Sciencemadness Discussion Board
Not logged in [Login - Register]
Go To Bottom

Printable Version  
Author: Subject: “Poison is Queen”
Magpie
lab constructor
*****




Posts: 5855
Registered: 1-11-2003
Location: USA
Member Is Offline

Mood: Chemistry: the subtle science.

[*] posted on 12-3-2018 at 17:46
“Poison is Queen”


That is the title of one of the chapters of “I, Claudius.” This title referred to Livia Drusilla, wife of Caesar Augustus. She was an expert at poisoning political rivals. This all leads up to the recent poisoning in Salisbury, England of an ex-Russian spy. Investigators released today that the poison was a Novichok of Russian origin.

Are the Russians the only ones who can make a Novichok or does this poison have a fingerprint?




The single most important condition for a successful synthesis is good mixing - Nicodem
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Sulaiman
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 1925
Registered: 8-2-2015
Location: Behind You
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 12-3-2018 at 18:56


Looks like common knowledge : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novichok_agent



View user's profile View All Posts By User
Ozone
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 1255
Registered: 28-7-2005
Location: Good Olde USA
Member Is Offline

Mood: Integrated

[*] posted on 12-3-2018 at 22:23


I'll be damned. It was largely conjecture, then, but we had a pretty nice discussion about these, here: http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=7639

I can only imagine that the implementation of such an exotic agent-class served the purpose of sending a very specific message? Could also be BS. Who knows.

O3




-Anyone who never made a mistake never tried anything new.
--Albert Einstein
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Bert
Super Administrator
*********




Posts: 2705
Registered: 12-3-2004
Member Is Offline

Mood: " I think we are all going to die. I think that love is an illusion. We are flawed, my darling".

[*] posted on 12-3-2018 at 23:01


My opinion? (like assholes, everyone has one)

Dr. David Kelley is going to have a chat with poor Skripal in Valhala about what a crappy retirement plan HM Gov't. gave them.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Bert
Super Administrator
*********




Posts: 2705
Registered: 12-3-2004
Member Is Offline

Mood: " I think we are all going to die. I think that love is an illusion. We are flawed, my darling".

[*] posted on 14-4-2018 at 12:41



Both victims have recovered/regained consciousness. As another ape wirh fancy shoes and too many tools wandering this rock, I sympathize with them and feel better over that part of the outcome.

Not a likely event, considering the claimed class of nerve agents are deliberately designed to be irreversible after a short "aging" period, the victims were found unconscious hours after the claimed time of administration.

However, the Swiss laboratory performing testing for the OPCW has found an agent present consistent with all the reported effects, down to the lag in symptoms presenting after the alleged time of administration and having a much greater range between lowest effective dose and one likely to kill the recipient (nobody died, not a prominent feature of the hyposethized "novichok" class of agents).

Remember our old CBW friend from the 1950S, the chemical commonly refered to as BZ?

“the central nervous systems effects tend to be delayed, you can have a prodomol period of several hours”





Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:

1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.

Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).

View user's profile View All Posts By User
aga
Forum Drunkard
*****




Posts: 7028
Registered: 25-3-2014
Member Is Offline


[*] posted on 14-4-2018 at 13:05


2 super-powers amassed around a poor piece of the planet, far away from those two super powers' homelands, yet near natural resources they both want to own ....

Shit is going to happen, again. That's nature.

Porton Down probably already made the 'new kids' decades ago.

It's what they do there.

More likely that the Russians, being more cost-sensitive, just stole them, possibly using the same spy.




View user's profile View All Posts By User
Bert
Super Administrator
*********




Posts: 2705
Registered: 12-3-2004
Member Is Offline

Mood: " I think we are all going to die. I think that love is an illusion. We are flawed, my darling".

[*] posted on 14-4-2018 at 14:37


Porton Down and every other similarly tasked national laboratory world wide certainly made such chemicals as soon as they knew they were relavent to their objectives, be those offensive or defensive. It would be irresponsible for them NOT to have done so, how can testing be done without standards? Or countermeasures assessed in the only situation that matters, real world exposure?

Porton Down has openly said it was done there. Should you feel a need to synthesize some chemical to have a standard for identification purposes, would you destroy it all after?




Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:

1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.

Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).

View user's profile View All Posts By User
VSEPR_VOID
National Hazard
****




Posts: 498
Registered: 1-9-2017
Member Is Offline

Mood: napalm in the morning

[*] posted on 18-4-2018 at 17:30


Where can I buy some of these? Its for a friend



Selling large quantities of sodium metal for cheap
https://www.etsy.com/listing/619459301/sodium-metal-100g?ref...

Of all the so-called natural human rights that have ever been invented, liberty is least likely to be cheap and is never free of cost
View user's profile View All Posts By User
LearnedAmateur
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 509
Registered: 30-3-2017
Location: Somewhere in the UK
Member Is Offline

Mood: Free Radical

[*] posted on 19-4-2018 at 01:19


Not to start any conspiracy theories but there are plenty of third parties around who would love nothing more than for tensions to increase between Russia and Western Europe, and who certainly have the capabilities for this sort of synthesis...



In chemistry, sometimes the solution is the problem.

I am now training to manufacture contact lenses for a living. Time to join the lab community!
View user's profile View All Posts By User

  Go To Top