Random - 18-7-2012 at 02:13
We all have problems with gasses and toxic compounds sooner or later. So I thought of making a apparatus from pickle jars which would result in the
end product without touching the intermediates.
Example of application for this would be sulfuryl chloride made in situ to produce organic halide and possibly even using another syringe on the jar
with another reagent to react organic halide.
tell me what you think
Pyro - 18-7-2012 at 03:47
i wouldnt bother with all those jars, one or 2 washes is fine. just do it in a fumehood or outside.
bbartlog - 18-7-2012 at 07:04
Your diagram shows the easy conceptual part. Now you need to figure out what sort of lids, fittings, and tubing you are going to use in order to make
gas-tight and chemically resistant seals for all those glass vessels. I have mason jars, pickle jars, old wine bottles etc. in abundance and I have
also considered similar setups, but getting good seals (preferably easy to disassemble and reassemble as well) is the sticking point.
kristofvagyok - 18-7-2012 at 08:14
The in-situ synthesis looks nice, also with the X washing bottles, just a few problems are not mentioned.
The in-situ Cl2 + SO2 reaction needs some active charcoal as a catalyst and this reaction wouldn't go under pressure. The normal producere goes like
this: An allihn condernsers last "bubble" is filled with active C and cooling water passed through the jacket. After this the two gasses are passed
over and the produced SO2Cl2 with come down with the non reacted gases.
So. You completely forgot that not 100% of the SO2 and the Cl2 will form the SO2Cl2 so a lot "extra" corrosive gas will be produced.
This gas according to your "plans" should escape through several washing bottles what means a lot pressure and if something goes bad... It could hurt.
And don't forget that the pickle jars are not for chemistry, if something is hot in them, they could easily break, also they caps are from scrap metal
what will get eaten very fast by the corrosive fumes.
Have a nice day and think this again.
Random - 18-7-2012 at 10:40
I have already figured out the material part. The caps would be made from plastic, I think it's PE material. (I have found those for low price). I
would drill the holes in them.
PTFE tape would be used to seal the PVC tubing (both are decently resistant) and then I would melt the candle wax over all that to make it airtight.
This could be repeated once or twice if the material is very dangerous.
I haven't thought of that kriostof, it looks the apparatus would need some more work then. So more washing bottles cause more pressure? Maybe then it
would be safer to have less "taller" bottles that disperse the gas better.
The Cl2+SO2 reaction was just an example for any dangerous reagent which you don't want to handle or isolate.
kristofvagyok - 18-7-2012 at 11:00
SO2Cl2 is not that dangeorous... It could cause problems if you pour it onyour hand an it is smelly... But if your "reactor" goes mad... Espercially
at the candle wax boosted OTC tubing... Than the gaseous non reacted chlorine and sulfur dioxide could hurt to your lungs.
The gas washing bottles could easily cause problems... They will cause a higher pressure to the system. If you want to use this kind of apparatus,
then I would suggest to use one washing bottle with concentrated, hot sodium hydroxide, it will be enough to absorb most of the chlorine, HCl and the
SO2. And of course use one empty bottle before that.
And are you sure that this "system" would be easier than making your reagents separately?
platedish29 - 3-9-2012 at 09:20
If you thinking about a little pressure gradient where the Cl2 and SO2 gases are produced you gonna have a bad timewith overrun reagent production
which will consequently lead to insane bubling trrough filter jars to a point caustic soda will be spilled or the jars are going to explode. Just it.
suppose you have 3 consecutive jars, each filled with water up to 10 centimeters, then everytime you want let the flow gas is prevailing against the
water column pressure of each pipe, lets suppose the maximum achieve is the sum of all 3 hydraulic presses composed by the liquid raise of the
dislocated column, plus the pressure in the first column, then you have the least built up pressure the whole apparatus. Lets neglect hydraulic piston
pressure of the 3 jars, and simply consider the pressure of the first column, that simply sums to a total of aproxximately 0,01 atm, thats 10g force
for every square centimeter of the glass walls in the apparatus. Considering that last large flask of your provisioned with wide interior would hold 3
kilos pressure of inward to outward action to atmospherisc opposite force. That if the jar had a 20 centimeter diameter.
Nuff said,
What do you guys think would happen to this?
[Edited on 3-9-2012 by platedish29]
[Edited on 3-9-2012 by platedish29]
[Edited on 3-9-2012 by platedish29]
Poppy - 3-9-2012 at 19:47
In fact, calm down your pressing, its nothing to do over the makeup of the cotaining space would be filled wth filtered parts which contributes much
of this raising the wall p´ressue of the final vessel.
'Openly jar must be kept strong; while unwantful product ay collecet at bottom!" - Jarn, H.Firmly Conf. CO "