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Author: Subject: Sodium Azide
BromicAcid
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 Quote: Anybody knows if this reaction is possible? NaNO3 + (H2N)2CO ==> NaN3 + 2 H20 + CO2 Perhaps it works if you melt urea and sodium nitrate together at 150°C. Sodium azide decomposes at 300°C.

Well, any reaction is really possible, it's just a question of weather or not it makes enough of your desired product to be measurable. I can kind of see where the person that came up with this reaction was coming from, but I don't think it's valid, but that's just a superficial guess, it might work, but I'm not going to be the one to try it. Normally the high temperature methods involve heating sodium amide with sodium nitrate or more sanely ammonium nitrate, but both to my knowledge have explosion risks. Regardless of if it works or not I would assume the yields to be low, no more then 15 - 20% and that's with magnetic stirring, rigid temperature control, and efficient separation of products. Urea does some wacky things near its decomposition point, I am not going to try and debunk this reaction and have it come back to haunt me.

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chloric1
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Azines

Most of us are familiar with Hydrazine hydrate and organic nitrites in alkline alcohol to make azides. The question is if anyone knows if azines or hydrazones can be hydrolisized to create a hydrazine solution in situo and then react this with ethyl nitrite? Maybe MEK azine, sodium ethylate, hydroxide and ethyl nitrite? Better, potassium ethylate/hydroxide to get potassium azide

In the theater of life its nice to know where the exit doors are located.
Quince
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In post #9 here:
(I have to use the Google cache as I'm not a member of the site and it asks me to login when trying to access the page)
Microtek mentions some chem.pdf file containing hydrazine and sodium azide synthesis (the post that starts with "Yes it is nitrIte, and note that if you are going to use the hydrazine to make azide, you don't need to distill.".

Would someone that has access to this pdf kindly post the file, or at least quote the procedure here? Thank you in advance.

[Edited on 19-4-2005 by Quince]

\"One of the surest signs of Conrad\'s genius is that women dislike his books.\" --George Orwell
Quince
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Anyone?

\"One of the surest signs of Conrad\'s genius is that women dislike his books.\" --George Orwell
Rosco Bodine
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Here are the relevant pages extracted from the file . The entire file exceeds the

Attachment: chem(azide pages).pdf (324kB)

quicksilver
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I know this is not OT in that it's not chemistry per se' but it won't last forever as a method of collecting chems. People talk about this but never give details; so I thought I would add this last bit to this thread.
As a total aside the simple method of gathering azide from an automobile is to access most any American made car from 1993-2000. They appear to have the largest amount of azide pellets in the air-bag gas generator. The gas generator is installed as a unit in most that I have seen so if you pull one you get the whole thing, the bag, the gas generator, everything. At a junk yard they will charge you about $5-30 depending upon the model due to the difficulty in pulling them. There are junk yards that pull them all the time due to an interesting fact. Side-mounted air bags blow when poolry trained locksmiths try to gain access to the car. You just can't go poking around in the door anymore to try to open the car; you'll pop the air bag. So anyway, you can find the units for a low overall cost and some of them have a "screen" -like affair where the pellets are; you simply cut into the screen and retrieve the pellets. Others have a sheet-metal grill with is tougher. You need tin-snips of a quality made for heavy sheet metal work and it's fast going. - With no exageration you should be able to get a 500 gram bottle filled with not too much work. I recrystalized the pellets using hot distilled water and the product I ended with was just fine, clean and white. - the largest single unit was from a dressed up "Eddy Bower" Ford Bronco with about 250 gr. in each. If you want to U2U me about details on this issue feel free; I'm done collecting and frankly there is SO much out there I can't see this creating a run on the junk yards Zinc National Hazard Posts: 472 Registered: 10-5-2006 Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood I have read somewhere that NaN3 can be made by passing N2O over heated NaNH2 but I don't have any details about this procedure. Maztec Unregistered Posts: N/A Registered: N/A Member Is Offline Preparation of NaN3 Five grams of caustic soda (NaOH) was dissolved in 50 ml if ethyl alcohol (3A), and the clear portion was decanted in a 100 ml distilling flask containing 6 ml of hydrazine hydrate. After adding one ml of butyl nitrite (or isopropyl nitrite) the mixture was heated on a steam bath to initiate the reaction. Twelve ml more of the nitrite was slowly added in such a manner that the mixture refluxed slowly. Addition required about one hour and the mixture was heated an additional fifteen minutes. The reaction flask was cooled and the solid product collected on a filter. The product was washed with alcohol and air dried. Recrystallization from water yielded white crystalline material. Preparation of Isopropyl Nitrite A mixture of 45 ml concentrated sulfuric acid, 30 ml water and 110 ml isopropyl alcohol, previously cooled to 0 centigrades, was added to an ice cold solution of 114 grams of sodium nitrite in 450 ml of H2O. Slow addition required about two hours in order to maintain a temperature around 0 centigrades. The upper oily layer was separated and washed three times with 30 ml portions of 5 gram 100 ml sodium bicarbonate solution and 22 grams NaCl 100 ml solution respectively. uchiacon Hazard to Self Posts: 87 Registered: 3-7-2009 Location: The Jungle(neezeelund) Member Is Offline Mood: Financial Hey guys, I was just thinking about whether or not I should make the hydrazine hydrate or purchase it, which is an option to me. For 250g of hydrazine hydrate, it'd be$50 or about $40USD. I don't have copper/silver/teflon coated labware, and I know the HS and NaOH reaction will eat away at glass due to the amount of hydrazine hydrate formed. Presuming that this hydrazine hydrate is of a relatively high concentration, do you think that it's just better for me to purchase the material? hua xue DIY Harmless Posts: 3 Registered: 3-12-2009 Member Is Offline Mood: No Mood IN China ,NaN3 is very cheap。 zha ke xue Harmless Posts: 3 Registered: 2-12-2009 Member Is Offline Mood: happy In china ，NaN3 is about 7 dollar uchiacon Hazard to Self Posts: 87 Registered: 3-7-2009 Location: The Jungle(neezeelund) Member Is Offline Mood: Financial lol guys, looks like we might be seeing the beginning of a red invasion! Prepare yourselves for the illiterate commies... I don't see how what you and yourself bragging about x amount of azide for$7. Why would you bother with two accounts?

Anyway, I'll keep looking into that hydrazine synthesis, but I think in the long run(for anybody who isn't sitting on a decent income and lots of labware) it might just be better to purchase airbags and disect those. I mean, when you think about it, it's probably about the same amount of risk either way...
zha ke xue
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First,I want to say ,although we are from PRC ,but we are not commie .

Then, Hua Xue DIY and zha ke xue is not one .We are against to the govement of PRC.

Sobrero
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Uchiacon, have a look at the first page of this thread. Rosco Bodine gives a detailed method for sodium azide starting from sodium hydroxide, hydrazine sulphate, isopropyl nitrite and methanol. The hydrazine (hydrate) is generated in situ. No need at all for fancy labware!

"There exists a world. In terms of probability, this borders on the impossible." (Jostein Gaarder)
quicksilver
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 Quote: Originally posted by zha ke xue First,I want to say ,although we are from PRC ,but we are not commie . Then, Hua Xue DIY and zha ke xue is not one .We are against to the govement of PRC.

You are most welcome just as any other contributor here. I am sure that the Moderators feel that as do the overwhelming majority of principled individuals here.

______________________________________
The price of chemicals in the PRC and MANY places unfortunately reflects cost savings at the expense of the citizen's land & environment. But generally many companies in the EU and USA inflate prices beyond all reason - simply greed.
aonomus
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Just as a bit of extreme off topic, I read about diazidomethane forming from residual DCM in a reaction mixture not being completely removed, and the subsequent step using NaN3, which reacted with the DCM to form diazidomethane. It totaled a large rotovap and hurt a few people, but no one died.

Now in terms of use for an actual practical explosive, I doubt. Its sensitive to the point where removing the collecting flask from the rotovap which concentrated the diazidomethane and setting it down was enough.
grndpndr
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Quote: Originally posted by quicksilver
 Quote: Originally posted by zha ke xue First,I want to say ,although we are from PRC ,but we are not commie . Then, Hua Xue DIY and zha ke xue is not one .We are against to the govement of PRC.

You are most welcome just as any other contributor here. I am sure that the Moderators feel that as do the overwhelming majority of principled individuals here.

______________________________________
The price of chemicals in the PRC and MANY places unfortunately reflects cost savings at the expense of the citizen's land & environment. But generally many companies in the EU and USA inflate prices beyond all reason - simply greed.

I couldnt agree more.The only thing that has me curious is given the censorship of the net Thanks to PRC government
policy how do you manage?My hats off to you and the bravery it takes to chance communication with the west,and particularly this site with its controversial subject matter as some of the ignorant would assume.
sonogashira
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^Bravery?! It is China not North Korea!

[Edited on 19-12-2009 by sonogashira]
grndpndr
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China,the humanitarian state!?

Ah yes,my mistake! China is the very humanitarian state that censors all aspects of life and responsible for tienamen Square ANd roving execution vans that harvests innmates organs upon execution according to need for foriegn transplants.Yes that paragon of human rights state known as China ,Those brave souls. Unles your a resident of NK I would cease and desist Sonongashira.. Hmm sonagashira,sounds japanese, the superior race of the asian east if not the world.I wondered where the superior attitude came from.

[Edited on 16-1-2010 by grndpndr]
sonogashira
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Sir, I can only assume that you are drunk judging by this and the very rude U2U you sent me.

I'm sure it is accepted where you live to hold such narrow-minded opinions, but fortunately the rest of the world is not so impoverished in their outlook. It is up to you if you are willing to believe such bullshit propaganda, but please do not state it as fact. The thousands of Chinese students in your country demonstrates the stupidity of your claims.

You are wrong in your assumptions - but I need not wonder where your superior (and ignorant) attitude comes from! God bless you, God Bless America, God Bless the War on Terror

I sincerely hope that you are met with greater success in your future quest for knowledge.
 Quote: Originally posted by grndpndr Ah yes,my mistake! China is the very humanitarian state that censors all aspects of life and responsible for tienamen Square ANd roving execution vans that harvests innmates organs upon execution according to need for foriegn transplants.Yes that paragon of human rights state known as China ,Those brave souls. Unles your a resident of NK I would cease and desist Sonongashira.. Hmm sonagashira,sounds japanese, the superior race of the asian east if not the world.I wondered where the superior attitude came from. [Edited on 16-1-2010 by grndpndr]
hua xue DIY
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Chemistry is regardless of national boundaries。I hope that we will not mind if we are Chinese。As we all love chemistry。

[Edited on 23-2-2010 by hua xue DIY]

power
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Hello.

I need sodium azide, i like the urea and nickel powder mixture process , any body have the exact formula for mixing.
roXefeller
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Sodium azide is extremely toxic. Providing an exact preparation, as asked, when you could find it yourself, is pretty reckless. I get a little spasm in the posterior just thinking of opening a bottle of sodium azide. Needless to say I get cautious when I do.
hissingnoise
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Sodazide is available on ebay from a UK-based seller!
A very hazardous compound, as roXe said, it should not be trifled with . . .

woelen

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 Quote: Originally posted by roXefeller Sodium azide is extremely toxic. Providing an exact preparation, as asked, when you could find it yourself, is pretty reckless. I get a little spasm in the posterior just thinking of opening a bottle of sodium azide. [...]rquote]Yes, sodium azide is quite toxic, but if you fear opening a bottle of it, then I think it is a good moment to reconsider having chemistry as a hobby. Chemicals need to be treated with respect, but fear is a very bad guide. Sodium azide actually is quite easy on storage. It is not strongly hygroscopic and it does not give off vapors of HN3 when kept dry. I have a sample, which (I discovered later) was kept in a badly sealed bottle, but even after a few years of storage, the NaN3 still is perfectly fine. Many other chemicals would have been totally spoilt after even just a few months of storage in that same badly sealed bottle.

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 Sciencemadness Discussion Board » Special topics » Energetic Materials » Sodium Azide Select A Forum Fundamentals   » Chemistry in General   » Organic Chemistry   » Reagents and Apparatus Acquisition   » Beginnings   » Responsible Practices   » Miscellaneous   » The Wiki Special topics   » Technochemistry   » Energetic Materials   » Biochemistry   » Radiochemistry   » Computational Models and Techniques   » Prepublication Non-chemistry   » Forum Matters   » Legal and Societal Issues   » Test Forum