneumonia.... ...The compound explodes when heated beyond 100 °C, exposed to intense light, alkali metals, or calcium sulfate.


Yikes, Calcium Sulfate is oddly specific. I bet they learned that one the hard way!

Quote: Originally posted by bismuthate  

polonium azide

I couldn't find anything on the azide, but polonium is deadly enough without exploding!
Quote:

A fatal dose can be caused by ingesting about 50 nanograms , or inhaling about 10 ng... ...One gram of 210Po could thus in theory poison 20 million people of whom 10 million would die.



Im trying to find a chemical with the "trifecta" of danger. 4's on health, flammability, and reactivity. (bonus points for acidic, explosive, or reaction with air!)

I think the boranes come close. Diborane
Pentaborane





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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 10:36


Francium? Cyanogen azide?

[Edited on 29-11-2013 by bismuthate]




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 10:44


According to Wikipedia, there are two compounds that I have found with the trifecta: Ethyl Nitrite, and tert-butyl hydroperoxide. However, I have found that fire diamonds vary depending the source, and I am skeptical to ethyl nitrite being a true 4 4 4.
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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 11:35


Ethyl nitrite a 4 4 4 ? I think that is nonsense. I have made this compound quite a few times, it makes a nice demo when you light the colorless gas and let it burn with a grey flame. I smelled the compound and it has a weak smell. If too much is inhaled it can produce headaches, but I never experiences headaches from this. Either I am not sensitive to it, or the effect is strongly exaggerated.

Ethyl nitrite most likely has a 4 for flammability, but having a 4 for toxicity is nonsense and having a 4 for reactivity also is questionable. The material is reactive, but nothing compared to generaly available chemicals like TCCA, NaClO2 or even strong acids like H2SO4 and HNO3.




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 12:22


Quote: Originally posted by bismuthate  
Cyanogen azide?



Eh, in solution you can prepare and work with it like most reagents, as long as you take precautions against solvent evaporation. The pure material is another story...

There is a lit preparation out there using a solution of CN4 in like 10x excess to other reagents. Then the solution is evaporated to dryness and no mention is made of the huge explosion potential from left over CN4...:o
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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 13:07


We can mention all kinds of dangerous chemicals, but what dangerous chemicals did you really work with in your experiments? I think that that question is more interesting.

I myself have done quite a few experiments with chemicals which are considered dangerous, but in all cases I have taken a lot of precautions.

Most risky ones I did:
- preparation of gaseous chlorine azide from NaN3, bleach and acetic acid
- preparation of white P from red P
- preparation and isolution of PBr3 from red P and Br2

I once had the opportunity to buy AsCl3, a fuming colorless liquid, somewhat reminiscent of PCl3. This liquid, however, I did not buy. I do have a small sample of PCl3 and I have no objection experimenting with that, but AsCl3 is one step too far (inhaling arsenic containing fumes is not a good idea to me). PCl3 is at the border of what I can handle. It is very corrosive and the fumes are really nasty (it quickly reacts with water vapor from the air to phosphorous acid and HCl and its fumes are extremely pungent, like the fumes of concentrated hydrochloric acid but then tripled in intensity). I refrain from doing experiments with very toxic chemicals which can have long term effects or which are strong systemic poisons (e.g. H2Se, AsCl3, AsH3, volatile Hg-compound).




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 17:29


Quote: Originally posted by woelen  
I refrain from doing experiments with very toxic chemicals which can have long term effects or which are strong systemic poisons (e.g. H2Se, AsCl3, AsH3, volatile Hg-compound).


We think similarly. I have worked with some rather nasty chemicals like azidotetrazole, CN4, HN3, HCN, F2, anhydrous HF and more. And I would take those any day over cumulative poisons like volatile carcinogens. I hate hydrazine but I need to use it at work, but I would rather work with something explosive or acutely toxic any day of the week.

On another note, silica gel is a easily dispersed carcinogen that is not given enough respect these days.

Ethyl nitrite being most dangerous is BS. Don't people eat it to give them boners? Or is that just amyl?

Plant1999, N2O5 is not too bad. Volatile and toxic yes, but no different really than fuming nitric acid. I'd catch a few whiffs every time I weighed it out.
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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 19:14


Quote: Originally posted by woelen  
Ethyl nitrite a 4 4 4 ? I think that is nonsense. I have made this compound quite a few times, it makes a nice demo when you light the colorless gas and let it burn with a grey flame. I smelled the compound and it has a weak smell. If too much is inhaled it can produce headaches, but I never experiences headaches from this. Either I am not sensitive to it, or the effect is strongly exaggerated.

Ethyl nitrite most likely has a 4 for flammability, but having a 4 for toxicity is nonsense and having a 4 for reactivity also is questionable. The material is reactive, but nothing compared to generaly available chemicals like TCCA, NaClO2 or even strong acids like H2SO4 and HNO3.


I am in complete agreement with you. I have also prepared ethyl nitrite myself and would not call it "very dangerous". However, I am just stating what I saw on Wikipedia. Here is another website that calls it a 4 4 4:
http://cameochemicals.noaa.gov/chemical/3440

I remember seeing it classified as a 2 4 4 on another website. It can't be as dangerous as some sources make it out to be... It's used as a medicine for flu in South Africa for Christs sake!
For anyone wondering here is the diamond for tert-butyl hydroperoxide:
http://cameochemicals.noaa.gov/chemical/2692

[Edited on 30-11-2013 by blargish]
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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 20:47


Mad Science at the max, where do you draw the line?

A similar topic I posted once upon a time.

In terms of chemicals I have worked with:

Most Toxic : Phosgene (45 kg neat in a 72L flask stirring around, for a split second nearly caused a panic attack)
Most Pyrophoric : Dimethylzinc (thankfully don't have the scars to prove it)
Most Corrosive : Sulfur tetrafluoride (it ate the silicone tape!)
Most Malodorous : Butyl isocyanide (words can never express...)




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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 22:15


Quote: Originally posted by The_Davster  


On another note, silica gel is a easily dispersed carcinogen that is not given enough respect these days.



Surely you don't mean pure silica gel, but the color indicating kind that contains cobalt II chloride, am I right?

Oh nvm, I just looked it up and apparently finely divided airborne silicon dioxide may be carcinogenic. Wow, I never knew that...

[Edited on 30-11-2013 by blargish]
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[*] posted on 29-11-2013 at 23:17


Quote: Originally posted by I Like Dots  



Im trying to find a chemical with the "trifecta" of danger. 4's on health, flammability, and reactivity. (bonus points for acidic, explosive, or reaction with air!)

I think the boranes come close. Diborane
Pentaborane



no need to search anymore, monomethylhydrazine takes that place!
whoa! just found another, tert-butyl hydroperoxide, though different sources have different qualifications

My favorites dangerous chemicals would be mercury salts, I just love mercury...

but with what chemicals I would never work with? with fluoride! that stuff can be really deadly when it's in the right position.
compounds like disulfur decafluoride, perfluoroisobutene, carbonyl fluoride even hydrogen fluoride are things I would never work with.

There's a lot of stuff but i'll limit myself to what I said.

...mmm no one has mentioned methyl isocyanate yet.


[Edited on 06/11/2013 by BlackDragon2712]
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[*] posted on 1-12-2013 at 07:06


Quote: Originally posted by BlackDragon2712  
no need to search anymore, monomethylhydrazine takes that place!
whoa! just found another, tert-butyl hydroperoxide, though different sources have different qualifications

My favorites dangerous chemicals would be mercury salts, I just love mercury...

I worked with all of these and I'm still alive. tBuOOH is a pretty good thing, not a really dangerous chemical. Same to say from mercury salts. If you do not eat them, than no problem(:

A few other thing on my list: cyanogen chloride, liquid chlorine, liquid ethylene oxide, hydrogen fluoride, organomercury reagents, cesium metal, rubidium metal, sodium and potassium organics and a few other special things. Most of these could be seen at: labphoto.tumblr.com




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[*] posted on 1-12-2013 at 10:12


Quote: Originally posted by kristofvagyok  

Same to say from mercury salts. If you do not eat them, than no problem(:

I totally agree with you about that! mercury is a pretty interesting element and for sure one of my favorites!

btw working with methyl hydrazine must be really dangerous considering its potential as a carcinogenic, nice work! the closest I've been is with hydrazine hydrate... xd
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[*] posted on 1-12-2013 at 12:16


I don't like cumulative poisons either, but I suppose my main dislike of mercury salts is to do with the non-trivial disposal of any generated waste.

I've worked with a few smelly chemicals before, and benzyl isocyanide is one of the worst I've encountered (personally). I've also made dimethyl sulfate before, which is certainly not a nice compound by any standard. Selenium dioxide is pretty fucking nasty too, in terms of toxicity and smell. My experience with it also shows how difficult it is to remove the selenium residues from your product, even despite filtration through celite (removes majority), sodium bicarbonate washes, and column chromatography.
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[*] posted on 1-12-2013 at 12:28


What about ClF3 ?

The Nazi Germans had a secret factory of this chemical in Falkenhagen for missile propulsion but also for chemical warfare.
It burns nearly everything. As it is a liquid at room temperature it is more aggressive than F2.

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[*] posted on 1-12-2013 at 13:23


I only worked with isocyanoacetic acid ethyl ester, what also had a horrible smell, but someone on the sixth floor poured out some isocyanides to the sink and the whole building smelled like that :D

We also have peptide chemists who usually once a month make a little accident with ethanedithiol or propanedithiol what also have a really "interesting" odor.

And the best from the odorous compounds:
METHYL MERCAPTAN!

And we also have a group where they do fluorous chemistry, so there is somewhere 200g liquified CF3I in the building what was made 2 year ago from CF3COOK and I2.




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[*] posted on 1-12-2013 at 13:26


Quote: Originally posted by kristofvagyok  

And the best from the odorous compounds:
METHYL MERCAPTAN!

Farts stink to this chemical just because of a *small* portion of gases escaping from one's ass is this chemical.

And about Francium and Astatine: the radioactivity is the main hazard, chemically they are not that bad. If one could prepare weighable amounts of these elements (which is technically not possible) then (apart from radioactivity):

At: A milder halogen than Iodine, so rather harmless.
Fr: A very reactive alkali metal more than cesium. Reacts explosively with water.

[Edited on 2013-12-1 by metalresearcher]
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