The Volatile Chemist
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On tri - R- Borates
It's really hard to talk about chemistry on twitter with the 120 word limit... Me 'n' Brain and force were talking about trimethyl borate and
triisopropyl borate. I was considering making some of the second as I have no methanol. Just wanted to discuss some procedures for the making of
organic borates.
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The Volatile Chemist
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Sorry for the double post, but just wanted to separate the topic from the ideas. So far, it has been suggested by B&F that sulfuric acid aids the
formation of such borates. I have tried a mixture of isopropanol and boric acid by themselves w/o success, so I will try next with concentrated
H2SO4.
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Brain&Force
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So...it appears that water is our enemy here.
The absence of water promotes the production of the ester, which is why sulfuric acid is recommended for production. If you're using 70% isopropanol,
that's probably killing it (though the boric acid should produce a green flame anyway).
If you're getting yellow flames it's likely because of incomplete combustion (a problem with long chain alcohols).
At the end of the day, simulating atoms doesn't beat working with the real things...
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Magpie
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This may be helpful:
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=16439
The single most important condition for a successful synthesis is good mixing - Nicodem
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The Volatile Chemist
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Thanks! It is helpful.
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subsecret
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In order to remove the water, you could fill a Soxhlet extractor with calcium chloride and use it as a reflux setup. It would require more solvent,
but it would help to improve yield.
Fear is what you get when caution wasn't enough.
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The Volatile Chemist
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Quote: Originally posted by Brain&Force  | So...it appears that water is our enemy here.
The absence of water promotes the production of the ester, which is why sulfuric acid is recommended for production. If you're using 70% isopropanol,
that's probably killing it (though the boric acid should produce a green flame anyway).
If you're getting yellow flames it's likely because of incomplete combustion (a problem with long chain alcohols). |
I'm actually using 95% isopropanol, but it's ~6 years old, so that may be part of the problem...
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Brain&Force
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Simple salting or drying with calcium or magnesium should do the trick. If you want to use methanol, buy HEET from a hardware store - it's relatively
pure methanol.
At the end of the day, simulating atoms doesn't beat working with the real things...
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Mailinmypocket
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| Quote: Originally posted by Brain&Force | | Simple salting or drying with calcium or magnesium should do the trick. If you want to use methanol, buy HEET from a hardware store - it's relatively
pure methanol. |
Check the paint section of the hardware store, you can usually find methanol in larger cheaper quantities. This bottle costs something like 4.99 and
they also have 4 litre size too. 
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The Volatile Chemist
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Great, thanks! I'll be able to try this in a week at best, I'm leaving for a camp today.
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subsecret
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If you buy HEET, you'll want to distill it first. The commercial product has been said to contain an oily, high-boiling impurity.
Fear is what you get when caution wasn't enough.
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The Volatile Chemist
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Distilling that kinda stuff would be a bit of a fire hazard, though, right?
I won't be able to try anything today, but I'll plan for tommorow.
[Edited on 8-10-2014 by The Volatile Chemist]
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