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Author: Subject: Mixes Fast enough for shape charges
Laboratory of Liptakov
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[*] posted on 9-4-2021 at 22:03


It so happened, that the booster scattered the charge on the dust and set it on fire. It was only deflagration of charge. With partially detonation about 10%. Only booster was full detonation. It seems, that your original mixtures
are much better. How exact oil you use in original mixtures? Vegetable? Olive? Or another? Next: I think, that your plate is too thick. Maybe will necessary use steel profile 3 mm. Not flat plate on flat wood. Profile has big advantage. Has air gap and always same distance for measurement. And a like bonus, bottom part catch secondary energy. Any way, very nice spectacular attempt...:D
I recommend stop attempts until to obtain minimal 10 pieces same profiles. For example 40x40 (or 30x50) x 150 mm, 2,5 - 3 mm of thickness. And a like first, try your best mixture 20g. Next: Well ground powders mixed mixed dry, is base error. Always is necessary create water porridge and create final dry grain 1 - 2x2 mm. Next: Density 1,4 is too much from my experiences.
I recommend 1,25. Nevr you fill fine powder. Always bigger grains.




[Edited on 10-4-2021 by Laboratory of Liptakov]




Safety explosive Alfred Nobel 1867. Safety ecologic detonator Dr. Liptakov 2015, inventor of CHP
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papaya
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[*] posted on 10-4-2021 at 02:19


I already started thinking it went unintentionally thermobaric :o Oil - I wrote minefal oil, but that is really a stuff sold in small bottles for sewing machines or something like that, its a thick transparent liquid with little to no odour.I tried also greenish olive vegetable oil, that also worked, but back then it was time of mixed fails/successes (no final recepie) so I cannot say if that was the veg. oil to blame or not. Anyway, veg. oil is a drying oil so maybe it is not worth for storage stability. Used one time vazeline without a problem. Oil is 0.3g to 10g of chlorate as written, but it is not a Religion,it was based on some guess not deep research, one may tune to better value maybe. But from my previuos attempts just oil + hexamine didn't work at 20mm diameter at least(see that last videos with kclo3), so don't be surprized if you try. It needs third, hard, maybe insoluble in oil (!?), fuel, better if with unsaturated bonds, reactive gruops, lower decomposition temperature, etc, at least how I understand. I don't know if that is coincidence or not but fuels that worked like hexamine vanilline are capable of sublimation, high vapour pressure, does it help? In my mixes first hexamine + rosin composite is made by melting them at 180C.Best powr ratio 2:1 hex to rosin. But reverse ratio is also interesting 1:2.15 hex/rosin, since it iy equimolar ratio of hexamine to abietic acid, it maybe creates a resinate salt(one is acid other is base)! I tried that only once it also worked,seemed juust a little less power,BUT.. it has good sides also - the mixture has plasticy properties - not much self sticky like real plasticine, but still easily put into tube press with finger, a hole made with pencil and it holds the the shape! About plate thickness - was thick but it last attempt it didn't matter since it burned. But I'm curious to see what damage to such a thick plate can potentially be done, let it be around some time :) Next about wet mixing,sifting etc - you are rigth, but I'm after the most practical mixtures maybe (?) One, that is just compining components and ready, if one exists of course. Same with density - why use mix that works only at 1.1 when there isother working at 1.4? IMHO that rosin stuff is not the most energy containing one, it owes power maybe best part to density. Regards.
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[*] posted on 10-4-2021 at 08:14


OK, thank for detail explanation. If it works at 1.4, is it of course better. Type of oil is not important, it seems. But very interest is abietic acid + hexamine, which create some salt. Maybe is it key of your invent. And partially binder. Rosin should be 80 % abietic acid and next natural compounds. Maybe is it pretty smelling process at 180 Celsius? 2 hours for melting process is maybe too much. Even one hour is enough long. But if this gived best results, is it important process. Because so huge holes from 10g - 12g chlorate mix are incredible. Especially on pretty thick target profile 2,4 mm.



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papaya
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[*] posted on 10-4-2021 at 16:33


Process is not that smelly, I did it indoors, some minty flavour. I used a small beaker 1/5 full and wrapped the mouth with Al foil to avoid oxidation, only fhing it requires to open that lid, stirr and scrap down into mixture again some of the hexamine that deposits on the colder walls due to sublimation. 180C is not critical to rosin in the abscence of oxygen, I read some rosin related chemistry but I forgot now to what maximum temperature it is still resistant, it may partially destroy hexamine though(maybe that is needed??). If I add just a pinch of hexamine to the molten rosin (not the whole quantity) it is obvious that it DISSOLVES into melt, of course when adding all powder it cannot dissolve anymore. Also with reaction the melt becomes darker with time. I'm not sure what is the chemical reaction here, I googled it but to my surprize not a single paper found, I found that theres some reaction with formaldehyde (addition to double bond yielding -CH2OH derivative), but seems to be not polycondensation(no polymer). also I know that hexamine is used as a substitude to formalin in making of phenol-formaldehyde resins (resols) since it will degrade at elevated temperatures to formaldehyde and some imines.. Complex chemistry here,theres a nature paper about it, if I remember correctly I choose temperature from that research so hexamine to become a little reactive at least and do something. monitored temperature with thermocuople, above 200C starts to really blacken, may yield char, not recommended.Below that I'm not sure if something usable will be obtained, I never explored all variables, don't want to deter anyone from actual research.Might even indifidual mix of rosin and hexamine powder just work? I had one failure but JUST ONCE! So one can test and prove that no reaction is needed, I'll be glad to know. I would be very thankful if someone with good organic chemistry background or one having IR spectrometer could look/ explain that reaction, no paper found after all!
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[*] posted on 11-4-2021 at 00:10


Energetic materials is an unexplored field of research. TACP has been known for 100 years. But never explored in detail. Until 2014. When it turned out that its detonation velocity at a density of 1.9 g / cc is up to 7500 m / s. Also diethylene glycol has been known for 100 years and NaClO4 even longer.
And yet, it was not until 2010 that the energy material NaP + DEG + H2O was discovered. Its VoD is up to 7000m/s. Incredible simply mixture, which no require nothing chemical equipment. Only mixing of 3 things at normal temperature. After mixing the mixture warms to 40 ° C it itself. And then it hardens. Done. And it holds in the cavity. During a 20 minute only. For this reason, it is quite possible to discover a new fuel for NaClO3. Without precise knowledge of the composition. Just discover and describe only the procedure that works. After all, the preparation of ROSHEX is a more demanding process. Requires a rugged chemical thermometer. Not everyone has one. Also the supply of more precisely regulated heat, not everyone has it. Measuring the temperature in a closed container is another problem. For example, I never needed these things. When I researching anything, the emphasis is on maximum ease of preparation. But it's great to know that such a powerful mixture can be prepared.
Which is the basis of science madness......:cool:




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[*] posted on 13-4-2021 at 13:51


Another comparative test, this time 12g versus 20g of that chlorate/hexamine/rosin/oil mixture on a 5mm thick steel plate. All parameters are the same (casing, initiation, density,etc) only the loading height is different:
https://tube.tchncs.de/videos/watch/edc4b1fe-c015-43d6-8e5e-...
News are a little disappointing - the dent left from 20g is noticeably smaller than from only 12g! Therefore the action of initiator was significant in previous tests, longer charge became weaker - not in the absolute energy output of course rather the pressure at the exit end I guess.I don't know what if there was for example x3-x4 times longer charge - might it even sustain detonation all along ? But this would require much more than 20g of material, I doubt I will ever be able to test that.
At least it left a dent on that thick plate..
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[*] posted on 13-4-2021 at 14:10


Quote: Originally posted by papaya  
Another comparative test, this time 12g versus 20g of that chlorate/hexamine/rosin/oil mixture on a 5mm thick steel plate. All parameters are the same (casing, initiation, density,etc) only the loading height is different:
https://tube.tchncs.de/videos/watch/edc4b1fe-c015-43d6-8e5e-...
News are a little disappointing - the dent left from 20g is noticeably smaller than from only 12g! Therefore the action of initiator was significant in previous tests, longer charge became weaker - not in the absolute energy output of course rather the pressure at the exit end I guess.I don't know what if there was for example x3-x4 times longer charge - might it even sustain detonation all along ? But this would require much more than 20g of material, I doubt I will ever be able to test that.
At least it left a dent on that thick plate..


Do you have nitromethane?
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[*] posted on 13-4-2021 at 14:23


Quote: Originally posted by MineMan  
Quote: Originally posted by papaya  
Another comparative test, this time 12g versus 20g of that chlorate/hexamine/rosin/oil mixture on a 5mm thick steel plate. All parameters are the same (casing, initiation, density,etc) only the loading height is different:
https://tube.tchncs.de/videos/watch/edc4b1fe-c015-43d6-8e5e-...
News are a little disappointing - the dent left from 20g is noticeably smaller than from only 12g! Therefore the action of initiator was significant in previous tests, longer charge became weaker - not in the absolute energy output of course rather the pressure at the exit end I guess.I don't know what if there was for example x3-x4 times longer charge - might it even sustain detonation all along ? But this would require much more than 20g of material, I doubt I will ever be able to test that.
At least it left a dent on that thick plate..


Do you have nitromethane?


Unfortunately not, but also I'm not a fan of low boiling liquids or other things that will turn energetic into a short living thing. Water nitromethane nitrobenzene all is good as long as you don't want to store it more than a day. Not that I need to store them, but I see a disadvantage in that therefore no interest to try.
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[*] posted on 14-4-2021 at 02:23


20g is weaker than 12g under the same conditions. Yes, at 40 g and a longer column, the detonation can completely disappear. Anyway, 12g and also 20g does a good work on thick 5mm steel. It is not a failure, it is a useful part of research. And an interesting lesson for anyone. Not everything is as clear and successful as it seems. That's what I meant when I saw first attempts, first successfulls with mixture NaClO3 + hexrosin.
MineMan: Yes, is possible use nitromethane. Or some else. But the main think were from start create maximaly simpl mixture with a good power for shaped charges. The, what increase power and stability of shock wave (always), is old good powder Aluminium 5%. Even 2% causes miracle.




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