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Author: Subject: Accidents...
Phantom
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thumbdown.gif posted on 4-4-2012 at 13:28
Accidents...


Well, I decided to make a new topic about accidents so we can learn from other people accidents. This is the place where you can write down maybe your own "mistakes" so we can discuss them. This is what every pyro should think about it and take it very seriously. I think everybody heard the story of "Phone"... 800g+ APAN went off in his face! Probably the most dramatic documented pyro accident ever. I have seen some pretty brutal videos on the net about people getting hurt by some HE, mainly primary, most likely TATP. I hope that biginners read this topic as well. Sometimes you just not reailse what are you really doing and this kinda stuff can easily kill you or injure you very badly. So please feel free to comment and share your accidents with energetics.

For the biginners, here is how to make some TATP : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kdei-g3FFBQ

This video just shocked me. What I know from the tags it was ANFO with miedziankit and a HMTD cap. I think the fuse was extremly short or a spark went inside the cap before the fuse could finish it's job.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-bkYZzdYSY&feature=g-u-u...

Pretty funny huh? Go think about it...

[Edited on 4-4-2012 by Phantom]

[Edited on 4-4-2012 by Phantom]




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Berrilium
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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 14:05


I've never had a 'mistake' per say. But I have come close to mistakes when I get absorbed I what I'm doing, eg putting Tatp into a charge and having open flame boiling something close by.
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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 15:59


I've already wrote about the most stupid and dangerous experiment of mine. I made a charge (AN + dinitronaphtalene), dig a hole and put some mercury fulminate into it. There was no separate detonator. Then I put piece of paper with KNO3 and ignited it. Sparkles, flying from burned paper ignited my charge (200 gr approximately) when I was standing near it (one meter probably). Another idiotism I demonstrated when I put my nose into a bottle with solution of NaOCl. It was like an impact on my lungs. I was unable to breath for some time.



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Bot0nist
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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 17:43
Had a Few.


When first starting, I tried to clean up a 200ml conc. H<sub>2</sub>SO<sub>4</sub> with a towel. Note to others. Cotton towel + Hot, conc. sulfuric acid = smoking pile of carbon and a room full of choking gasses/mist.
_______________
I once spilled RFNA on my nitrile gloved hand and up my arm. I hastily stripped off the glove and ran to the sink to wash up. I turned back around moments later to find the glove popping and spitting angry red fumes and flames about. Had this gone on a bit longer unattended, I have no doubt a lab fire would have ensued.
_______________
The last time I made TCAP (many years ago) I neutralized and dried the compound on a coffee paper. I tilted the filter to allow the white powder to pour off to be weighed. Half way through the "pouring" the whole lot (~1gram) detonated, shredding the paper, and giving me one hell of a fright. I still do not know if friction was to play, but I suspect static, as it was a very dry day out. Maybe I just looked at it wrong :o. No injury though. I did have on goggles at least. I never synthesize organic peroxides anymore, and I limit my work with primaries to < a few hundred milligrams, and not very frequently.
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Recently, I have spilled a few oil baths. No catastrophe, but one hell of a mess.


[Edited on 5-4-2012 by Bot0nist]




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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 18:46


Quite a few "Oh s**t" moments (unfortunately) come to mind:

The first was making organic peroxides in the first place, namely 50+ mL batches of MEKP. I never had any "accidents" per se but it scares me to think of what could have happened.

Pic related: http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/files.php?pid=163845&...

Later in my "kewl" phase I ball-milled anhydrous CuSO4 with magnesium turnings WITH STEEL BALL BEARING MEDIA for like 4 days straight with the house (not mine, my parent's!) being totally empty at times throughout the day. Nothing bad happened, made one hell of a bang when it was done but in hindsight that was a very stupid thing to have done.

Around the same time, I tried nitrating acetone peroxide which ended in a violent runaway. Luckily it was test-tube scale and I was wearing quite a lot of gear. It was, however, indoors and in an unventilated basement room.

When I first got sulfuric acid, the first thing I did was make a nitrating mixture with KNO3 in a shot glass. It began to fume in the air (HNO3 vapors) and I was curious as to what was happening. Like a fool I took a whiff and it nearly put me on the floor - tunnel vision, stars, the whole bit. I was home alone.

Later, when I first got "real glass" in 19/22, I experienced an unstoppable 500mL haloform reaction between Ca(ClO)2 and acetone which boiled significant amounts of chloroform into the (still unventilated) room as I attempted to salvage any yield I could.

I never bothered to buy keck clips for my 19/22 glass and TWICE I've had a chlorine generator experience too much back pressure and pop a joint. Again, no ventilation - just a scrubber and NaHCO3 solution in a spray bottle.

I also blew a joint once recovering some methanol from a benzocaine synth. I forgot to add boiling chips and it was bumping like crazy... decided to ignore it. Whooops.

I also had a bumping issue with an azeotropic distillation of a large batch run of HNO3. I stupidly left the distillation unattended. I had broken my 105-deg vacuum adapter so I just had the end of the condenser dripping into the storage bottle - there was nothing to catch the surge when it began bumping like crazy... Hot 68.4% HNO3 all over the (wood!!) bench and floor!

Despite this, I still have all my digits, my my mind, my lungs, my house, and my lab. I will never repeat these mistakes- they are all examples of dangerous learning experiences. Maybe someone can find this ramble useful.

-DTM





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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 19:30


One time i nitrated my cellulose . The remaining acid in which i nitrated cellulose was left on my table . I then added some piece of zinc in it . It was such a vigrous reaction that acid split every where and the container broke down with heat as it was an ordinary glass beaker. Further more i added potassium chloride in it and my whole room was full of nasty fumes . Since then i never played with a nitrating mix
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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 20:16


Quote: Originally posted by DougTheMapper  
Quite a few "Oh s**t" moments (unfortunately) come to mind:

The first was making organic peroxides in the first place, namely 50+ mL batches of MEKP. I never had any "accidents" per se but it scares me to think of what could have happened.

Pic related: http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/files.php?pid=163845&...


Doug, when I first came to this site, I made and posted an experiment with MEKP and every-time I saw that wine bottle neck filled with the oily monster I thought "Holy Sh*t, what if?" Even when wet with MEK it still makes a horrific, violent fire ball. And that's just 0.5ml! You had balls, my friend. I was scared and used tiny HDPE test tubes and made 5ml batches with what surely looked like an aliens, eskimo, space suit on the whole time.:D




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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 21:13


Three not very significant incidents. I prepared mixture of R-salt + AN. One week later violent reaction suddenly began. Gray smoke and viscous boiling liquid instead of plastic bottle. I was happy- my parents was not at home. Once I bring some kalium picrate to university. It is nice compound and we added small pieces into cigarettes. Piece of paper with 30-40 gr of aforementioned compound was in my hand when another boy ignited small piece of it at the distance about 3-4 meter. That small piece like a rocket missed heap in my hand. I was lucky at that moment- had its trajectory been 5 cm lower, it would have ignited picrate in my hand. Another small incident- I ignited few gr of mixture of KClO3 + Al with a match. Ball of fire and I lost some skin from my fingers.



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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 21:24


The flask is full of MEKP? God damn, although I knew a naughty kid by the name of LordEmrone, who had made 3L bottles of MEKP and stored them in his basement. I'm sure you remember his story of MEKP accident he had with 50ml. Somehow he got to keep his hand.

The most unforgivable accident to have is with ignition. Letting sparks fly into the device is just unacceptable. Moosemanty on YT blew off his arm with 10g TATP in CO2 cartridge, this kid (aka "The Screamer") clearly had the same issue.

Few peoople hurt themselves cutting HMTD straw, they know who they are. Another kid on RS had an HMTD cap in his pocket and it detonated. :D Anybody's guess whether it was pressure/friction or static. Needless to say, he was very unhappy with the hole that made in his leg and the bruising his junk took.

I've only had an accident this past summer with the most unlikely energetic- thermite. Was trying to light stoichiometric MnO2 thermite with some Mg filiings mixed with KNSU. Had no luck for like half hour. After failing another time, I waited 30 seconds and went to pick up the small note card holding 2g of thermite. As I was getting to the door to through it out, I saw a tiny spark, what must have been reinvigorated Mg due to the breeze of air, and the whole thing lit up in my hand. Felt like someone dunked me in the oven. Instantly the pain hit me and I hustled my arse to the tap to run a cold water on it. Did that for 15 minutes, because every time I'd pull the hand away, it would throb terribly. Was pretty concerned to the condition of the hand as it increased in size and I could see the two blisters formed. The burns were 3rd degree, but only a dime in size each and on the palm and finger. After half hour pain was barely noticeable. To dull any further pain, I took a shot of Whisky, lit up a cannon and walked off laughing in the sunset. Like a bauce.....




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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 22:11


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kdei-g3FFBQ

Looks much like fake. A CO2 with AP will burst into hundreds of scrapnels having the ability to penetrate at least a few centimeters into a human body, thus the main injuries will come from these scrapnels with very possible lethal effect or months long hospitalization.
Even 1 cm in diameter, 5-6 cm long, 1 mm thick steel pipe with AP has tremendous fragmentation effect and fragments from it can kill anyone in a few meters radius if hit the head.
I have done the experiment with such pipe piece, before 13 years, I put the AP filled pipe (about 4 grams AP) in a 20 liters tin can from chiese, in the middle of the can and detonated it (the can walls were like 0.5-1mm thick). The can was pierced all over, with tens of holes in it, the scrapnels that flew from it, hit a wall 1 meter away and penetrated about 3-4 mm in the wall (gypsum).

[Edited on 5-4-2012 by simply RED]




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[*] posted on 4-4-2012 at 22:16


I remember two accidents with hydrogen:

Once I decided to make hydrogen burner, so I took a jar, I made a little hole on the lid, filled the jar with NaOH + Al + water and waited till the jar fills with H2. Unfortunately, I didn't wait long enough :D When I lit it up, the hydrogen inside detonated throwing the lid up and scaring me to death.

Another one: I filled a balloon with hydrogen (made by aforementioned method) and I was to inhale it to have that nice voice :D I put water into the balloon and shaked to remove the NaOH particles. As I found out later, this was not enough. I had a strange feeling in lungs, my hands were shaking and I lost my taste (for about a day). The next day I had sore throat.




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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 00:48


Quote: Originally posted by simply RED  
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kdei-g3FFBQ

Looks much like fake. A CO2 with AP will burst into hundreds of scrapnels having the ability to penetrate at least a few centimeters into a human body, thus the main injuries will come from these scrapnels with very possible lethal effect or months long hospitalization.
Even 1 cm in diameter, 5-6 cm long, 1 mm thick steel pipe with AP has tremendous fragmentation effect and fragments from it can kill anyone in a few meters radius if hit the head.


It is real, go chewck out his other videos.




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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 00:57


Then he is ultimately lucky his skull did not become perforated like a strainer.



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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 01:02


I had a couple runaways during the nitration of pentaerithritol.

Once I had a runaway with HMTD. I didn't cool what is more I was stirring it so the crystals would form faster. This was my very first runaway so I was a bit scared. I ran out to the backyard holding the HMTD and quickly put it on the floor. I went inside the house to get some water in a bowl but it was too late. Now the floor outside is white because of the hydrogen peroxide.




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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 01:12


PGDN + AN mix being extremely easy to make, about as powerful as TNT, very safe and sensitive to a blasting cap solves the amateur problem of making dangerous ammounts of primary...

[Edited on 5-4-2012 by simply RED]




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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 02:22


I once made a tiny bit of AP that exploded too early, no damage done to my body ;), fuse was too short. I think a spark set it off prematurely.



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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 02:51


When I was about 14 my buddy and I were having some pyro fun with match heads. The device was 2 x 1/2" bolts each screwed into either end of a nut with a piece of phospherous striker and ignition material scraped off from 2 match heads in between. We threw these things into the air and when they hit the road they would explode sending the bolts flying. One of these went off in my hand while I was assembling it and rendered my index finger opened up like a peeled banana.

This was caused by a minute amount of OTC energetic material compared to the things kids are playing with these days and I shudder to think of the amount of unneccessary risk involved.

Kids enjoy pyro and they will play in that pen regardless of the rules and consequences. I think it would be a progressive thing to do to provide a controlled envoronment where kids can satisfy their curiosity. Teach them the chemistry, if they're going to play then teach them what compounds to play with and which to stay away from, and show them why. Show them where these compounds belong and where they should never be found, how to treat them, and, controversially, how to assemble a firework safely with all precautions in mind. This idea may be frowned apon but I would bet that pyro accidents would decline.

[Edited on 5-4-2012 by froot]




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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 03:37


This accident which I recall, is the only major one which Ihave had...till now.
It happened last year on a raining day. I, foolishly, without wearing any eye protection, cut out a piece of metallic sodium(1gm) and threw it onto the wet ground.
It did not react like it should have with water, but turned into a molten sphere.
I waited impatiently, and, at last, took my 5cm spatula(or whatever it's called) and poked it at the unreacting sodium.
It got stuck to it, and, after axactly 3 seconds, exploded violently with a bang.
And the best part is...all that molten sodium and it's hydroxide flew into my right eye, blinding me instantly. I ran to the sink to wash it and my face started to burn as if hot charcoal was thrown onto it. For the next few days, my eye kept releasing liquids and pus and it became red. In the morning when I would wake up and I would find my eye stuck and had to open it manually. My specs, which I was luckily wearing, got scarred and rendered useless, I had to get a new one. After 7 days, I made a full recovery.
I believe that I have learnt my lesson of wearing eyeware while handling energetics...:cool:
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[*] posted on 5-4-2012 at 04:15


Wait, so you are still blind on your right eye? That's some serious shit. I remember when I have grinded some natrium metal with some mercury. It exploded and almost hit my face and I did not have any gear on my face. Luckily everything was okay. By the way this was at school with the teacher :D



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[*] posted on 6-4-2012 at 07:41


these days i was making some chlorate gunpowder i have made about a kilogram of it . to check it power i burned 3 grams of gunpowder 2 mitres away from my one kilo of gunpowder heap . it was so powerful that the other 1kg heap also caught fire . there was a very loud bang and a small crater in the ground . luckily i was at a very safe distance and i was totally safe but my neighbours started peepin in my ground what happened . chlorate gun powder is very powerful its good to keep it at very safe place donot burn anything near it
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[*] posted on 7-4-2012 at 01:49


I once nitrated phenol with acetic anhydride/conc. HNO3. I was using an Erynmyer flask with a rubber septum. After slowly adding all the reagents into the well cooled flask and stirring for a while I let it warm back up to purify it. Apparently it was far too cold and the reaction barely got anywhere. After it warmed up a little it warmed up alot(and quite quickly). Blew the rubber off and sprayed/boiled everywhere. To this day I bet there are still splotches of missing "chemical resistant" paint in and around the fume hood. Oh university. Luckily I was unsupervised and was able to pretend like nothing happened after cleaning up. I recommend wearing safety glasses, having a large flask of ice water to quench emergencies, and to NEVER use a rubber septum for nitrations.



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[*] posted on 7-4-2012 at 15:27


My worst accident is not as severe as the last few but could have ended worse.

I was making some Cl2 in my backyard out of boredom. So i froze some bleach in a test tube to slow the reaction as I poured some hydrochloric acid in. This worked quite well and i stoppered it with a tube leading the gas into a second test tube that was in an ice bath. I then placed the first tube in a beaker that had very hot water in it to speed up the reaction. The only thing is that the second test tube was also stoppered.

The pressure built up quite a bit until the stopper on the first test tube, where the reaction was taking place, blew out. A cloud of chlorine gas shout out along with some Ca(OH)2 along with some unreacted bleach and hydrochloric acid.

Unfortunately for me I was very close when this happened, roughly a foot and a half away. I was fortunately not leaning over it.

The result was my sinuses burning like shit and a day long headache, but i did learn a valuable lesson.
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[*] posted on 7-4-2012 at 20:47


That first video of some Eastern European kid blowing his fucking hand off was taken down within a few hours of this thread's posting. Did anyone save it? Its instructional value is beyond measure.
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[*] posted on 7-4-2012 at 23:50


The closest call I ever had was dissolving half a pound of ETN for recrystallization in my condo on a natural gas stove with a double boiler. I decided to pour the ethanol in right out of the gallon can... And you know how those cans love to spill. After pouring a little ethanol in I saw that it was about to spill. I tilted the can toward me and as I was pulling it away the flame hit the can top shooting up from some spilled droplets, it went inside, and shot flaming ethanol into my face.

So... Things are going great at this point. I have half a pound of flaming ETN and my head is on fire... I quickly smother the flames on my head and grab the fire extinguisher and kill the flames over the ETN. Luckily it was still just a low temperature alcohol fire that takes around a minute to ignite ETN powder... Not really that dangerous unless not taken care of within twenty seconds.

I then discovered I was barely burned at all and went onward with the recrystallization after cleaning up the area.

[Edited on 8-4-2012 by TheMessenger]
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[*] posted on 8-4-2012 at 01:27


Quote: Originally posted by killswitch  
That first video of some Eastern European kid blowing his fucking hand off was taken down within a few hours of this thread's posting. Did anyone save it? Its instructional value is beyond measure.


YouTube > Search > Hand blown off




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