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Author: Subject: removing detectable traces of explosives from glassware
cloven666
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 12:18
removing detectable traces of explosives from glassware


sorry I'm totally new this is my first post, but a friend of a friend has an issue with possible detection and needs to figure out how to completely destroy traces of PETN and nitroglycerin from glassware
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aga
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 12:22


SWIM should not have made stuff that they subsequently used to harm people, intentionally or otherwise.

Consequences follow, sometimes swiftly.

Complete loss of glassware is the smallest damage SWIM will experience.




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Loptr
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 13:56


I think you are in more trouble if caught with explosives, than caught with traces of explosives.

Depending on what you have done, the glassware might not be your biggest liability.
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Zombie
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 15:20


My neighbors have a pool. I throw everything incriminating in that pool.

In the morning they remove it, and put in in their trash. I don't see any problem with this method.

Seriously I am kidding. You have to think one million steps ahead. You have to win the game before you sit at the table, otherwise you are gambling.

Toss a coin bro. One flip will determine your fate, and you can't get any better odds anywhere.
What's done is done.

[Edited on 6-19-2015 by Zombie]

Caught-On-Alligator-in-pool-attacks-swimmer-Blogertize.jpg - 52kB




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BromicAcid
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 15:59


Strong oxidizing reagents like Fenton's Reagent or Caro's Acid should do the trick with soaking. Otherwise baking in an annealing oven at several hundred Centigrade should do the trick as well. Issue is that making these explosives or anything for that matter spreads micro-fine droplets as well as residues over everything. When I used to travel in the hazardous waste industry I had to bring a gear bag full of tags, respirators, cartridges, etc with me on each trip. I would put it in my checked baggage. More than once a quick swab test for oxidizers or explosives would turn something up and I would be called in to explain myself. It doesn't take much and if someone really has it out for your samples could be sent out for trace analysis going down to the PPB level. It really depends on how deeply you are investigated but the glassware is likely the easiest thing to clean.



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Hawkguy
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 16:16


Quote: Originally posted by aga  
SWIM should not have made stuff that they subsequently used to harm people, intentionally or otherwise.

Consequences follow, sometimes swiftly.

Complete loss of glassware is the smallest damage SWIM will experience.
Who is 'SWIM'?
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Zombie
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 16:24


Someone Who Isn't Me. There's a pun in there I'm sure.



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BromicAcid
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[*] posted on 19-6-2015 at 18:21


Also note that if said explosives were tested nearby they do leave signature residue although I do not know the lifetime for such residue testing.



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MeshPL
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[*] posted on 20-6-2015 at 04:39


The worst :P advice is: make a fake video of Lentonitrat and nitroglycerine patch analysis. Lentonitrat is nearly pure PETN. Theese drugs are used to treat heart diseases and act as a source of NO. Then (s)he would at least have some evidence, that (s)he wasn't even syntesizing them.

I would think twice before attempting it though.

[Edited on 20-6-2015 by MeshPL]
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kecskesajt
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[*] posted on 20-6-2015 at 06:21


A very stong alkaline solution like KOH destroys EGDN.Im think it destroys other nitrates.
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Hennig Brand
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[*] posted on 20-6-2015 at 07:17


Whenever I need to clean a beaker for another use that had nitroglycerin in it I just give it a good rinse or two with acetone. It does a great job, since NG is miscible with acetone in all proportions IIRC. PETN is also quite soluble in acetone, especially warm acetone. Removing every detectible trace might be difficult though. Once you had the glass wear well washed with acetone simply putting it in the oven at 200C or more should remove and/or destroy any pesky NG or PETN traces. I wouldn't try the oven routine until the glass wear was well washed with acetone and looked spotless already.

PETN decomposes increasingly faster above 150C, boils at ca. 200C
NG starts to decompose at 50-60C, is quite volatile (high vapor pressure) by 100C




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Microtek
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[*] posted on 20-6-2015 at 13:46


If it's just the glassware, there really isn't much of a problem: Just remove said glassware from your possession. A bigger issue may be traces in your lab (or on yourself).
Obviously, modern methods are so sensitive they can pick up even the most minute level of energetics in a sample, but that is also a weakness. For instance, if you have any kind of legit contact with a laboratory setting, there are many ways that traces of energetics could have gotten on your clothes. Cleaning out glassware, which previously housed polyols, with nitric acid is one possibility.
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cloven666
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[*] posted on 22-6-2015 at 14:01


I like the pool idea. Lol. They did not blow anything up, just explored the chemistry. Now the glassware is liability from a possible crazy girlfriend.
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Zombie
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[*] posted on 22-6-2015 at 14:17


Works like a champ!:D



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szuko03
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[*] posted on 23-6-2015 at 03:57


I mean no offence by this but if you need to worry about "crazy girlfriends" causing issues then you are either too immature for this or you need to wait a bigger amount of time before informing the general population of what your doing. I say this only because my girlfriend even at her most crazy has way too much respect for what I do on a level higher then myself so regardless of where we go as a couple she would never touch my lab. She wouldn't for fear of not understanding the very real outcomes that could happen, plus she would never put my life in danger legal or otherwise

All I am saying is people should have a desire to avoid what you do because they should know they don't understand it and that means they can cause an accident by doing so.




Chemistry is a natural drive, not an interest.
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[*] posted on 23-6-2015 at 07:48


We live in nervous times. In my youth, when dinosaurs walked and Linus Pauling had ONE nobel prize, home chemistry was common. We were expected to blow stuff up. Everybody understood that nothing bad was happening. Now we live in a world populated by idiots willing to blow people to shreds because God has told them to. (He never said anything like that to me.) In days like these, there will be times when you want to do something, but ought not to because someone with the ability to do something about it will not understand.

Remember what happens to the tall poppy.
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cloven666
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[*] posted on 26-6-2015 at 19:42


Your right, and I like sig. "chemistry is a natural drive, not an interest". I'll be sure to tell them all the coulda, woulda, shoulda and pass on the info they requested. there are dangers in all aspects of life. Even leaving the house leads to death and trouble for some wile staying in is the undoing of others. I'm not going to go into why they had the interest to add to their knowledge of chemistry in such a way, but they do not appear to be alone. We all play with fire in some way and most of us know we will get burned. Plan for the worst and hope for the best.
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SimpleChemist-238
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[*] posted on 7-7-2015 at 11:26


Who do you think is going to look at your glass ware and are you doing this in a concordance with local law?



We are chemists , we bring light to the darkness. Knowledge to ignorant, excitement to the depressed and unknowing. we bring crops to broken fields and water to the desert. Where there is fear we bring curiosity.

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[*] posted on 14-7-2015 at 09:34


SWIM is total trouble. Or a fisherman. My spidey sense says DANGER...

:o

Either a jihadist or a fed. Either way, poison. Moderators should turn this one in.
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