Sciencemadness Discussion Board

potassium tetrachloroplatinate solution

fausap - 13-4-2020 at 09:09

Hello all,

Thanks a lot for allowing join me this board.
I'm an amateur analogue photographer, and I love chemistry, so I prefer mixing all my photo chemicals by myself.

I started to do some platinum printing and I'm trying to find a way of making a potassium tetrachloroplatinate solution (in water) using chloroplatinic acid and potassium hydroxide.
Because there are two salts obtained from chloroplatinic acid, tetra- and hexa-, I am quite confused about which one I got from this reaction.
I have some rudimentary knowledge about acid-base reactions, but this maybe is to complex for my experience :)

Looking around some web sites, I found another way to make potassium tetrachloroplatinate: reducing potassium hexachloroplatinate with hydrazine, but this is beyond my comprehension. :)

Could you help me?

Thanks a lot,
Fausto

Bedlasky - 13-4-2020 at 10:08

Hi.

Welcome on SM forum :).
Quote: Originally posted by fausap  
Hello all,
Because there are two salts obtained from chloroplatinic acid, tetra- and hexa-, I am quite confused about which one I got from this reaction.


Chloroplatinic acid = hexachloroplatinic acid. So you'll get hexachloroplatinate.

For what purpose you need potassium hexachloroplatinate? This salt is insolube in water - so if you want to do aqueous Pt chemistry, just use chloroplatinic acid.

fausap - 13-4-2020 at 11:03

Hello,

thanks for the clarification.
I don't want the hexa-, because, as you said, it's insoluble in water. I need the tetra.
Here in Poland, it's quite hard to find the tetra salt, but I can get the hexa and the chloroplatinic acid.

So, as you said, I'm out of luck about the potassium hydroxide and chloroplatinic acid reaction.

Do you know, instead, about this reaction with hydrazine?

thanks,
Fausto

Bedlasky - 13-4-2020 at 11:10

I found this:

http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/local/projects/s_liu/Html/Synthesis.h...

fausap - 13-4-2020 at 12:14

Quote: Originally posted by Bedlasky  
I found this:

http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/local/projects/s_liu/Html/Synthesis.h...


Thanks a lot! This is quite interesting.
I have a couple of questions:

1) handling hydrazine hydrochloride will require some special equipment?
2) if I stop at step two because I do not need crystals, can I filter the remaining insoluble hexa, to get a solution of potassium tetrachloroplatinate?

thanks a lot,
Fausto

S.C. Wack - 13-4-2020 at 13:09

Reduction by potassium bisulfite or hypophosphite:
http://www.ajsonline.org/content/s3-48/287/397.full.pdf+html
https://books.google.com/books?id=6fDRAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA397

fausap - 14-4-2020 at 01:59

Quote: Originally posted by S.C. Wack  
Reduction by potassium bisulfite or hypophosphite:
http://www.ajsonline.org/content/s3-48/287/397.full.pdf+html
https://books.google.com/books?id=6fDRAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA397


Thanks a lot! I bought the article right now and it's very interesting.
The reduction with potassium acid sulfite (I suppose this is the other name of potassium bisulfite) seems to me quite interesting and the easiest.

mackolol - 14-4-2020 at 03:06

You can buy tetrachloroplatinate in Poland. It's quite costy but available.

here's the link: https://pol-aura.pl/tetrachloroplatynian-potasu-ii-46-47-pt-...

fausap - 14-4-2020 at 05:25

Yes... but those prices are too much over the standard price for that product.

Maybe because of the purity. In the US I can find the potassium tetrachloroplatinate at $40 per gram, for example. And the shipping cost is $25

Here in Poland I can find the hexa at a reasonable price: 170zl per gram.

Bedlasky - 14-4-2020 at 06:00

What will you do with potassium tetrachloroplatinate, may I ask? :) I never did Pt chemistry, so I am interested.

[Edited on 14-4-2020 by Bedlasky]

fausap - 14-4-2020 at 08:44

Sure :)

It's the metallic salt needed for platinum printing. You can use also palladium, but now it's more expensive than platinum, so it's not a good idea :)

It reacts (under UV light) with ferric oxalate.
Then the exposed coated paper is developed with potassium oxalate, for example, or ammonium citrate (dibasic).

Bedlasky - 14-4-2020 at 13:49

It's really interesting! I never heard about platinum printing.

I did some ferric carboxylate photochemistry (https://colourchem.wordpress.com/2019/06/25/photochemical-ox...). I tried also few very simple blueprints.

S.C. Wack - 14-4-2020 at 15:09

The last few entries in vol. 2 of Inorg Syn are Pt cpds., including this one using H2SO3.
https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.11546

mackolol - 15-4-2020 at 05:44

Quote: Originally posted by fausap  


Here in Poland I can find the hexa at a reasonable price: 170zl per gram.


May I know in which company?

fausap - 16-4-2020 at 12:34

Sure.

Keten.com.pl
but now he is posting the Amidol on Allegro too.

fausap - 16-4-2020 at 12:39

Quote: Originally posted by S.C. Wack  
The last few entries in vol. 2 of Inorg Syn are Pt cpds., including this one using H2SO3.
https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.11546


this is very interesting! :)

I would like to try this!

fausap - 16-4-2020 at 12:48

Quote: Originally posted by Bedlasky  
It's really interesting! I never heard about platinum printing.

I did some ferric carboxylate photochemistry (https://colourchem.wordpress.com/2019/06/25/photochemical-ox...). I tried also few very simple blueprints.


this is very interesting. Did you try some prints with these sensitizers?

mackolol - 17-4-2020 at 04:23

Quote: Originally posted by fausap  
Sure.

Keten.com.pl
but now he is posting the Amidol on Allegro too.


Oh, thanks very much. There are quite a few good chemical companies in Poland, and each of them has something different to offer. I forgot about this one, but it seems very interesting.

[Edited on 17-4-2020 by mackolol]

Bedlasky - 17-4-2020 at 06:25

Quote: Originally posted by fausap  
Quote: Originally posted by Bedlasky  
It's really interesting! I never heard about platinum printing.

I did some ferric carboxylate photochemistry (https://colourchem.wordpress.com/2019/06/25/photochemical-ox...). I tried also few very simple blueprints.


this is very interesting. Did you try some prints with these sensitizers?


No, I never tried prints with this. Only simple shapes, just for fun. But NileRed have some videos about blueprints.