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Author: Subject: Carbon Foam Refractory Made From Bread
Brominated Potato
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[*] posted on 12-10-2017 at 06:58


About graphitization, I found this article about graphitization of charcoal using rare earth metals:
http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acs.langmuir.6b02000
The abstract seems relevant but I can't afford 40 dollars.
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[*] posted on 13-10-2017 at 13:57


Quote: Originally posted by Brominated Potato  
About graphitization, I found this article about graphitization of charcoal using rare earth metals:
http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acs.langmuir.6b02000
The abstract seems relevant but I can't afford 40 dollars.


save your money and enjoy

although i think your are supposed to ask in references, so grab quick incase the file has to be removed. Ask a admin for access to ref i will plonk a copy there incase

Attachment: wang2016.pdf (6.1MB)
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[*] posted on 13-10-2017 at 14:33


Beaten-up carbon, no matter what the starting compounds were, nor the process, is likely to become an entire field of physics/chemistry in itself.

chironex's exploits got me interested in the whole Carbon Quantum Dot thing (CQD/QD/CD).

Zhi et al came across QDs while trying to purify them.

Turns out that many abused carbon materials contain them.

Anyone ever seen some brown/black tarry goo after an OC experiment ?

Guess what's in there.

Sticking stuff in a microwave seems to be the easiest route to QDs, so i'll give that a try, seeing as the results have already been documented.

Attachment: yang2013.pdf (395kB)
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[*] posted on 15-10-2017 at 19:04


Another Brominated Potato request

Attachment: Iron-catalyzed graphitization of biomass.pdf (2.3MB)
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[*] posted on 27-12-2017 at 14:00


It was a rainy day off work today so I thought I'd give this a shot. I bought a quart-size metal paint can and punched two holes in the lid for gas exhaust. I loaded this with 3 slices of honey wheat bread.

1.jpg - 310kB

This was placed in my charcoal chimney "furnace" and heated for about 50 minutes. About 20 minutes in, the smoke coming from the holes in the lid caught fire and burned for a while, as was noticed by others.

2.jpg - 305kB

After cooling down here's what it looked like. The bread had shrunk considerably and is somewhat brittle, but I did get one nice tiny slice intact. Neat!

3.jpg - 254kB



I made good use of the coals afterward.

4.jpg - 431kB
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[*] posted on 27-12-2017 at 14:02


Awesome !

Measure the resistance of the product - obviously not the sausages.




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[*] posted on 28-12-2017 at 18:14


Stabbing the bread with probes 1cm apart, I got several readings. The average for the large piece (pictured) was about 15 ohms. The other pieces had values around 80, 30, and even just 8 ohms.

80 ohms over 1cm corresponds to 0.8 ohm*m, and looking up a table of resistivities of various materials (here) that's about 300x less conductive than graphite measured along the plane of the sheets. The 8 ohm measurement would then be 30x less conductive. Assuming I have my facts straight.

I made somewhat conductive bread!

5.jpg - 435kB
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[*] posted on 28-12-2017 at 20:35


Perhaps you should be looking at it another way: Given a resistivity of 3.5 x 10-5 ohm*m for amorphous carbon, your bread is approximately 23,000 times more conductive than regular ol' burnt bread.



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[*] posted on 29-12-2017 at 00:02


Excellent stuff MrHomeScientist !

The confirmation that it is also measurably conductive with a meter is very encouraging.

Has anyone tried burning some bread in air to see what resistance that ends up with ?




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[*] posted on 29-12-2017 at 00:26


I've been really wanting to get back into this... But the time has been imaginary thus far. Ever since my better half handed me a solid black lump of a potato found in back of oven, it's been on my mind.

Dollar store had bags of prilled Styrofoam. Basically just not stuck to one another, sold as decorative snow. I imagined making several potatoes into mash and mixing in the wee Styrofoam orbs. If done right with super low temperature start and ramped up final temp, it could make great insulation. Though I bet weak unless stabilized, chopped up fiberglass insulation? Hopefully that will be my next test. Need a good container for this one, going to check the thrift stores when I get a chance.




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[*] posted on 1-1-2018 at 06:52


That really is quite amazing.
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[*] posted on 1-1-2018 at 08:15


Today i baked a loaf and pyrolysed the resulting bread.

My half-baked (pun intended) idea was to add 10% sulphur powder to the mix, right at the start, in some vague hope that the yeast might utilise it somehow and cross-link the gluten bits.

All it made was a smelly yellow loaf and a fairly nasty pyrolysis smell.

The end result is no non-conductive that it is effectively an insulator :(




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[*] posted on 1-1-2018 at 17:35


Dunno if this is any help.

Salicylic Acid and 4-Nitroaniline Removal from Water Using Magnetic Biochar: An Environmental and Analytical Experiment for the Undergraduate Laboratory
DOI: 10.1021/acs.jchemed.6b00154 J.

I wanted the paper for something else, but i figure if its magnetic then it might help with the conductivity of Bio Char. I also think there is a copy of the supporting material in refs.
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[*] posted on 2-1-2018 at 14:52


The reason for adding Sulphur to the bread is all down to a nagging suspicion about Bread itself.

Our species evolved without 'manna', IF we are the species we think we are.

Currently i think it likely that we are derivatives of ancient aliens not that it makes any great difference in the scheme of things.

Probably a cross-breed kinda thing.

Now, going back into antiquity, some tens of thousands of years, we suddenly see what we assume are Humans abandon hunter-gatherer techniques (which worked fine for millenia) and begin to Farm Barley, domesticate animals and build Cities - all in a very short time.

Looks more like meddling to me than 'natural' progression.

Anyway, that's Sumeria.

A bit of research found that Sulphur is available in large deposits in the zone once known as Akkadia, which appears to have had a close relationship with Sumeria.

A place currently called Mishraq in Iraq has some sulphur deopsits, as do other places in Iran, so it was locally available back in Sumerian times.

Fundamentally it is a HUGE shift for a hunter-gatherer to begin to predominantly Farm instead of hunting/gathering.

To create Bread is also a HUGE leap. 2 step-changes so fast is supicious, hence suspecting that sulphur and bread were related.

Edit:

Also that some people say the 'Annuki' got humans to mine Gold, which is also yellow.

[Edited on 2-1-2018 by aga]




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[*] posted on 3-1-2018 at 03:27


Quote: Originally posted by aga  
My half-baked (pun intended) idea was to add 10% sulphur powder to the mix, right at the start, in some vague hope that the yeast might utilise it somehow and cross-link the gluten bits.




For better crosslinking in your char try Ammonium PolyPhosphate rather than sulphur. Preferably a fine powdered phase II grade. It is the industry standard charring aid and cross linker.




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[*] posted on 19-1-2018 at 08:08


Stumbled across this the other day: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wex_yKfrTo4

He makes his bread in a welded steel chamber filled with argon, and shows how resistant it is to heat by melting aluminum on it with a thermocouple underneath. Neat!
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[*] posted on 19-1-2018 at 11:14


It was stumble-able right back on page 1 of this thread.

Quote: Originally posted by aga  
Odd.

I watched a utoob vid a while back by AvE (probably no relation to ave) doing exactly this with sliced bread.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wex_yKfrTo4




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[*] posted on 19-1-2018 at 11:56


Damn! I should have practiced what I preach and read the thread.
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[*] posted on 19-1-2018 at 13:28


It happens.

There is a rumour that even i posted without reading the thread (blush).

At least you didn't start a new thread based on a post in an existing thread, which leads to my next post ...




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[*] posted on 18-2-2018 at 11:05


An attempt today using just a wood fire and aluminium foil didn't turn out too well.

Looks like i made a high-temperature dog poo.

turd.jpg - 30kB




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[*] posted on 18-2-2018 at 13:28


I don't have the time to go and try this so don't crucify me. But has anyone tried, or would like to try, dipping their bread refractory foam in a thin mix of plaster and see what happens. Or sodium silicate perhaps, just something to shield the carbon from getting oxidised.
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[*] posted on 18-2-2018 at 13:42


Dipping a chunk of bread in some plaster slip would be very easy to do.

Nice idea Chemetix.

I tried a tin can today with very little Al foil as a cover.

Stupid really - the teeny amount of foil disintegrated.

Should just have turned the can upside down and used the floor as the seal. maybe with a brick on top to hold it down.

[Edited on 18-2-2018 by aga]




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[*] posted on 18-2-2018 at 13:54


Quote: Originally posted by Chemetix  
I don't have the time to go and try this so don't crucify me. But has anyone tried, or would like to try, dipping their bread refractory foam in a thin mix of plaster and see what happens. Or sodium silicate perhaps, just something to shield the carbon from getting oxidised.


I'm eventually hoping to get up to 2000 C thermal resistance, meaning that even plaster would melt at those temperatures, but hopefully graphite and/or amorphous carbon would stand up. Also, store-bought plaster of Paris is incredibly prone to cracking unless you stabilize it with a fairly precise mix of either cement and sand, or perlite and other stuff.

Dipping the bread, though, is probably a good idea. I've never worked with sodium silicate before, nor can I think of any liquid-coating solutions at the moment, but what if one were to 'squeeze' bread between two lubricated steel containers, one larger than the other, and create a roughly-container shaped piece of shielded bread that can then be charred?

I've also been wondering whether it's worth trying to make one's own bread for use in this experiment, instead of relying on store-bought versions. Pizza dough comes to mind as a very formable, smooth-walled version, and it can be made pretty easily. Form it around a metal, cup-shaped object and make your own 'graphite' crucible, maybe?




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[*] posted on 18-2-2018 at 14:04


I made my own bread for the last few attempts.

Making bread is really easy.




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[*] posted on 18-2-2018 at 14:09


Quote: Originally posted by aga  
I made my own bread for the last few attempts.

Making bread is really easy.


I feel like this is the only way to go, and be scientific, with this project. Most breads have a lot of salt, which I can only imagine would mess with conductive properties, especially with adsorbed moisture.

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