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Author: Subject: Chem Demo: Powders Becoming Liquids
careysub
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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 09:15
Chem Demo: Powders Becoming Liquids


Years ago I read in an old chemistry manual (early 20th century) about a chemical demonstration that pointed out while mixing liquids and getting solids is commonplace the reverse is not, and had a demo in which two finely powdered substances were vigorously shaken together in a test tube, which became a liquid.

Can anyone propose what this might have been, or a similar demonstration reaction?
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aga
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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 11:32


Zinc Chloride and Choline Chloride - maybe.

I know next to nothing at all, so don't quote me.

Edit :

That makes a deep eutectic, yet it can hardly be called a liquid at RT.

Using my advanced google SuperPowers i typed in 'Chemistry demonstration two solids make liquid' then i pressed Enter and found this :-

http://www.nuffieldfoundation.org/practical-chemistry/endoth...

"Solid hydrated barium hydroxide is mixed with solid ammonium chloride ... produce a liquid" for the hard of Clicking.

[Edited on 5-9-2015 by aga]




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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 12:39


Your Google-fu is powerful!

I tried a number of search combinations and waded through scores of potential results without finding that.

There must be others though - I am pretty sure copious ammonia and sub-zero temperatures were not featured in the ancient chem text of yore.

[Edited on 5-9-2015 by careysub]
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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 12:47


Choline chloride or choline bitartrate (easier to find OTC) and urea will make a deep eutectic solvent that is a bit viscous but still definitely liquid at room temperature. Unfortunately, it doesn't happen instantaneously. For me it took an hour or so for the mixture to become a thick, syrupy consistency after a good amount of mixing and shaking, and a few more for it to completely liquefy. I used the bitartrate though. The chloride probably works better, and it's easily made from the bitartrate by reaction with potassium chloride, as potassium bitartrate has very low solubility. (and then if you have some antimony trioxide handy, you can try this procedure in which two insoluble compounds will react under reflux to form a soluble double salt with a neat crystal structure).

[Edited on 9-5-2015 by zts16]




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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 12:53


Unfortunately i tried too hard to find more "two solid chem makes liquid" references, which exhausted my Google-Chi.

Found far too many references to "Hot Chick" which i must now read repeatedly.

No Alien Lizard can forego a bag full of Hot Chicks when hungry.




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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 13:01


Do people generally have antimony trioxide handy ?



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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 13:50


Quote: Originally posted by aga  
Do people generally have antimony trioxide handy ?
Probably not, but it's fairly inexpensive from the pottery store, and there's not a ton of stuff you can do with it, so if you do happen to have some laying around, it's quite likely that you'd be happy to find something interesting to do with it. ;)



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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 16:23


Does the antimony trioxide have to do with the "becoming liquids" bit, or the "hot chicks"?

Either way perhaps I should get some? :-)
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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 19:19


Just found this.. first try
http://www.answers.com/Q/Can_two_solids_combine_to_make_a_li...
Menthol and camphor.

Apparently this is a common search. Typed in "two solids" and Google suggested the rest for me. The answer was second down.

Also sodium + potassium :)


[Edited on 6-9-2015 by violet sin]
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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 21:28


You have exposed Aga and me as the Google charlatans that we are, to have failed in this task!

And I think this is very likely the demo from the olde book. It sounds right.

I will have to try this.

Here is a discussion of this experiment:
http://www.umanitoba.ca/outreach/crystal/Grade%209/Cluster%2...

It has this explanation:
"For camphor, however, its natural tendency is to sublimate, or go directly from a solid to a gas at room temperature, albeit rather slowly. When it is mixed with menthol, the new substance adulterates the camphor and the mixture forces it to go through the liquid state. In other words, adding a foreign substance will cause the substance to become impure and change its physical properties, or changes that do not change the composition of the substance."

And as a bonus for completing this experiment you have made your own supply of VapoRub concentrate! It would need diluting with an ointment basis (like petroleum jelly) about 20-fold, Vicks VapoRub contains 4.8% camphor and 2.6% menthol.

Aga's earlier example is kind of cooler (:-)) for a demo since it is a genuine chemical transformation. Even though the two accompanying phenomena of noxious gas evolution, and getting really, really cold kind of steal some of the 'melting' effect's thunder - and thus make it a less "pure" showcase of the phenomenon - you are getting three effects for the price of one.

[Edited on 6-9-2015 by careysub]
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[*] posted on 5-9-2015 at 22:29


Between eutectics of low-melting solids, which are liable to give rapid and nice reaction?
Na and K?
Lactic acid and lactic acid (both chiral forms melt at +53, racemate at +17)?
Others?
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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 01:44


ICE + NaOH :D



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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 07:33


Perhaps this isn't the best example of solids turning to liquid, but it's not bad. I've seen a more profound effect where the material is seemingly quite solid but turns to syrup upon being struck with a hammer. In the example I saw a solid rod of thixotropic material was tapped on the counter to illustrate how stiff it was before the transition.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgDQsYAcS3o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJsoCWqCsJ8#t=2m30s
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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 14:18


Quote: Originally posted by deltaH  
ICE + NaOH :D

Erm, Ice powder ?

Is it anhydrous ? ;)




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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 14:38


aga. I take it you don't get snow where you live. :D
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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 15:28


Snow got banned here when they discovered that Winter was caused by people storing snow on their rooves (presumably so they didn't have to go up into the mountains to get it).

I'd encourage everyone to stop storing snow on your roof and enjoy warmer weather all year round.

Here's the proof :-

First photo is of some Alaska people greedily shovelling snow onto their roof from a vast stockpile they already accumulated, which results in grey skies and crappy cold weather.

snow_roof.png - 139kB

When people stop doing that, and leave the snow where it should be, it looks like this :-

sun_roof.png - 228kB




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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 17:34


Ba(OH ) 2 + NH4Cl
Also a good demonstration of an endothermic reaction.
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[*] posted on 6-9-2015 at 18:54


Quote: Originally posted by Argentum  
Ba(OH ) 2 + NH4Cl
Also a good demonstration of an endothermic reaction.

Yeah. For maximum effect, stir with a thermocouple. If you do it at a reasonable quantity on a block of wood with a little puddle of water tou can get the water to freeze and stick to the bottom of your beaker.
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[*] posted on 7-9-2015 at 00:01


Quote: Originally posted by Argentum  
Ba(OH ) 2 + NH4Cl
Also a good demonstration of an endothermic reaction.

You may find that was in the first reply to the OP.




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[*] posted on 7-9-2015 at 02:10


Quote: Originally posted by aga  
Snow got banned here when they discovered that Winter was caused by people storing snow on their rooves (presumably so they didn't have to go up into the mountains to get it).



What a load of bull. Everyone knows that winter is caused by the White Walkers.




Smells like ammonia....
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[*] posted on 7-9-2015 at 02:55


Quote: Originally posted by aga  
Quote: Originally posted by Argentum  
Ba(OH ) 2 + NH4Cl
Also a good demonstration of an endothermic reaction.

You may find that was in the first reply to the OP.


This is a lot like googling... the result you want is usually one of the first, the rest is all blah blah snow and salts... oh and someone's bound to be a nazi/hitler etc.




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[*] posted on 7-9-2015 at 05:12


A solid acid + solid base (not to stong or it could be dangerous) might work like Mg(OH)2+2NaHSO4=Na2SO4+MgSO4+2H2O. Although I doubt it would work as well in theory.



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[*] posted on 8-9-2015 at 07:14


That quick clay demo is very cool, I'd never heard of that before. That would make a great hands-on demonstration for my outreach program. Anyone know if that stuff is for sale someplace? Geologist supply store? Anyone live in Norway that could dig some up?

The menthol and camphor demo is very cool too. I'd like to try that if I ever get menthol.
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[*] posted on 8-9-2015 at 07:22


There is even a kit on eBay: "Ammonium Thiocyanate and Barium Hydroxide, 100g, Fast Freeze Reaction Experiment containing 100 g each of ammonium thiocyanate and barium hydroxide.

Any ammonium salt will do however. Ammonium chloride is cheap, Shakhashiri in his chem demo vol. 1 also uses ammonium nitrate.
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[*] posted on 8-9-2015 at 11:25


Nobody mentioned indium and gallium?
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