LL8 from Dr. Liptakov

To diversify the thread, I attach the crystallization process of Cu(ClO4)2 x 6H2O. Procedure: 20g HClO4 68% + 60g dH2O + 20g CuCO3. The solution is boiled at about 100 Celsius for about an hour. An acidic solution is formed, filtered from exces CuCO3. After filtering slowly evaporation at 60 Celsius. After concentration, the crystals are filtered. Proceeds will be announced later.

This is a way of making Cu(ClO4)2.
This procedure yields a theoretical 11.6g CuII(ClO4)2 starting from 10g NH4ClO4. Not sure how pure your copper perchlorate needs to be, but this is pretty pure and easy. I hope it helps.

CuSO4*5H2O + 2NH4(ClO4) + XH2O=> (NH4)2SO4 + Cu(ClO4)2*xH2O

10.62 g CuSO4*5H2O
10.00 g NH4CLO4
50.00 ml dH2O
>100 ml Acetone

Heat dH2O up to boiling
Dissolve all CuSO4
Dissolve in all NH4ClO4
remove heat once all dissolved
Add at least =/> 100 ml Acetone and stir well. if you are above acetone bp, solution will boil when acetone is added and large clumps of sulfate will be produced instantly.
(NH4)2SO4 precipitates as a white sandy insoluble, it has a layer of copper II ions making it light blue on surface.
Filter off (NH4)2SO4 with copper contamination
Rinse with acetone
light blue filtrate collected contains CuII perchlorate, and should contain no solids at all.
Boil down this acetone/perchlorate solution to evaporate or just leave alone and allow evaporation.
When a white solid begins to appear around meniscus during boiling, remove from boiling and allow to cool.
Blue Cu II Perchlorate crystals will form on cooling.

This procedure can be doubled to 20 g NH4ClO4 & 21.24 g CuSO4*5H2O with only 50 ml of H2O (100ml H2O doubling is not necessary, less water helps to precipitate out the sulfate on addition of acetone).






[Edited on 12-12-2022 by Hey Buddy]

Very easy and interesting , thank Buddy....

Here are the first results.
Unfortunately, Cu(ClO4) 2 prepared from CuSO4 (and after adding 20% hexamine = called Cu8) shows poor detonation properties. Cu(ClO4)2 x6H2O should have a melting point of 82 C. This one clearly does not. It does not melt, but strangely enough it burns by itself, without the content of fuel, i.e. hexamine. The perchlorate prepared in this way contains many impurities, most likely from acetone. Therefore, it is flammable in itself. The preparation process will require optimization including recrystallization. However, this is a method that could lead to a simple preparation of neutral Cu(ClO4)2 in the future. Which has not yet been described anywhere. Which is a great benefit. Because HClO4 + CuCO3 produces an acidic version of crystals that cannot be neutralized with NaOH, KOH, LiOH, NH4OH. Due to impurities, this method of preparing copper perchlorate and hexamine (Cu8) achieves poor results. Which is evident from the pictures. This Cu8 substance has DDT properties. Which is good news. But it can't fire ETN. Only causes partial detonation. Small remnants of unexploded ETN were observed in the crater. The figure contains reference values for 0.3 g ETN full detonation and for 0.3 g Lithex full detonation. In the sense of a highly pressed output segment. Full power Cu8 is in this thread above. And should by basically same as Lithex. (page 2, shooting into alu brick)



[Edited on 12-12-2022 by Laboratory of Liptakov]

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Here are the first results. Unfortunately, Cu(ClO4) 2 prepared from CuSO4 (and after adding 20% hexamine = called Cu8) shows poor detonation properties. Cu(ClO4)2 x6H2O should have a melting point of 82 C. This one clearly does not. It does not melt, but strangely enough it burns by itself, without the content of fuel, i.e. hexamine. The perchlorate prepared in this way contains many impurities, most likely from acetone. Therefore, it is flammable in itself. [Edited on 12-12-2022 by Laboratory of Liptakov]

During further tests, Lithex is shown to detonate consistently and reliably. The dosage was only 900 mg. Therefore, the crater is not as deep as from 1g ETN. Also, the density of Lithex was slightly lower, only 1.7 g/cc. A 3% addition of aluminum Alu - bright was used. However, the diameter of the crater is the same. This means that Lithex can fully replace ETN in many applications. His DDT is reliable and his brizance is very similar.

If is Ca(ClO4)2 easy available, is it maybe best way for preparation Cu(ClO4)2. Good idea, thanks.


Interesting fact: Lithium perchlorate with hexamine (Lithex) has a special property after drying at 175 Celsius. Its structure and behavior is very similar to talc. A very fine powder is always formed which is partly slippery. Like crushed the talc.

[Edited on 27-1-2023 by Laboratory of Liptakov]

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

As already indicated, at least 2 crystalline barriers must be overcome when drying LiP. At 80 and 120 C. The melting point of completely dry LiP is 236 C. Boiling point - decomposition 400 C. For this reason, there is no need to worry about decomposition during drying to the anhydride. Caution, do not use Teflon for drying. LiP immediately reacts with Teflon at 80 ° C and begins to blacken. Even the stainless steel surface is not perfect. When LiP is melted, there is a slight browning of pure factory LiP. The same effect is observed when the Li8 mixture is dried. After drying, the mixture is slightly gray. However, its energy properties will not affect it for the worse. [Edited on 24-1-2022 by Laboratory of Liptakov]

Quote: Originally posted by underground

Are not all perchlorate salts need a metal cavity to go DDT, just like ETN ? Are any of these capable to DDT into a plastic straw like other primaries, for example HMTD ?

The easiest of the way of acids is ETN and SA-DS in plast confinement. The easiest of perchlorate way, is the Lithex and metal confinement...

Quote: Originally posted by Microtek

I question the statement that ETN is not sensitive.

Due to next research was developed an interest substance. ( working title Brightelite) Which is not full power material for use as initiation for secondary material. But his properties are interest. S a base of mixture is formula: AP 80 + CuO 4 hexamine 8 in part by weight. (No. 4). This substance is of course weak, with very positive oxygen ballance, but any way, brisantion is there. Lab. preparation is 20g dH2O on stainless surface, + 4g AP + 0.2g CuO + 0.4g hexamine. Boiling solution, evaporate and gringing on very fine powder. Operation without accident at 80 C on surface friction. Second step is adding nitrocellulose commerce grade 12.4 N 0.35g + Aluminium bright powder 0.35g. + 2g Acetone for dilluting of NC. This mixture has OB + 2.0 on CO2. Mixing on porridge at 20C, evaporate and grain 1x1 mm. And is more power. (No. 1 +2) . There is enough power for full initiation of ETN now. (No.3). For last test (No.5) was used nitrocellulose with over 13% N. Resluts show clear bigger brisantion. Mixture (grain) is pH neutral, no-hygroscopic with good manipulation properties. For all test was used output segment 300 mg, ETN density 1.65. Brightelite density 1.5 g /cm3. As itself is weak, but can provide easy way for (maybe even reliable) of initiation ETN in solid metal cavity. Friction and impact test show on almost same properties as CHP. Also his burning speed is similar with similar color of flame.

Well, THAT is quite snappy for a mixture of common pyrotechnic materials. Have you tried zapping it with a piezoelectric spark yet?

Could you describe containment, ignition used? What does it do if ignited in the open...

I would expect substitution of a commercial high nitroglycerin smokeless propellant such as "Bullseye" for the higher nitration nitrocellulose of test 5 might yield similar or even greater brissance.
L



[Edited on 2-12-2023 by Bert]

Quote: Originally posted by Herr Haber

Reading your recent research I'm so glad I didn try those pyrotechnic compositions I was thinking about a few years ago... I was going for ammonium perchlorate, hexamine and CuOCl the first two being quite "neutral" in terms of color production.

So Bert's assumption was correct. Composition: 80 AP + Hex 8 + CuO 4 + Al 7 + Shotgun powder 8 parts..(No. 6) ..show basically same brizantion as composition with homemade nitrocellulose 7 parts of weight. (No.5) Diameter is only slightly less. Precision repeatedly measurement are No.5 2.7 + 12.5 mm. And for shotgun powder 2.7 x 12.2 mm. Exact results of course require minimal 3+3 tests for both formula, but for orientation results is it enough. Both formulas has sufficient brizantion for initiation ETN. next:
¨
Test on confinement in alu foil 5 layer , candle heated causes only puffy and rocket effect.
Test on electric spark was without ignition of Brightelite. (directly pour 0.1g into the lighter hole, 10x sparks)
Burning Brightelite with shotgun powder has slightly slower burning on free heap. Than with homemade NC.



Now I remembered: the homemade nitrocellulose used was prepared by double nitration. Commercial fibrous NC was re-nitrated. The PLM method was used for its cleaning and stabilization....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVZkPWxj5WE
Thus 4 years old, but good stabilized NC with nitrogen content maybe over 13.5 %.

[Edited on 13-2-2023 by Laboratory of Liptakov]

During the experiments, it became clear that CuO can be replaced by CuCl2. In water heating process, this creates Cu(ClO4)2 + NH4Cl. Given presence of hexamine in solution, perhaps something else as well. Which, according to the result, contributes to brizantion. Other values are the same as in the experiments described above. So density of output segment is 1.5g/cc per 300mg. The crater depth of 3.1 mm is largest of all investigated variants. Which is interesting result.

Brightelite

Since Brightelite is non-wetting and essentially just an ordinary pyrotechnic compound, it was re-examined. This time to transfer detonation from basic detonator to booster. Test was successful. Output segment of basic detonator (300mg cavity 6) had same density as booster, i.e. 1.5g/cm3 (1g cavity 8). VoD at booster output is estimated at 3 - 3.5 km/s. Which is quite a bit for a booster. But, for example, for secondary mixtures based on TACN, this brisance and power of initiation is sufficient. From which it follows that some more sensitive secondary EMs can be initiated only with this common pyrotechnic composition. Brightelite thus provides advantage that its brisance may be sufficient for some secondary materials itself.

Quote: Originally posted by yobbo II

What perchlorate do you get when you add copper sulphate to barium perchlorate (in solution) and get a ppt of insoluble barium sulphate with copper perchlorate in solution. Is it I or II, CuCl04 or Cu(ClO4)2 Barium Perchlorate is Ba(ClO4)2 Yob

Verification experiments were carried out on stability of newly developed substances. Brightelite appears to be stable after one month of manufacture and cavity filling. And it can initiate ETNs. Lithex is also stable after 2 months from production and filling. Lithex requires a hermetic seal against moisture after filling. For example, insulation from polyisobutylene rubber (PIB), as in this case.

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Since Brightelite is non-wetting and essentially just an ordinary pyrotechnic compound, it was re-examined. This time to transfer detonation from basic detonator to booster. Test was successful. Output segment of basic detonator (300mg cavity 6) had same density as booster, i.e. 1.5g/cm3 (1g cavity 8). VoD at booster output is estimated at 3 - 3.5 km/s. Which is quite a bit for a booster. But, for example, for secondary mixtures based on TACN, this brisance and power of initiation is sufficient. From which it follows that some more sensitive secondary EMs can be initiated only with this common pyrotechnic composition. Brightelite thus provides advantage that its brisance may be sufficient for some secondary materials itself.

posted on 11-2-2023 at 21:30


[Edited on 12-4-2023 by Laboratory of Liptakov]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 7-1-2024 at 07:43


Brightelite Blue

An interesting discovery was made during the research of mixtures of NH4ClO4 (AP) + hexamine. If we heat AP (aqueous solution) in a copper pan, no copper salt is formed. If we heat hexamine (aqueous solution) in a copper pan, no copper salt is formed. If we heat a mixture of AP + hexamine (aqueous solution) in a copper pan, a copper salt is formed almost immediately. By experimenting with ratios from 50:50 to 80:8, it was found that AP only serves as a catalyst. Only the chemical composition of hexamine changes from HMTA to CuHMTA. This has the advantage that Brightelite does not require mixing with powdered CuO, which is known to promote AP decomposition. Copper is incorporated into the HMTA at the molecular level. Which supports Brightelite's brisance more than the mere presence of fine powdered CuO.

1) the beginning of the reaction, 2) the course of the reaction 3) the end of the reaction within 10 minutes. Used 300 Celsius air heating with a heat gun. 4) dried AP+ CuHMTA mixture. 5) dried mixture AP+ CuHMTA + Alu powder + NC 13%N. Grain 1x1mm. 6) demonstration of ignition of this mixture. 7) Test in steel cavity 8/6mm, output segment 300mg ETN/1.6g/cc. The rest of the cavity filled with Brightelite Blue1.4g/cc. 8) The crater corresponds to a full detonation of ETN 300mg /1.6g/cc.
9) Output segment 300mg Brightelite Blue compressed to 1.55g/cc. The rest of the cavity is filled with a density of 1.3g/cc provide crater 13x3mm. Against Brightelite with CuO which provide crater 12.2x3 mm.
Brightelite Blue is no hygroscopic and pH neutral, which is important for present of nitrocellulose at longer storage. Is it basically ordinary pyrotechical mixture for use as partially blue color flame. Brightelite Blue is not strong enough to initiate secondary EMs, but is strong enough to initiate ETNs in a solid cavity. The preparation of this substance is almost alchemical. Which adds to the appeal for the scientific madness within the mixing.

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MineMan - 7-1-2024 at 11:52

Cool! AP and hexamine form a eutetic when heated as I have mentioned here. With aluminum added it can ddt or act like a primary. But it is sensitive. Makes sense it picked up the copper. I was able to achieve milligram detonations unconfined. It’s very practical. Feel like I am giving away my secrets here. But at least it has my name attached to them.

The addition of water is interesting and copper as a catalyst!

AP, hexamine eutetic is like a putty. Should form very high ISP rocket. But could ddt, no core could be used which is also a plus


All being LL if you continue on this path you will find what you want. A mixture that is a NPED.


[Edited on 7-1-2024 by MineMan]

[Edited on 7-1-2024 by MineMan]

[Edited on 7-1-2024 by MineMan]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 7-1-2024 at 12:27

Thanks, MineMan.....
I also keep an eye on research in the field of Nickel Aminoguanidine Perchlorate. (NAP) I'm too lazy to make aminoguanidine yet. But if I ever make AG, crazy things will happen...

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ManyInterests - 7-1-2024 at 15:20

Just to let you know I found out that lithium perchlorate is legal where I live and I found a seller. I am ordering 20g of the stuff. Making lithex will be a real possibility!

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MineMan - 11-1-2024 at 04:12

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Thanks, MineMan..... I also keep an eye on research in the field of Nickel Aminoguanidine Perchlorate. (NAP) I'm too lazy to make aminoguanidine yet. But if I ever make AG, crazy things will happen...[/ Yah. Hopefully you just buy it so we can see you make new inventions. Why make when you can buy easily.

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EF2000 - 11-1-2024 at 08:34

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Brightelite Blue If we heat a mixture of AP + hexamine (aqueous solution) in a copper pan, a copper salt is formed almost immediately. By experimenting with ratios from 50:50 to 80:8, it was found that AP only serves as a catalyst. Only the chemical composition of hexamine changes from HMTA to CuHMTA. This has the advantage that Brightelite does not require mixing with powdered CuO, which is known to promote AP decomposition. Copper is incorporated into the HMTA at the molecular level. Which supports Brightelite's brisance more than the mere presence of fine powdered CuO.

When you do it next time, can you weigh the copper pan before and after the reaction? It would be interesting to see how much of copper goes into mixture.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 11-1-2024 at 13:20

On a laboratory scale for 2 g of the mixture, it will be only hundredths of a gram of Cu. A exact weighing would be quite difficult....

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 16-1-2024 at 09:12

Another breakthrough occurred during the research aimed at initiating ETN as easy as possible. For full initiation of ETN in a solid cavity, it is possible to use a mixture consisting only of NH4ClO4 and nitrocellulose with a nitrogen content of more than 13%. The tested ratio was AP 80% + NC 20%. Working name Nitrocelite.
0.8 g of AP is crushing in a stainless steel bowl together with 0,2g NC under of acetone level to a homogeneous mass. During mixing, acetone gradually evaporates at a working temperature of 25 - 30 C. A paste is formed, which can be divided into smaller pieces when wet. These smaller pieces can then be pushed through a 1x1 mm sieve. It's a bit difficult. Because at 20% NC content, the mixture is difficult to divide into 1x1 mm agglomerates. It was observed that AP tends to separate from NC during the process. But without negative effect on functionality. Oxygen balance on CO2 is +18,4. Which is against all rules of pyrotechnics compositions. Despite this, it works. Burning rate on air is relatively low, similarly as meal BP. Sensitivity on anvil is medium, similarly as safety matches. Output segment ETN 300 mg was pressed on high density cca 30Kg. Follow segment is 10 mg ETN + 10mg of Nitrocelite pressed handly on 1Kg. Followed insert bridge wire. Followed segment is pure Nitrocelit pressed on handly power 1 - 5 Kg. Others parameters are same as here above. Thus steel cavity 6/8 mm. This assseble provide standard crater 15 - 16 mm, deep 5 - 6 mm. Which is consistent with full detonation of ETN from other primarily - secondary materials. The mixture is pH neutral and not hygroscopic. From the above, it is possible to classify Nitrocelite as a material with NPED performance properties. Optionally, the addition of powdered aluminum + 5% is possible. (or elses catalyzeurs, fuels)
The only disadvantage of Nitrocelite is need to prepare high-quality, well-nitrated nitrocellulose. But for one NPED is nesessary only 200mg of NC 13%N+......

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pjig - 17-1-2024 at 08:34

Just a thought , but couldn’t nitromethane be used as the solvent and help increase the vod of the material?

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 17-1-2024 at 14:04

Quote: Originally posted by pjig

Just a thought , but couldn’t nitromethane be used as the solvent and help increase the vod of the material?

Is it possible but it require exact testing. It was not tryied.

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pjig - 17-1-2024 at 19:21

It is an amazing solvent for nc or smokeless powders. In this form It has served as nice vod increase for AN mix’s with a little Al to increase sensitivity.
But in your case I believe it could benefit the mix even in a small amounts . Just my 2cents

[Edited on 18-1-2024 by pjig]

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MineMan - 19-1-2024 at 01:50

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Another breakthrough occurred during the research aimed at initiating ETN as easy as possible. For full initiation of ETN in a solid cavity, it is possible to use a mixture consisting only of NH4ClO4 and nitrocellulose with a nitrogen content of more than 13%. The tested ratio was AP 80% + NC 20%. Working name Nitrocelite. 0.8 g of AP is crushing in a stainless steel bowl together with 0,2g NC under of acetone level to a homogeneous mass. During mixing, acetone gradually evaporates at a working temperature of 25 - 30 C. A paste is formed, which can be divided into smaller pieces when wet. These smaller pieces can then be pushed through a 1x1 mm sieve. It's a bit difficult. Because at 20% NC content, the mixture is difficult to divide into 1x1 mm agglomerates. It was observed that AP tends to separate from NC during the process. But without negative effect on functionality. Oxygen balance on CO2 is +18,4. Which is against all rules of pyrotechnics compositions. Despite this, it works. Burning rate on air is relatively low, similarly as meal BP. Sensitivity on anvil is medium, similarly as safety matches. Output segment ETN 300 mg was pressed on high density cca 30Kg. Follow segment is 10 mg ETN + 10mg of Nitrocelite pressed handly on 1Kg. Followed insert bridge wire. Followed segment is pure Nitrocelit pressed on handly power 1 - 5 Kg. Others parameters are same as here above. Thus steel cavity 6/8 mm. This assseble provide standard crater 15 - 16 mm, deep 5 - 6 mm. Which is consistent with full detonation of ETN from other primarily - secondary materials. The mixture is pH neutral and not hygroscopic. From the above, it is possible to classify Nitrocelite as a material with NPED performance properties. Optionally, the addition of powdered aluminum + 5% is possible. (or elses catalyzeurs, fuels) The only disadvantage of Nitrocelite is need to prepare high-quality, well-nitrated nitrocellulose. But for one NPED is nesessary only 200mg of NC 13%N+......

NC has always been underrated as a safe primary. I emailed Axt about this 15 years ago with no response. Great idea. And like Albert said simplest solution is the best. This is huge, simple, and obvious yet overlooked. Once again, amazing work!!!

NEPDs work best when Oxygen balance is positive, it goes against the rules but my experiments show this is true.

[Edited on 19-1-2024 by MineMan]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 19-1-2024 at 05:12

Thanks,.....MineMan....
This opens up a wide field of research into different mixtures regardless of the oxygen balance in the future. The oxygen balance can be, for example, + 20. For years I stuck to calculations close to zero. But in the construction of NPED, this rule does not apply. I estimate that this finding (confirmed by your and my experiments) is key information for anyone dealing with initiation compositions.

Clarifications for beginners: Nitrocellulose (by itself) with a nitrogen content of 13% + is not capable of DDT in a fixed cavity from zero to 7300m/s. Which is the table value of VoD for NC in general. And if it ever does, there's no relying on it. Or it detonates at a much lower rate which is insufficient to initiate ETN.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 19-1-2024 at 09:53

For highly nitrated nitrocellulose, commercial nitrocellulose (left) with a 12.4% N content was used as a starting material. For the second stage above 13%N+, a nitration mixture of 50g H2SO4 96% + 25g KNO3 was used. A sealed jar of reagents was placed in a rotating container at 120 rpm and nitration was carried out for 90 minutes at 10 degrees Celsius. This was followed by a classic rinse with water and drying. The PLM method was used for complete neutralization https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVZkPWxj5WE&t=50s
The gradually added water contained a 10% NaHCO3 solution. Unfortunately, it was not possible to produce a crystalline NC, but a fluffy NC with short fibers. See Fig. right......

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pjig - 21-1-2024 at 10:46

Is there any easy way to find the nitration % of the material? I believe I have the commercial reagent grade 12.5%n . I would like to confirm it’s % . Can you provide a method you use to test your final nitrated Nc you posted.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 21-1-2024 at 12:31

Yes. I use incredible exact hammer method for measurement. More sharped sound, more nitrogen in NC...

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pjig - 22-1-2024 at 08:11

Lol I like it
Have you tried that incredible hammer test on the 12.4%n commercial grade NC? Just for a side by side comparison. I’m pretty sure it pops too. Probably not as energetic or sharp as you describe

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 22-1-2024 at 09:00

That's the just a difference.....12.4 grade pops with less sharp sound. But 13 N and more has similar sound a like CHP.
Of course, it require a lot years of practice with hammer.
0.05g of NC is wrapped in Alu foil. And hammering. If micrometeorites fly from the foil and stay under the skin on the hand, it is a high VoD over 6000m/s...
Glasses a condition..!

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Etanol - 22-1-2024 at 09:51

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Reagents for preparation: Cu(ClO4)2 (hexahydrate)........2,4g Hexamine ...............................0,6g Ethanol commerce grade .......1,5g H2O distiled.............................0,5g

What active formula does LL8 have?
mC6H12N4*HClO4+nNH4ClO4
or
mC6H12N4*HClO4+n[Cu(NH3)4](ClO4)2
?

Is it possible to prepare Cu(ClO4)2 from KClO4 or NH4ClO4 from KClO4?

[Edited on 22-1-2024 by Etanol]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 22-1-2024 at 11:19

KClO4 was not tryied for prepare Cu(ClO4)2. I estimate, that it will difficult or impossible. NH4ClO4 is possible from NaClO4 10 + NH4Cl 4.36 = NH4ClO4 9.6 + NaCl 4.77. Classic double replacement. Active formula is unknown for LL8.

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Etanol - 24-1-2024 at 12:59

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Active formula is unknown for LL8.

Can You conduct such an experiment?:
7.0g C2H12N4 (in 50ml dist H2O) + 18.5g Cu(ClO4)2*6H2O (in 50-100ml H2O)
Blue insoluble substance should be filtered, washed with water and dried.
Does the blue insoluble substance burn?
Does the blue insoluble substance burn as an oxidizing agent in a mix with sugar powder?
=>
The insoluble substance is
Cu(OH)2 ?
Cu(OH)ClO4 ?
Cu(OH)ClO4*nNH3 ?

The product of the cocrystallization of hexamine and NH4ClO4 burns much more slowly than LL8 or [Cu(NH3)4](ClO4)2. So, copper plays an important role in the LL8.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 25-1-2024 at 02:09

Unfortunately, I don't have any copper perchlorate. Your requirements would require a full day of work. And I don't have time for that now. Maybe in future.
Yes, the copper molecule plays a vital role in the high performance of all perchlorate mixtures.

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EF2000 - 26-1-2024 at 00:39

My hypothesis is that Cu8 contains a complex compound, similiar to the one found in Fedoroff, 7, H82.

In "Hexamethylenetetramino-Tetrazido-Copper" hexamine acts as "bridge" between two copper azide molecules, in Cu8 it holds two copper perchlorate molecules.

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Etanol - 26-1-2024 at 07:27

Quote: Originally posted by EF2000

My hypothesis is that Cu8 contains a complex compound, similiar to the one found in Fedoroff, 7, H82. In "Hexamethylenetetramino-Tetrazido-Copper" hexamine acts as "bridge" between two copper azide molecules, in Cu8 it holds two copper perchlorate molecules.

According to "X-ray Crystallography and Thermolysis of Ammonium Perchlorate & Protonated Hexamethylenetetramine Perchlorate Prepared by Newer Methods. Part 69" DOI:10.1615/IntJEnergeticMaterialsChemProp.2011002679
hexamine do not form complex with Cu(ClO4)2.
It form C6H12N4*HClO4 and blue insoluble substance containing copper, also decomposes into CH2O and NH4ClO4.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 10-2-2024 at 02:59

During an several tests was created special shape of detonator which looks a like steel spider...

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pjig - 23-2-2024 at 08:19

Curious if you have tried britelight with commercial NC 12%+.
Has there been success in initiating sensitive secondary’s? I realize that little bit of extra nitration level of the NC could be the difference.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 24-2-2024 at 04:44

Brightelite with NC12%+ is not reliable. For reliability is necessary shotgun powder (content NG) or homemade NC with 13% +.
Because one cavity content ony cca 0.2g NC, is advantage prepare NC in 2 steps. Double nitration. This method was tested and final NC is reliable....

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pjig - 24-2-2024 at 08:42

Makes sense. I was able to acquire a few lbs of commercial grande NC from a fellow hobbiest that I don’t know the nitration %. It is very clean , large flakes of som what compressed material. I store it under 100% lab grade alcohol so drying a sample is fast and ready with acetone.
Is there a titration or way to test ? Assuming it’s commercial standard , is the %! Usually 12.5+%?

I see the attractiveness of the brightelite ,and it’s moisture resistance from the NC. Very neat pyro comp indeed. Any other applications for this material? Damn near could make a awesome rocket propellant.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 24-2-2024 at 12:53

Testing sure exist, but is it question for chemist. (I am not) Therefore is easily do it secondary nitration and try result. Pure 12,5% or 13,5%
has on air almost same behavior. But in cavity is difference big....

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pjig - 29-2-2024 at 08:21

Quick question(s), on your assembly of the cap, are you using ss tube with epoxy base ?
Your secondary is pressed at high density, followed by the second increment less dense of (50/50 primary and secondary mix?) , then a primary at low density ? So I guess the main question is the 50/50 increment if that is my misunderstanding. Also have you tried aircraft Al for your caps vs the ss? Any gain using a stronger metal, besides mechanical safety

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fx-991ex - 29-2-2024 at 09:06

Quote: Originally posted by pjig

Quick question(s), on your assembly of the cap, are you using ss tube with epoxy base ? Your secondary is pressed at high density, followed by the second increment less dense of (50/50 primary and secondary mix?) , then a primary at low density ? So I guess the main question is the 50/50 increment if that is my misunderstanding. Also have you tried aircraft Al for your caps vs the ss? Any gain using a stronger metal, besides mechanical safety

Al can react with some energetic material, SS do not.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 29-2-2024 at 11:11

pjig.....Yes, usually the padding design is as per your description. Nothing epoxy based. Only the aluminum foil ball - bumping - creates an aluminum sheet with a thickness of 0.3 mm. Secondary EM is usually 0.3g ETN pressed into 10 - 30 kg. The middle segment is usually 0.10g ETN + 0.10g investigated EM, pressed into 1 - 3 kg. The initial segment is 0.3g only investigated EM, compressed to 1-3 kg. Primary - secondary EM are usually tested. I use my own standard. Hollow structural steel, 6/8 x 50...

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pjig - 29-2-2024 at 19:05

Copy that… makes sense. I assume you could use a former to create a convex of the pressed plug of Al to make like a commercial cap . I have tried a couple other methods that produce a excellent mini shaped wave for a cap. . No glues used for your aluminum base ? Have you had any issues loosing the plug or moisture migration?
Thank you for sharing so much cool info , I wish I had more to time to contribute to the threads . Nice to see some simple and relevant info on the SM forum

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ManyInterests - 29-2-2024 at 19:11

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

pjig.....Yes, usually the padding design is as per your description. Nothing epoxy based. Only the aluminum foil ball - bumping - creates an aluminum sheet with a thickness of 0.3 mm. Secondary EM is usually 0.3g ETN pressed into 10 - 30 kg. The middle segment is usually 0.10g ETN + 0.10g investigated EM, pressed into 1 - 3 kg. The initial segment is 0.3g only investigated EM, compressed to 1-3 kg. Primary - secondary EM are usually tested. I use my own standard. Hollow structural steel, 6/8 x 50...

On aliexpress they also sell bundles of 7x8x50mm bodies with one end sealed.

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pjig - 1-3-2024 at 22:59

That sounds pretty nifty. Are they ss or Al
I suppose you could order a ton from china,or a sample for closed capsule for some application battery lol , but have to order 10,000 to make a order

[Edited on 2-3-2024 by pjig]

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underground - 2-3-2024 at 15:26

Quote: Originally posted by ManyInterests

On aliexpress they also sell bundles of 7x8x50mm bodies with one end sealed.

Link ?

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pjig - 30-3-2024 at 18:38

Intrigued with the Nitrocelite , it has moderate anvil sensitivity as described, burns kinda weakly energetic. Haven’t encapsulated it . For A DDT test. It on its own w/o secondary, can it DDT, and even if weak, is is it enough like flash , capable of pushing ANAL to a det?

[Edited on 31-3-2024 by pjig]

[Edited on 31-3-2024 by pjig]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 30-3-2024 at 23:00

Not. Nitrocelite is weak for initiation any mixture on AN base.

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pjig - 31-3-2024 at 08:39

By the way it burns it seems weak. Anvil test is pretty energetic, but does take a good hit to go. Did you leave your materials in granular riced form for ease of packing , or reduce it to a finer powder or grain? As for fuse ignition in a tube , capsule…etc. Will it ddt? Or as your method of ignition bridge wire ( is it doped with a pyrogen?)!I imagine standard ematch will do the same. Doesnthe comp need a snappy ignition v.s. Fuse

Another thought crossed my mind , using k-dichromate catalyst to further sensitize and make more reactive . May not be necessary or desired due to the toxic salt . It is valuable in whistle fuels however for that purpose.

[Edited on 31-3-2024 by pjig]

[Edited on 31-3-2024 by pjig]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 31-3-2024 at 21:50

Best are grain 2x2 mm. Yes, can be used fuse ignition. No doped with pyrogen. Yes, k-dichromate can be used as senzitizer. For example 1 - 3 %.

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pjig - 2-4-2024 at 07:22

I haven’t had a chance to encapsulate it to see if it behaves like a primary . I’m Assuming approx.5g to by self should pop energetically if confined and correctly mixed in proper ratios, and correct nitration of said binder13%+. Smokeless powder .
Have you tried just the said mixture by its self to see if it ddt’s

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pjig - 8-4-2024 at 06:50

Nitrocelite:
Not getting a primary type reaction out of the material. It seems no better than Bp. In a sealed metal tube it pops w/o damaging the tube. So I assume either the nc was old military surplus or the AP was the issue(not fine enough). It was standard 200- mesh, acetone added to wet the AP, then a NC laq added (very thick probably 50% ratio) to appropriate %of comp. Stirred and manipulated for 20+ min, granulated with 1x1 mesh screen, dried. Hammering gets it go like a secondary, but no ddt or ematch reaction as a primary.

[Edited on 8-4-2024 by pjig]

[Edited on 8-4-2024 by pjig]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 8-4-2024 at 12:34

Military NC it may (or may not) contain antidetonation additing. Is necessary (for first attempts) do it itself pure NC 13N+. High quality a very fine powder AP is condition also. Nitrocelite is of course
alternative primary - secondary material. His detonation pressure is on edge of sensitivity of ETN. But repeatedly works it in my conditions...

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ManyInterests - 8-4-2024 at 15:53

Quote: Originally posted by underground

Quote: Originally posted by ManyInterests   On aliexpress they also sell bundles of 7x8x50mm bodies with one end sealed. Link ?

I am so sorry. I didn't notice your question. Here is the link where you can get the 8mmODx7mmIDx50mm tubes:

50 Pieces SS304 Material Temperature Sensor One End Closed

If you want a very long tube for an extra powerful detonator here is a where you can get 100 or 200mm versions

Link to long cap

I hope those links work. They might not be available in your country.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 8-4-2024 at 22:37

Nice cavity. And cheap cavity. Thanks for link. Stainless steel is very solid. But for testing brisantion and complette energy is thick the bottom disadvantage. Deep drawing cavity has thick bottom. EM material in cavity must first overcome
the thick bottom. It can be thick 1mm or more. Therefore final crater (in the lead or normal steel) will halfed, maybe still less. At perpedicular testing. Hundreds of experiments have confirmed that the highest performance comes from a cavity that has no bottom.. Plus, open output side provide possibility for easy delaboration in cause failning of the device. The closed bottom is suitable for field conditions and for main charges larger than 50g.
For testing small main charges, for example 10g - 20g, the thick bottom is a disadvantage and can cause the main charge to fail....

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pjig - 9-4-2024 at 06:59

There was an automotive supply for a ss transmission line block. Or radiator plug. It was approximately 7mm and about 2 inches long. Had a perfectly flat bottom.
With a punch, you concave the bottom for A attractive capsule. But I’m sure it would be cost prohibitive unless you could find bulk online..

LL:
Thank you for the response, on the smokeless powder. That does clarify a couple things.

I will attempt to another go at it with some bull’s-eye, and mill fine AP possibly added dichromate for catalyst.. . In your procedure or you getting these two items dried on a hot plate or was the hot plate just for the mixing ? if that’s the case, then more acetone was required? I started off with a NC lacquer and combine that with powder 200mesh AP of which was wetted with acetone, combined and stirred, then rolled into a putty ball and granulated..

[Edited on 9-4-2024 by pjig]

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underground - 9-4-2024 at 14:49

Now i have a question but it is out of topic but anyway. What is the most storage, long term, stable primary/secondary ? What would fit best for long storage caps with ss tubes (except TNT and RDX). I guess ETN is not that much storage stable, PETN is more stable than ETN but still not as much as TNT/RDX. Ammonium picrate i guess is not suitable for metal cavity. Maybe tetrazole nitrate ? Maybe aminonitroguanidine ? Are complex salts long term storage stable ? like CHP ?

[Edited on 9-4-2024 by underground]

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pjig - 9-4-2024 at 21:18

I have found azide and petn to be the holy grail of storage cap combinations.(military standard )=Years of predictable storage. No loss of power and quality .L ead azide is standard . Petn is very stabile and storable once cleaned up. Not sure why agn3 is so feared . If dextrinated , is very fine In crystal size and static safe for most part. Just my 2cents

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ManyInterests - 10-4-2024 at 03:31

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Nice cavity. And cheap cavity. Thanks for link. Stainless steel is very solid. But for testing brisantion and complette energy is thick the bottom disadvantage. Deep drawing cavity has thick bottom. EM material in cavity must first overcome the thick bottom. It can be thick 1mm or more. Therefore final crater (in the lead or normal steel) will halfed, maybe still less. At perpedicular testing. Hundreds of experiments have confirmed that the highest performance comes from a cavity that has no bottom.. Plus, open output side provide possibility for easy delaboration in cause failning of the device. The closed bottom is suitable for field conditions and for main charges larger than 50g. For testing small main charges, for example 10g - 20g, the thick bottom is a disadvantage and can cause the main charge to fail....

so even 1mm thickness can cause problems... :\ hmm this an issue since I don't know of any other tube that is less than 1mm in thickness. The side walls are OK but it is the bottom you have an issue with? Like I said, even looking for aluminum tubes (which professional detonators are made of) they are also 1mm in thickness. Granted I do need to plug the bottom but I have seen people wrap it with aluminum foil to hold in the ETN while they melt cast it, and when it solidifes it is a solid plug.

My tests with simple handpressed ETN were still very good despite this. But I think I can make it easier by filing off some of the bottom with a file or an electric tool. It's tedious since I bought many, many of them, but if you say the bottom is too thick, then I'll see if I can remove 0.5mm from the bottom without uncovering it. That should improve performance.

[Edited on 10-4-2024 by ManyInterests]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 10-4-2024 at 07:13

Your stainless steel is the best cavities for filling of any EM. If you use good pressed ETN, without bottom, you will see incredible holes in steel plates. Casting is an unnecessary and dangerous operation. You won't gain anything from it. None of my detonators are cast. And look at the beginning of the thread for exact holes from 0.3g ETN. Or from else EM.....

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ManyInterests - 10-4-2024 at 10:01

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Your stainless steel is the best cavities for filling of any EM. If you use good pressed ETN, without bottom, you will see incredible holes in steel plates. Casting is an unnecessary and dangerous operation. You won't gain anything from it. None of my detonators are cast. And look at the beginning of the thread for exact holes from 0.3g ETN. Or from else EM.....

So hypothetically. If I cut off the bottom of the tube, and then closed it with a bit of tape to prevent the powder from falling out the end, that will sufficient?

You've seen the pictures of my results with 0.5g of hand pressed ETN. I've melt-casted ETN into tubes several times before without issue. I take a lot of care to prevent any issues. I heat the water to only 70C (less will be necessary since the melting point is 60C) and after 7 inches I very carefully remove it from the water and place it into a holding spot for at least 30 minutes for it to fully solidify.

How will melt-casting not have an effect? My issue previously was that I hard-pressed the initiating mixture. I think my latest test showed a significant improvement. I am sure if I use melt-cast ETN (as you recommended) mixed with the NHN with only mild tamping I will have the detonator I am looking for.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 10-4-2024 at 22:12

Why wait 30 minutes when you can have an exit segment in the cavity pressed in 30 seconds. You're just adding work. As you rightly judge, paper tape is enough. And a small vise. It's 60x faster and safer than casting. // Let's keep things as simple as possible. But not simpler // (Albert Einstein). Perhaps there was a misunderstanding in the translation. Yes, cast and then crushed ETN must be used for all operations. Per grain 1x1 mm. With a tolerance of 0.5 mm - 2 mm.
In other words, cast grain....

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Sir_Gawain - 11-4-2024 at 09:36

By cast grain do you mean ETN that's been cast, then broken up into grains? That should form dense, free-flowing grains similar to gunpowder.

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ManyInterests - 11-4-2024 at 23:36

OK so I want to make sure I understood everything:

Don't melt-cast the ETN inside the container. Do it outside and grind it back up. Dug Boomfax has a video showing that and I intend to follow it on melt-casting a few grams of ETN at a time using his method. I have some PETN also, and melt-cast ETN/PETN together can form an extremely brisant mixture that would make for a good detonator charge? But I'll work with the ETN.

Anyway, just melt-cast the ETN then crush it back up. The safest way to do this is to put it on a hot water bath at no more than 60-65C and away from any heat source so it is in the process of cooling down when the ETN is melt-casting. I remember putting in a few grains of ETN on aluminum foil under a jet-lighter and it detonated. Thankfully it was only a grain so I got a loud pop and nothing else. After that load it and hand press it as usual. I was told that ETN that has been processed this way is no more sensitive to friction and pressure than regular powder ETN. Am I right here? I think with the more compressed melt-cast ETN I can probably fit in 1g into the cap body and still have room for a 0.3g of ETN/NHN mix

But for the detonator body: I've tried plastic and I've tried paper straws (wrapped in electric tape to waterproof) and maybe it is because of overpressing the mixture, but I just didn't find them effective. When I tried my first metal cap, the results were far better even with the less than optimal construction methods I used initially. I can probably file away part of the bottom of the 1mm steel caps I use, but I would rather have a bottomrather these caps with a bottom than without.

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 12-4-2024 at 05:20

Do whatever you want, but the open end of the tube gives the best results. When set vertically.....

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ManyInterests - 12-4-2024 at 05:53

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Do whatever you want, but the open end of the tube gives the best results. When set vertically.....

A very little bottom just to stop things from falling out.

Edit: I do also want it to set off a few small charges to see if they work. One small 40 or 50g ammonium picrate charge and maybe a 9:1 chlorate/vaseline cheddite charge.

[Edited on 12-4-2024 by ManyInterests]

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pjig - 14-4-2024 at 15:47

LL
I have to ask if you have attempted a former to concave the bottoms of your compacted foil bases (on caps) attempting a commercial looking / functioning wave shaping cap. ?

In past I had some luck with short 22 cal empty dented/ concaved in the center to create the wave shaping effect. Glued into an aluminum tube .
Another item I found was some copper cups that fit perfect in a 6mm Al tube. Super Glued in place , A punch was used to indent and concave the base to create a wave shaper. Very close performance to commercial products. More a valuable asset for shape charge initiation.

[Edited on 14-4-2024 by pjig]

[Edited on 14-4-2024 by pjig]

[Edited on 15-4-2024 by pjig]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 15-4-2024 at 05:09

Yes, but at inner diameter 6 mm is effect Misnay-Schardin minimal. A lot commerce tubes has flat bottom only. Is not serious reason use specials tools for create concave bottom....

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pjig - 15-4-2024 at 07:22

Yes , agreed . I assume mostly in a shape charge application it would benefit. Most caps I’ve ever delt with that where commercial all had indents in the base’s

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MineMan - 17-4-2024 at 19:45

Quote: Originally posted by pjig

Yes , agreed . I assume mostly in a shape charge application it would benefit. Most caps I’ve ever delt with that where commercial all had indents in the base’s

Not sure I have ever seen one with an indent in the base. We talking about from major companies?

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pjig - 18-4-2024 at 20:37

All The commercial caps I’ve ever used were concave on the base . Is there a commercial cap with out in the US?

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EF2000 - 20-4-2024 at 08:31

Just out of curiousity, I decided to run some calculations with compositions from this thread, using ProPEP 3. If you find thermodynamics boring, feel free to ignore me.

For easy comparison I list ideal specific impulse at shifting equilibrium. More information about the program and how to read output can be found here: http://www.nakka-rocketry.net/th_prope.html#output

Nitrocelite: 202.5 s - NC used in calculation is 13.45% N.

Attachment: Nitrocelite - original.txt (2kB)
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Nitrocelite with more common NC: 205 s - showing that ordinary ~12% nitrocellulose works in propellant as well as highly nitrated 13+% one.
Attachment: Nitrocelite - 12.6N.txt (2kB)
This file has been downloaded 12 times

Nitrocelite with 5% Al: 229.6 s - as always, impulse would be increased only if Al will burn in chamber, not afterwards as sparks.
Attachment: Nitrocelite - 12.6N +5 Al.txt (3kB)
This file has been downloaded 14 times

Lithex: 226.1 s - required adding hexamine to a list of compounds, nice fact: there's no solid products in exhaust, despite metal-containing oxydizer.
Attachment: Lithex.txt (3kB)
This file has been downloaded 13 times

Brightelite: 247.9 s - as expected, AP+hexamine is very good propellant (may I say "impulsive")
Attachment: Brightelite.txt (4kB)
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Conclusion: Nitrocelite is very interesting as a propellant. Since preparation invovles forming a homogenous paste with acetone, it can be formed into single grain instead of making granules.
Nitrocellulose, either bought or prepared, is much more accessible than usual fuels/binders for APCP, like HTPB or high quality epoxy. And evaporating acetone is easier than properly curing epoxy.

Since oxygen balance of original nitrocelite (80/20) is +18,4, hence not ideal, I ran calculations for 0 OB mixture (51.2/48.8), then slightly positive and slightly negative OB, and finally for 50/50 mixture.

0 OB: 247.6 s
+0.544 OB: 246.9 s
-0.153 OB: 247.7 s
50/50 mix: 248.3 s (!)

Attachment: Nitrocelite - 0 OB.txt (3kB)
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Attachment: Nitrocelite - +0.544 OB.txt (3kB)
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Attachment: Nitrocelite - -0.153 OB.txt (3kB)
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Attachment: Nitrocelite 50-50.txt (3kB)
This file has been downloaded 14 times

Of course, ideal proportion for maximum ISP is yet to be determined, but isn't it pretty that 1/1 mixture works well? And calculated specific impulse is comparable to APCP. For example, according to Nakka's website, popular "Cherry Limeade" APCP gives 225 s delivered ISP (245.2 s calculated).
Attachment: Cherry Limeade.txt (3kB)
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It should be said that PROPEP is a thermochemical code. It doesn't calculate burn rate, can't say whether something will burn at all and will not warn about dangerously high "pressure exponent" (read as "propensity to CATO"). So if anyone wants to try burning nitrocelite or brightelite in a motor, even small test motor, they should be very careful.

Edit: it appears that maximum ISP is 249 s at 45/55 AP/NC.

Attachment: Nitrocelite - 45-55.txt (3kB)
This file has been downloaded 17 times

[Edited on 20-4-2024 by EF2000]

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underground - 20-4-2024 at 08:51

Note that NC is not good for propellant as a curing agent since when acetone evapotates many tiny wholes will be created from the evaporated acetone and it will ruin your burning rate, most likely it will end up with CATO, this is the reason why they use curing agents, then remove the air pockets in vacume.

Edit: How sensitive is nitrocelite ?

[Edited on 20-4-2024 by underground]

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 20-4-2024 at 11:46

Incredible work on Nitrocelite theme....Thanks....But I am afraid that it will CATO....Maybe for ID max. 10 mm it will works....Interestling countig...

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EF2000 - 20-4-2024 at 11:47

Quote: Originally posted by underground

Edit: How sensitive is nitrocelite ?

With 80/20 ratio and 13+%N nitrocellulose:

Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov

Sensitivity on anvil is medium, similarly as safety matches.

With 45/55 ratio and ~12+%N NC, I guess, it will be lower.

[Edited on 20-4-2024 by EF2000]

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pjig - 20-4-2024 at 20:55

It seems amazing that military is able to utilize Rdx and other highly energetic materials in propellants( rockets and guns) and not get a detonation. Certain modifiers will be required, but it can be done under right conditions.

Well on the note of composite materials….. cast nitrocelite may have a high destiny, and nice VOD v.s. Granular material packet in cartridges. Probably in the 5k+ range

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Laboratory of Liptakov - 21-4-2024 at 09:58

Since there was an attempt to test a the detonator on lead in another thread, I'm attaching some lessons learned here. In Fig. 1 we see
basic assembly for the experiment. Detonator is create from cavity 8/6 50 mm structural steel. With 300 mg ETN pressed on 30 Kg. And also the filament strung on the through mandrel, which is used in the final pressing of the detonator. As a secondary target was used also construction steel 2mm of thickess, also used repeatedly in older else attepts. Basic brick from casted Lead is in role of main target.




On fig. 2 and 3 is assemble ready to attempt. Lesson learned: before attempting it is important to take a picture of the whole assembly before firing. Because the viewer has no idea what the detonator looks like and its location.




On Fig. 4 you can see damage, which cause detonator on both targets. And also bigger chip from detonator itself. On inside chip of detonator is see copper surface, which was created from detonation of CHP. Steel of 1 mm thickess is after blow only 0,5 mm.




Fig.5 and Fig 6:... Here we can see huge energy, which comes out from detonator on perpendicular bottom. On the contrary, the energy that is discharged into the lead is almost negligible. Lesson learned: Testing detonators so-called flat is a waste of time and material. And it does not bring a clear, rather almost no result to the researcher.




Fig.7......Is repeatedly see detonation pressure of ETN in perpendicular direction. Which damaged also secondary steel on profile 2 mm. Contrary, on the lead brick we can see only a deeper scratch. However, lead can have the advantage of capturing the distribution of energy that rises from approximately the middle of the detonator to its exit end. Which was supported by a steel profile. Arises almost photography stread of energy of detonation.



Filling of detonator how was sayed, output segment 300 mg ETN/30 Kg, medium segment 0,1 ETN + 0,1 CHP /1 Kg, starting segment 0,3 CHP / 1 Kg pressed. Plug created from classic grain BP cca 0,1 g pressed on 5 Kg. Bridge wire supply 12V / 2 A............

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