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Author: Subject: Phalaris arundinaceae-source for active tryptamines
chemrox
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[*] posted on 10-2-2007 at 15:45
Phalaris arundinaceae-source for active tryptamines


Phalaris arundinaceae is Reed Canary Grass (RCG) a notorious invasive species that contaminates wetland habitats all over the PNW (US). It is reputed to contain DMT and 5-MeoDMT. I did an experiment quite a few years ago using TLC to see if an extract from RCG contained any and found a spot that moved with the same RF as 5-Meo. I can't locate the details right now but I recall I only had a small amount of extract from some dried plant material extracted with hexane. Later I tried both hexane and EtAc on a wet mass of concentrated RCG obtained from a wheat grass extractor and then frozen and brought back to ambient temp. I got a hopeless emulsion that was discarded after several weeks. By then my interest was winding down.

My original hope was to find an easy way to get useable quantities of DMT's from RCG so that I could "popularize" the stuff as an easy "high." My motive was to contribute to the eventual eradication of the nuissance species either by gross consumption or by the drug cops. Drug cops as environmental activists!

If anyone is interested in reviving the project I'll try to find the old notes and share them. Spring is nearly here and RCG is starting to propogate. Best season is mid summer.

Nota bene: I did not have a suitable method for extracting large quantities then and used the old mix and shake method.

I now have a soxhlet that is big enough to handle a few grams of the concentrate at a time. I wonder if I could incorporate a Dean Stark in the extraction apparatus and run it with semi-wet goo from the wheat grass extractor?

This would be a workaround that would probably prevent the emulsion from forming. I was going to run the extraction with a single solvent; EtAc.

[Edited on 26-3-2007 by chemrox]
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[*] posted on 10-2-2007 at 23:45


Well, other than going well over the line of legality and academia with this one I don't understand why you'd mess with phalaris of all things...

There is an Oaxacan Mimosa Hostillis strain readily yielding 1% by weight DMT. Go to the Lycaeum & follow Noman's TEK & you'll be a very happy person.

I don't see much of a future in any attempts to "Popularize" the death experience that is DMT. It's not to be so flippantly thrown to the masses, IMO. It's a bit on the heavy side. It has very real risks involving possibly fatal hypertension in some people, IIRC. Possibility of stroke exists. Read Strassman's book for more details on this.
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chemrox
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[*] posted on 11-2-2007 at 21:01


Phalris a. is a problem in the PNW where the popular recreational substances include smoking amphetamine, inhaling whatever and brown Mexican heroin so full of garbage it causes infections and worse. Of course booze and reeefer are also popular and are the most benign in general use. Given the background, DMT seems one of the safer options. In any case, if a few little dweebs that ride around with 125 db mufflers in raked Hondas vandalizing office buildings with their skateboards have a bad trip or experience fatal hypertension and a wetland habitat is saved in the process ...gee, which would I vote for?

Having made that harsh statement, at least partway tongue in cheek, I had DMT a number of times back in the 70's and can't share your apraisal of it. I found it quite fun, no death, extremely hallucingenic...short acting and fun. DET was a bit more like your description but not nearly so dire.

I guess its all a matter of orientation and conditioning. I didn't find DMT to have the body load you alluded to but I have heard that 5-Meo-DMT has such a load. Thanks for your comments.
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[*] posted on 11-2-2007 at 21:26


Quote:

and a wetland habitat is saved in the process



can we add alittle zone for Bufo alvarius while were at it...

i would hate for them to go the way of the dodo........

save the whales?
how bout spread the bufo?
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chemrox
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[*] posted on 26-3-2007 at 22:15


we'd kinda have to go the opposite way wouldn't we? show that Phalris is so much better a source that they should "SPARE THE FROGGY!"
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[*] posted on 7-8-2007 at 21:51


It seems that especially Phalaris brachystachys looks like a promising source of alkaloids.

"P. brachystachys grows in the Mediterranean and Macaronesian regions, where it has sometimes been used as fodder. It is therefore found also casual, but very rarely outside its natural distribution area."

"All the seven species analyzed so far contain DMT as the main alkaloid: however, P. brachystachys and P. minor seem to contain only this indolalkylamine, the former in high concentration, the latter in trace amount."

http://diseyes.lycaeum.org/dmt/aq1.txt




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[*] posted on 7-8-2007 at 21:55


"My original hope was to find an easy way to get useable quantities of DMT's from RCG so that I could "popularize" the stuff as an easy "high.""

???
idiotic idea




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[*] posted on 25-1-2016 at 08:03


Has anyone ever try to extract DMT from P. Btachystachys ? Wiki say that it has up to 3% alkaloids mainly DMT
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[*] posted on 25-1-2016 at 14:38


My intention was to popularize RCG harvesting as a control on the spread of this highly invasive hydrophyte. As for DMT as a "death trip" I guess a lot depends on personal psychology and orientation. I have enjoyed my experiences with it but found 5-MeO-DMT to be almost inactive and rather hypertensive. DMT can be metabolized in oral form using a MAOI. I believe the combination of dmt and maoi is called ayahuasca when the ingredients are herbal in nature. But maybe it's only ayahuasca when prepared by a shaman. Or you could simply ingest a maoi followed by oral dmt. In such cases I believe the resulting experience would be a lot more like psilocin. People seem to have one of two kinds of dmt experience, frightening or galactic both very intense. My experiences were more the galactic type. Insights were terrific but came too quickly to retain.



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[*] posted on 26-1-2016 at 18:04


I'd be concerned about the possibility of gramine contamination, although it's recessive so it wouldn't be horrific to breed out. I would say just take the leaves, and don't shred all the plant or you'll have a large mess, not a tiny one. To make a MAOI, there's quite a few legal Harmaline alkaloid containing plants. I found this page to be of use http://www.lycaeum.org/nepenthes/Plants/Phalaris/DMTLU.html

[Edited on 27-1-2016 by Neuro-]

[Edited on 27-1-2016 by Neuro-]
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[*] posted on 26-1-2016 at 18:48


DMT-nexus has many posts on Phalaris spp. alkaloidal content/activity. The concentrations are generaly low and the sheer volume of crude plant that needs to be processed makes it unpopular.
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[*] posted on 27-1-2016 at 01:06


Gramine is insolube in naptha while dmt is not.

Neuro your link does not work for me

[Edited on 27-1-2016 by underground]
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[*] posted on 27-1-2016 at 08:34


Quote: Originally posted by underground  
Gramine is insolube in naptha while dmt is not.

Neuro your link does not work for me

[Edited on 27-1-2016 by underground]
Ah thanks, me being lazy and not checking solubility charts. See if this link works http://www.lycaeum.org/nepenthes/Plants/Phalaris/DMTLU.html
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[*] posted on 27-1-2016 at 09:45


Yes it works now, but nothing interesting on phalaris brachystachys. Wki said to contain up to 3% alkaloids while aquatica and arundinacea will contain 0.1%- 0.2% max!! I just want to know if anyone ever try to extract p. Brachystachys to see if 3% content is true

[Edited on 27-1-2016 by underground]
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chemrox
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[*] posted on 27-1-2016 at 21:55


The issue seems to be AQ-1. According to the erowid article the normal P. brachy is low in alkaloids...It's only the AQ-1 version that has 3% dmt again according to the article.

[Edited on 28-1-2016 by chemrox]

Attachment: Phalaris spp.dmt_alkaloids.pdf (1.5MB)
This file has been downloaded 550 times





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[*] posted on 28-1-2016 at 03:20


Quote: Originally posted by chemrox  
The issue seems to be AQ-1. According to the erowid article the normal P. brachy is low in alkaloids...It's only the AQ-1 version that has 3% dmt again according to the article.

[Edited on 28-1-2016 by chemrox]


Where did you find that ? At the end of the pdf file there is a list (see also attachment) of alkaloids content of some European Phalaris.
P. brachystachys looks good...

phal.png - 66kB
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