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hyfalcon
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MMO
Get it while it's hot!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/EXPANDED-TITANIUM-MESH-STRETCHED-SCR...
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Zyklon-A
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Thanks for showing that to me, I just bought one!
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Mailinmypocket
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I wonder where this person gets their MMO... I bought a piece two years ago and he has it on and off, same stuff always... But I'm curious as to where
it comes from! Sometimes they have some and other times absolutely nothing to sell on their page...
Get it while it's hot!!
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Zyklon-A
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Either way, it's a great price, If you think about all the chlorate, perchlorate, persulfates and pyrosulfate you can make with it.
[Edited on 4-4-2014 by Zyklonb]
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Mailinmypocket
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Taking chlorate to perchlorate with them with destroy them from what I remember. Platinized titanium or platinum wire anodes are required for that
goodness 
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Zyklon-A
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Oh, yeah, I was thinking if Pt.... Still I only planned on chlorate anyway. I have about 2 lbs of perchlorate right now.
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macckone
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yes thanks I bought two.
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hyfalcon
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One thing I have to warn you about. You have to give these anodes a good soak in HCl/H2O2 to get the deposits off this material, but it comes out of
an overnight soak absolutely blue black in color. Not a thing wrong with the anode material.
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Zyklon-A
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How concentrated does the hydrogen peroxide need to be? I ran out of all concentrations exept 3%.
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sbbspartan
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I've never actually used hydrogen peroxide to clean them before. I just let them soak overnight in 30% HCl, and they come out perfectly clean. The
orange powder is gone and the resistance goes way down.
His sheets have definitely been used before though. There are certain spots where the mmo coating has worn off, and the titanium metal is visible.
However, at the price he's selling them at, it's hard to complain.
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Fantasma4500
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you can heat it on low heat setting just below boiling point of water to remove water, vacuum or a fan sucking out water will increase evaporation
rate alot
a phone charger connected to a computer fan shooting air upwards placed on top of a beaker is incredibly k3wlish but seems to increase evaporation
rate at least 2 times, possibly 4 times
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gregxy
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It looks like you can get new anodes in various shapes direct from China. (much more than most of us can use)
There is also platinum plated Ti.
http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=prod...
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sbbspartan
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I've bought MMO anodes, platinum anodes, and lead dioxide anodes from China/Alibaba before. At minimum, the best price I could get on MMO was roughly
2-3 times as expensive as what Laserred sells it for, even in semi-bulk.
If anyone is interested, I sent laserred a quick email with some questions. Here's his response ---
"I bought them several years ago at an industrial auction, no idea what they were used for or if they were even used at all. They had years of dust on
them from storage so they'd been sitting around for quite awhile. That being said, what I have now is all I have and can't get any more."
He has a bit over 200 sheets left.
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macckone
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My two sheets just arrived and they looked pristine condition.
I don't think they have ever been used.
I plan on ordering more.
They only last so long.
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Mailinmypocket
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Last batch of chlorate made with this sellers MMO anode (probably my 15th batch), these anodes are, as they would say, "the bomb". 293g in 48 hours,
not bad
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Zyklon-A
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Wow! Nice, I'm running a small test run as I type. Less than 120 grams of KCl, which can produce a maximum of 192 grams of chlorate, if there are no
losses, which is an unrealistic assumption.
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BobD1001
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Mailinmypocket, How have the anodes held up over that time, have you had to use several strips or still on the original? Mind sharing the dimensions
of your anode/cathode, cell size, and current?
I have purchased two sheets of MMO sheet from Laserred, and I recently borrowed a friends shear press to cut a few strips out of the sheet, several 1"
wide, and a few 2" wide. Pretty exciting to see how beautiful a product they can produce!
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Mailinmypocket
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Firstly, the set up itself is quite crude. Both anode and cathode are made of MMO, cathode is a bit wider but I don't have the measurements on hand
right now. I will post them later. If I had to say? The anode is about 1-1.5 inches wide and the cathode perhaps 2-2.5 wide. They are not welded to
titanium since I have/had no access to welding that type of thing so the MMO just protrudes through the top of the ziplock 750ml tall round container.
Like these:
http://www.ziploc.com/Products/Pages/TwistLocContainers.aspx...
Anyways... It holds 750ml of liquid and runs on a modified PC power supply, 5v 10A I believe it is. These containers hold up amazingly well to the hot
cell liquor after repeated runs and I have only cut two pieces of MMO from the original sheet, which are the electrode I still use now. They don't
seem to have degraded at all. Throwing in some potassium dichromate helps greatly.
I'll post more details when I'm actually around the parts to measure. It's very simple to build a crude cell that makes chlorate easily though...
Dichromate, PC power supply, almost saturated KCl, let run... Top off when the liquid gets low with some slightly acidified KCl... Let run... Continue
and after a day or two you have a thick layer of chlorate.
I did find that the electrodes were further apart from each other at the bottom of the cell, so making some Teflon "string" by twisting Teflon tape
made for a good way to secure them at an even distance from each other... If that makes sense.
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Zyklon-A
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Mine has been running for about two days now, but the solution has turned yellow. Is this normal? The yellow stuff is completely soluble, I've tried
filtering a few times, but only white potassium chlorate is left behind. It's running on about 5.3 volts and 4.9-5.1 amps, the solution stays at
about 55°C by itself so every 8 hours or so, I Pour it into a beaker, and heat it till boiling for about 5 minutes, to disproportionate the
hypochrite- ion to chlorate and more chloride:
3 KOCl → 2 KCl + KClO3.
It's actually quite dark yellow. Like piss yellow. At this moment, I'm not really worried about it, just wondering what's happening, as long as it
makes pure chlorate and the MMO doesn't deteriorate, I'm happy.
[EDIT] It's a MMO anode and cathode, BTW.
[Edited on 9-4-2014 by Zyklonb]
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hyfalcon
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That's whatever process coated out on the MMO. Remember, this is USED MMO. So whatever process it was in before that it was taken out of left some
of the process product on it that must be removed first if you don't want it contaminating your product.
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Mailinmypocket
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It always becomes yellowish after a while, even after cleaning the anodes and using the same ones many many times I have had it go yellow. Now, mind
you those times were just tests without dichromate so on a normal basis the liquid in my cell is always yellow. Why are you stopping it to boil the
solution? I mean... I understand why, but you don't need to. That's usually the way people to to convert bleach to chlorate via metathesis.
Have you checked out woelens page on chlorate cells?
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Zyklon-A
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I did read it a while ago, I will read it again though. I soaked the anode in HCl for about two hours, does it need to be in there for longer? I
don't know why I boiled it, I wont do it anymore.
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Mailinmypocket
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I think that should be okay if you need to clean them. Never did it myself though. Honestly when I received mine from laserred two years ago they were
never cleaned. Just cut to size and built into a cell. They seemed to work very well so I never bothered cleaning them. They get scrubbed with water
and a toothbrush after a run just to clear off the salt and what have you.
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Zyklon-A
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Ok, I'm starting to see many small crystals of potassium chlorate falling out of solution! Many thanks Mailinmypocket and everyone else for you help.
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hyfalcon
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The HCl/H2O2 mix I used after cleaning about 8 of lasered's electrodes looks like week old piss from someone that was dehydrated. This solution
started out water clear. I'm sure I have SOME titanium compounds from the limited exposure of the edges where these were cut, but it would be a very
limited amount. I'm curious what it might actually be.
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