Sciencemadness Discussion Board » Fundamentals » Reagents and Apparatus Acquisition » Dear god... I have a LOT of sodium metal. Select A Forum Fundamentals   » Chemistry in General   » Organic Chemistry   » Reagents and Apparatus Acquisition   » Beginnings   » Responsible Practices   » Miscellaneous   » The Wiki Special topics   » Technochemistry   » Energetic Materials   » Biochemistry   » Radiochemistry   » Computational Models and Techniques   » Prepublication Non-chemistry   » Forum Matters   » Legal and Societal Issues

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Author: Subject: Dear god... I have a LOT of sodium metal.
evil_lurker
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Mood: On the wagon again.

Dear god... I have a LOT of sodium metal.

I managed to aquire 2 nice sized ingots weighing an estimated (will get around to actually weighing them later) 1.5kg each.

Amazingly they were shipped double wrapped in two plastic bags (with full hazmat shipping) and it appears they have never been immersed in oil... I guess they form an oxide coating on the outside that protects them from further reaction.

I'm off to see if I can't find a couple gallons of kerosine (hopefully it will be fairly dry) or other suitable solvent and a couple gallon jars to store them in.

Should be an interesting adventure this evening... will try and get some pics.
Eclectic
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Hey! I got 4 of those from the same guy off Ebay a few years back. Is he selling them again? If you look closely you should see a film of heavy mineral oil in the inner bag.

It's probably safest to store them as you received them. What if your glass jar of kerosene and sodium gets broken? My ingots are still fine after more than 4 years in the bags.

[Edited on 4-2-2007 by Eclectic]
evil_lurker
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Yeah, its probably the same guy... I've asked myself over and over again no tellings how many times "Whose penis did he have to suck and how many times to get those?" The price is simply amazing to @ around $35 a pound. I guess tonight I need to get out in the lab and do some cleaning, make sure my MSDS binder is in order, and all chemicals are stored correctly in case my order has drawn some unwanted attention. Eclectic International Hazard Posts: 899 Registered: 14-11-2004 Member Is Offline Mood: Obsessive You got those round ingots? Mine were rectangular bricks from a big steel drum, and purchased long enough ago that they could be mailed USPS ground if less than 12.5 lbs with no special hazmat fees. When you throw some on water, be aware that chunks bigger than 1CC WILL explode, especially if there is a bit of peroxide coating wet with oil. [Edited on 4-2-2007 by Eclectic] bio2 National Hazard Posts: 447 Registered: 15-1-2005 Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood .......chunks bigger than 1CC WILL explode........ My science/chemistry teacher in grade school loved to demonstrate this to the kids. He had an aquarium on the front table near the blackboard. One time he threw in a piece of Na that was a little too big and pow the aquarium glass was broken with water flying everyware. Luckily no one was hurt. not_important International Hazard Posts: 3873 Registered: 21-7-2006 Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood Back when I had a drum of sodium, it came dry - no oil at all. Nice elastomer seal in the lid, whenever you opened the drum there was a little inrush of air. A half brick in a large body of water was a good way to celebrate a holiday, although it was a bit tamer if it was cold and windy. (sigh) Sauron International Hazard Posts: 5351 Registered: 22-12-2006 Location: Barad-Dur, Mordor Member Is Offline Mood: metastable Got you both trumped. Qty 12 500 g Na metal in paraffin oil Panreac, Spain. Total 6 Kg. I bought entire stock of local agent a few years ago Also a small qty of Li wire maybe 500 g XxDaTxX Hazard to Self Posts: 66 Registered: 12-3-2006 Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood Hah! Speaking of getting trumped! I buy 25lbs worth of sodium a month! .... I am such a good customer that they throw in an equimolar amount of Cl for free! I throw mine in the water too .... nuts huh? ***Note for the particularly slow: Read post below for punchline. [Edited on 6-4-2007 by XxDaTxX] 12AX7 Post Harlot Posts: 4803 Registered: 8-3-2005 Location: oscillating Member Is Offline Mood: informative UPS must have a field day when they ship that combination -- or the plant where they are assembled, in any case! :rolleyes: Seven Transistor Labs LLC http://seventransistorlabs.com/ Electronic Design, from Concept to Layout. Need engineering assistance? Drop me a message! Fleaker International Hazard Posts: 1243 Registered: 19-6-2005 Member Is Offline Mood: nucleophilic  Quote: Originally posted by XxDaTxX I am such a good customer that they throw in an equimolar amount of Cl for free! [Edited on 3-4-2007 by XxDaTxX] OMG, monoatomic chlorine?! Neither flask nor beaker. "Kid, you don't even know just what you don't know. " --The Dark Lord Sauron BeanyBoy Harmless Posts: 47 Registered: 23-2-2007 Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood  Quote: Originally posted by XxDaTxX Hah! Speaking of getting trumped! I buy 25lbs worth of sodium a month! .... I am such a good customer that they throw in an equimolar amount of Cl for free! I throw mine in the water too .... nuts huh? [Edited on 3-4-2007 by XxDaTxX] Not nuts, just a little SOFT in the head, maybe due to something leaching your minerals out... Maya National Hazard Posts: 263 Registered: 3-10-2006 Location: Mercury Member Is Offline Mood: molten <<< I throw mine in the water too .... nuts huh? >>> What a waste! Don't you have/ know anything better to do with it? DUHHHhhhhhhhh! \"Prefiero ser yo extranjero en otras patrias, a serlo en la mia\" MadHatter International Hazard Posts: 1254 Registered: 9-7-2004 Location: Maine Member Is Offline Mood: Enjoying retirement eBay There's a guy on eBay selling 6.6 LBS(3 KG) for$130 + $72 shipping. That works out to a little less than$31/LB. Not the best price, but far from the worst. I may have to order just
for some experiments and a little fun time !

When I was in 6th grade science class, me and other aspiring, 11 year old pyros had a
teacher named Mr. Dahl(No puns please !). Anyway, Mr. Dahl was not Mr. "Dull". He liked
explosives like many of us do. One of his "neatest" bombs was the sodium metal depth
charge. He would place some Na in the bottom of a bottle and fill the rest of the bottle
with dry sand. He would drop the bottle in a 5 gallon bucket of water. It didn't take too long
for the bottle to explode with some of the smaller bits of Na flying around, burning, and
popping at the surface.

I was always fascinated by many of his demonstrations. That was 1969. Sadly, I haven't
seen any science teachers like him since. Those were days when science teachers had
little to worry about from "Big Brother" and they certainly had more balls than the current
crop.

From opening of NCIS New Orleans - It goes a BOOM ! BOOM ! BOOM ! MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !
UnintentionalChaos
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I had a science teacher just a few years ago (9th grade) who had been teaching for around 50 years and he still was very reminiscent of the old style chemistry teachers. First day of class involved a hydrogen fireball on his desk and for state changes he plunged test tubes of boiling paraffin wax into ice water, which makes nice little fireballs blow out of the tube (it also destroys the tube) and sprays burning wax about. For another class he acidentally used an erlenmeyer and it left a nice patch of soot on the ceiling (think rocket engine being held at arms length with short tongs). He told us about an old demonstration with sodium that they aren't allowed to do anymore. It inevitably involved a column of flaming hydrogen and water being blown out of one of those very large graduated cylinders.

I had a 7th grade biology teacher named Mrs. Dahl. Go figure.

Department of Redundancy Department - Now with paperwork!

'In organic synthesis, we call decomposition products "crap", however this is not a IUPAC approved nomenclature.' -Nicodem
not_important
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 Quote: Originally posted by Maya <<< I throw mine in the water too .... nuts huh? >>> What a waste! Don't you have/ know anything better to do with it? DUHHHhhhhhhhh!

Didn't seem like a waste when one had 30some bricks of it...
XxDaTxX
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 Quote: Originally posted by Maya <<< I throw mine in the water too .... nuts huh? >>> What a waste! Don't you have/ know anything better to do with it? DUHHHhhhhhhhh!

Ok for those that didn't, and still haven't gotten the sarcasm.

I said I get 25lb bags of sodium, with equimolar Cl thrown in free ..... NaCl..... I throw it in the water ...... water softener.

NUTZ HUH!?!

.....you guys crack me up.

[Edited on 5-4-2007 by XxDaTxX]
alancj
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Well, if "deerhead40" is the guy you guys are talking about then he must be at it again. He has a 6.6 pound ingot of sodium for sale... $130 +$72 S&H. He also seems to want you to believe that he manufactures the sodium in his very own 2 million dollar facility.

 Quote: http://cgi.ebay.com/Sodium-metal-6lb-ingots-salt-lab-chemica... We are selling a 6.6 pound ingot of Sodium ( made from salt ) which is manufactured under the most stringent U.S. conditions and regulations. This sodium is not made in someones' home or basement (or over seas)! We manufacture this in a 2 million dollar facility. In fact, we are one of the leading distributors of sodium in the world! GM, Ford, etc. use our sodium! You may bid in confidence and read our feedback from our customers who have purchased sodium from us. We didn't just "jump" into this market last week!

Sounds like an incredible moron if you ask me. Ok, dearhead40 I believe that FORD buys from YOU, and pick up taxidermy parts for the executives while they are at it.

-Alan
evil_lurker
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Who the hell knows. All I know is that I have my sodium.

DHL lost my first shipment (think someone stole it), seller promptly sent off another shipment.

Guy may be fibbing in the description, but he did come thru, responds to emails quickly, and was a great ebay seller in my book.

And most importantly my door still hasn't gotten kicked in as of yet (knock on wood).
ordenblitz
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I got the same story about DHL losing the shipment as well. Never got the tracking number either for the first shipment. Must be some delay game but why is unknown.

It did finally come it and was very nice material although the packing technique was less then desirable. Simply stuffed the logs in the DHL plastic shipping bag. Actually had a hole in it when it arrived where you could see a nice white log.

Talked to this guy on the phone and he told me that they make the sodium for engine valve filling. Might be true.. after all someone has to make it. Possibly he is an employee and leaves every day with a log in his pants.
Hopefully they pack it better when shipping to Ford.

Mumbles
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For my sorta AP chem class we had a professor who did some demos I really doubt he was supposed to do. Something tells me dissolving white P in CS2, soaking the soln onto a filter paper and placing this over a large graduated cylinder(glass) isn't kosher with the school board, or just about anyone.
Fleaker
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Ah, the barking dog demo! As far as I know, that's still standard fare in introductory chemistry classes. But to do it in high school, especially with the toxicity and "regulated nature" of phosphorus...wow. I don't even think he was supposed to have carbon disulfide on the premises.

edited due to nitpicking.

[Edited on 27-4-2007 by Fleaker]

"Kid, you don't even know just what you don't know. "
--The Dark Lord Sauron
Eclectic
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Please don't claim that something is illegal unless you can quote the relevant statute. AFAIK, there are NO CRIMINAL elements.

Regulated, yes. Illegal, no.
MagicJigPipe
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I too had a science teacher (who at the time had been teaching for decades, he taught my father) in 8th grade that was like that. We did the potassium + water experiment. At first he did it inside and ended up nearly catching the ceiling on fire. Then he did it outside with a bigger chunk in a metal bucket.

I can't really remember any other "good" experiments that we did but he was an excellent teacher.

Remember, this was only 10 years ago.

However, if he's still teaching, I bet he's not doing anything fun or entertaining in class anymore...

"There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. ... We know that the only way to avoid error is to detect it and that the only way to detect it is to be free to inquire. And we know that as long as men are free to ask what they must, free to say what they think, free to think what they will, freedom can never be lost, and science can never regress." -J. Robert Oppenheimer
7he3ngineer
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It was three years ago since I was at high school, but I had (and a younger brother of mine now has) a couple of teachers like this. Sodium, calcium and pottasium in water... hey everyone's been there. But I'm glad to here from my younger brother, that there are some fun experiments still being done that push experiment guidelines a little... like the local (Italian) chemistry teacher bringing in some of his homemade wine to teach students about distilation (and most significantly allowing a couple of students a taste at the end!)...try and see how that would meet their guidelines (remember 17 yo's).

Josh

Engineers aren\'t boring people, we\'re just interested in boring things!
MagicJigPipe
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Oh my god. That would never pass in the US. The parents would cause such an outrage that the teacher would be fired, arrested and charged with endangering the welfare of a child or furnishing alcoholic beverages to a minor. I would be willing to bet that the teacher would serve time.

"There must be no barriers to freedom of inquiry ... There is no place for dogma in science. The scientist is free, and must be free to ask any question, to doubt any assertion, to seek for any evidence, to correct any errors. ... We know that the only way to avoid error is to detect it and that the only way to detect it is to be free to inquire. And we know that as long as men are free to ask what they must, free to say what they think, free to think what they will, freedom can never be lost, and science can never regress." -J. Robert Oppenheimer
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 Sciencemadness Discussion Board » Fundamentals » Reagents and Apparatus Acquisition » Dear god... I have a LOT of sodium metal. Select A Forum Fundamentals   » Chemistry in General   » Organic Chemistry   » Reagents and Apparatus Acquisition   » Beginnings   » Responsible Practices   » Miscellaneous   » The Wiki Special topics   » Technochemistry   » Energetic Materials   » Biochemistry   » Radiochemistry   » Computational Models and Techniques   » Prepublication Non-chemistry   » Forum Matters   » Legal and Societal Issues