*FWOOSH* - 2-12-2013 at 22:24
Mostly for those of you in the US and maybe surrounding countries, are there any reagents that are either expensive or hard to find that you would be
interested in buying if I were to make a bulk purchase and offer it for resale?
If you guys can give me some suggestions I can look around and get quotes from different suppliers and see if I can do better than what's currently
available.
I still have ~15 kg of NaBH4 for sale so this is probably not for a couple months but I thought I'd get the ball rolling now.
EDIT: For example I was considering sodium metal, but shipping sodium metal would be a pain in the ASS and it's already available online. I could at
least bring the price down to ~175 /kg, which is something around half the price of gallium source but again, sodium metal is the epitome of
HazMat.
I was also looking around for LiAlH4. It's pretty expensive so I'd like to hear interest on that front before I made a buy. Haven't got much pricing
figured out for that one yet but I could probably bring the price down a couple hundred /kg from what Chemsavers asks and I would have a more
reasonable price scale for smaller purchases than they do.
[Edited on 3-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
I Like Dots - 3-12-2013 at 07:37
I was looking at importing things, like Ethyl Ether, or Iodine/NaI/KI.
The only source for Ether is $50 for 500ml.
*FWOOSH* - 3-12-2013 at 13:57
Ether can be synthesized by distilling a mixture of ethanol and H2SO4 ( I wonder if fuel grade ethanol could be utilized for this? think there was a
thread about it somewhere), or if that's not your style methyl tert-butyl ether is available at auto parts stores as an octane booster, I've found it
to be a pretty solid replacement for DEE. DEE is very expensive to buy in the US but I don't like the idea of being around gallons of DEE nor do I
relish the prospect of trying to repackage and distribute it. My opinion at the moment is that there are suitable alternatives that make
redistributing DEE too much of a headache, but if there's enough interest I'll consider it.
Elemental Iodine is controlled by the DEA, you can get in a lot of trouble if you get caught reselling it without a permit. It's also somewhat
reasonably priced on ebay from what I've seen. I think I'll stay hands off of that one.
I think Iodide salts are also covered under that bit of the DEA's jurisdiction, correct me if I'm wrong though.
I think I could get Lithium for a good price, and it seems to be pretty ridiculously expensive otherwise. Any interest in that?
[Edited on 3-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
MrHomeScientist - 3-12-2013 at 14:21
From what I understand iodides are completely unwatched/unregulated. At least, they aren't on the DEA Lists of Scheduled Chemicals (wheras elemental
iodine is). Amusing, since it's incredibly easy to isolate iodine from iodide salts, thus easily sidestepping regulations. Makes the whole war on
drugs seem pretty futile, but that's another discussion that's very off-topic.
*FWOOSH* - 3-12-2013 at 14:41
http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/fed_regs/rules/2007/fr0702...
There we go. "Chemical mixtures containing greater than 2.2% iodine" that's pretty damn vague. I'd say the term "Chemical mixtures" expressly implies
a mixture of chemicals not elements, and therefore Iodine can be extrapolated to mean the chemical compound Iodine (I2) and not the element
as a component of a salt, as it is not in and of itself a chemical in the mixture in the second case. So you're probably right MrHomeScientist 
. Silly feds.
zed - 3-12-2013 at 14:43
The hysteria regarding Iodine seems to have eased somewhat.
Numerous states have acted to restrict sales of Ephedrine; the Real Problem!
*FWOOSH* - 3-12-2013 at 15:03
I really shouldn't, but I'm going to.
https://www.erowid.org/archive/rhodium/chemistry/ephedra.htm...
Evidently the Ephedra plant is a suitable candidate for replacing synthetic ephedrine. Bahahahahahaha
This cracks me up, they're always going after "The Real Problem" and it's always something different every couple years, and I really don't think that
the world at large will ever be able to comprehend chemistry enough understand the hilarious futility of the war on drugs.
But ANYWAY, off topic again 
.
[Edited on 3-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
Polverone - 3-12-2013 at 16:35
The product should be versatile, not be significantly more regulated for sales or shipping than NaBH4, and be commonly difficult or expensive for
individuals to purchase in small quantities.
Some ideas:
Salts of hydroxylamine
Salts of hydrazine
Sodium dithionite
Sodium azide
Paraformaldehyde
Magnesium ribbon
Less sure about practicality of shipping, otherwise interesting:
Tert-butyl alcohol
Dimethylformamide
Tetrahydrofuran
Acetonitrile
Other:
TLC plates
Many of these items are not too difficult to produce in a home laboratory from OTC materials, but all at least require significant preparative labor.
They would be worthwhile purchases for many home laboratories.
Dariusrussell - 3-12-2013 at 17:25
I actually think TLC plates are a great idea and I'm in need of them! I've tried to make some from the various DIY guides but I'm never happy with the
results. I'm not an expert on TLC, but I think silica on glass would be the most versatile, and in sheets would be the most cost effective.
EDIT: Also depending on what people want, PET backed seems better since its easier to cut and handle.
[Edited on 4-12-2013 by Dariusrussell]
Blue Matter - 3-12-2013 at 18:32
PTFE stuff would be cool also browsing around Alibaba you can find some interesting products made from ptfe.
mr.crow - 3-12-2013 at 20:02
There actually is a bulk buy for Iodine in Canada (legal here), you can get it on Ebay! Called Ingredient Depot. He's had it for years, probably
ruined his warehouse by now. Iodine is super expensive after the Fukushima disaster and everyone going crazy.
My concern is safely shipping. There is a huge manual of how to ship different goods and improper shipping could cause big trouble. Inorganic salts
seem pretty harmless but ether or solvents would be a huge hazard.
mayko - 3-12-2013 at 20:29
I think getting bulk TLC plates is a great idea; I was saddened to find them prohibitively expensive for the amount of chromatography I'd like to do.
*FWOOSH* - 3-12-2013 at 20:42
Thanks for some great suggestions Polverone!
The only one that I'd say is cheap and easy to get a hold of is paraformaldehyde, buy it off ebay for pretty cheap (Like $30/kg) as a mildewcide, but
it's usually only ~90% purity. Just got some myself actually. http://www.ebay.com/itm/3-BAGS-PROTEXALL-G-P-MILDEW-PREVENTI...
Magnesium is always lovely, did the math and realized you're right, it's actually quite expensive to buy Mg ribbon. I'll get some quotes.
Hydrazine is always a bitch and quite useful, never needed hydroxylamine hcl but it does look like it's a pretty expensive and versatile and reagent
so it's on the list. Haven't used Sodium Dithionite either (I looked for Dithionate at first... woops) but I'll look around.
Sodium azide I'm not horribly fond of, makes me more nervous than CN salts. Not sure how shippable it is either. But I'm pretty sure there's a demand
for it. I'd have to think on it and look up any shipping regulations.
All four of those solvents you mention are great ideas if I can work out the shipping kinks. I feel like I spend an obscene amount of money for what
doesn't always last very long.
Flammable liquids are a bitch to ship, but virtually EVERY solvent organic chemists work with is a flammable liquid 
.
I found a couple people offering TLC plates, I'll try to get some details. What do TLC plates run? Got mine from Dr.Bob as kind of a bonus.
@Darius
Found this on Ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/13-TLC-plates-thin-layer-chromatogra...
Seemed pretty reasonable for some good sized plates.
@Blue
What kind of stuff have you been looking at? I found some PTFE containers that were neat, hard to find in the US.
Funkerman23 - 3-12-2013 at 22:26
Neutral Silica 60 powder would be nice but the allure of preparative column chromatography has worn off so no rush really. Of course I could be full
of it so take with a grain of salt.
*FWOOSH* - 4-12-2013 at 00:49
Turns out the vendor I purchased from last time stocks Hydroxylamine HCl. Are any of you guys looking for some? I could probably have it within a
couple weeks (so much for a couple months...), I'd have to get a 21 kg drum
though so I'm gonna need some kinda show of hands.
Pricing would be something like:
1 kg - $100 + shipping
500g - $65 + shipping
250g - $40 + shipping
100g - $20 + shipping
50g - $12 + shipping
Shipping would be MUCH cheaper this time around because it's shippable via USPS
Post in here or U2U me so I can get an idea as to how much interest there is.
[Edited on 4-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
Marvin - 4-12-2013 at 05:59
Those TLC plates on ebay would be decent value if we could cut them up to small test strips, but those are glass backed. 20 years ago I think the
strips were were using worked out at about 50p each for about 1 inch by 3 inches. I thought that was expensive for silica coated plastic film.
*FWOOSH* - 4-12-2013 at 13:11
You can most definitely cut glass plates into more usable test strips.
Here's a nice tutorial with pictures for those of you who're interested.
http://chemtips.wordpress.com/2012/12/14/cutting-edge/
And I inquired about the TLC plates, but they're too expensive. I might be able to get the price lower if I get 40 or 50 boxes instead of 20 but I
won't have that kind of cash available for a while.
[Edited on 4-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
Marvin - 5-12-2013 at 04:38
As much for curiosity than anything else, how much?
Glass plates can be cut and trimmed but aside from having a lot of broken glass edges around the coating tends to crack and splinter and flake off. I
have the feeling that would be a nightmare on a glass substrate.
Pyro - 5-12-2013 at 07:37
A quick search on alibaba reveals the price of Na to be between 2200 and 2900USD/1000kg
the MOQ is multiple tons for most offers, but a few will sell as little as 10kg.
as far as hydroxylamine HCl is 5-15USD/kg with an MOQ of 25kg. that makes your price quote a bit much *FWOOSH*
another possible bulk buy is Br2
[Edited on 5-12-2013 by Pyro]
*FWOOSH* - 5-12-2013 at 10:16
I've found that the price you see on the listings has very little correlation to what you're actually going end up paying. 5-15 USD is the price they
ask for tonnage scale orders. AND that's the FOB price, which only includes the cost of materials, shipping via courier adds a significant amount to
the price, not to mention the paypal fees I have to cover.
I was quoted for 1000 USD including shipping for 21kg. I might be able to get it down to 800-900 but I don't like to haggle until I'm set on buying
something, otherwise you piss off the few people willing to sell to an individual. Even many of the companies with MOQ's down to 1 kg won't even
respond to individuals, they reserve small orders for large companies looking for samples before a large buy. And most of the companies won't accept
paypal, they want you to wire them the money before they send out your package, which is asking to get scammed. The pricing I gave, based on me paying
~50 /kg is roughly half that of what I saw elsewhere. I thought that was pretty fair, correct me if I'm wrong.
As for the sodium, I managed to get a quote that came out to roughly $60 /kg shipped, but I had a bad feeling about the vendor and they wouldn't
accept PayPal so that was wasted time.
I'm not trying to rip anyone off here, I'm quite open about what I'm paying. You also have to consider the economics of the whole thing, I'm putting
my money forward for something I will quite likely be sitting on for a long time. I put a lot of time and effort into obtaining something. Then I have
to verify the quality. Then I have to repackage it (not free) and get it shipped out, if it's international I can spend over half an hour just on
paperwork sometimes for one order. I have to leave margins for packages which are lost or broken (supposedly covered by insurance but I have a hard
time ever getting money from anyone) which has happened several times already. As much as I'd love to do all this for free it all costs time and
money, both of which I have in limited supply.
On the other hand if you've actually communicated with a supplier and received a better quote good for you! Buy it, let me know about it or just post
about it here. It's finals week and I don't have the time to communicate with more than a couple of these suppliers.
This isn't supposed to be solely a thread for me. Anyone with the money and initiative is free to take some of these ideas and buy up some chemicals.
I don't hold a monopoly on the Chinese chemical market. I was just one of the only ones on this board to take the jump and buy from them, the idea's
even been bounced around a couple times in threads on this site.
Sorry if I ranted, I just felt like I needed to clear up that it isn't as simple as clicking "add to cart" = Profit. No hard feelings Pyro .
@Marvin
20 boxes with 20 pieces each of 5cm X 20cm for $790 shipped. Didn't say anything about fluorescent indicator either.
Cheaper than new from a US company but still too much for hobbyist usage I think. Pretty sure there're better deals on ebay.
Pyro - 5-12-2013 at 10:31
I was just giving a comment, I see the dilemma.
you can always pretend to be a company, chances are they can't verify the info you give them...
*FWOOSH* - 5-12-2013 at 10:48
Hey! Good news about the TLC plates! I found some for sale on ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/JT-Baker-TLC-Plate-Silica-Gel-7001-0...
5cm X 20cm glass backed with fluorescent indicator. Just bought the last 10 boxes. He was asking 125 apiece but I got him to do more like 65 incl
shipping since I took the rest off his hands. I'm willing to break up the boxes and I could even look into cutting these into test sized strips for a
bit extra for those who don't want to do it themselves.
I was thinking something like $100 + shipping for a box of 100. Coincidentally this comes out to about 50p per plate at the current exchange rates
Marvin , for much larger plates even.
If people who're interested could post or message me with the kind of quantity they'd want and whether or not they would want them pre-cut (dunno how
much that'd be, think it'd be pretty reasonable though) I can try to get some kind of actual pricing scheme figured out.
EDIT:
@Pyro
I didn't think you were accusing me of anything, I just felt like I should put that out there to prevent anyone from thinking it.
I could pretend to be a company, but ethics aside, I think it would be a lot of work and not as simple as it sounds at first.
[Edited on 5-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
Pyro - 5-12-2013 at 13:13
I got loads of chemicals pretending to be a company, my location helped a lot but still...
*FWOOSH* - 5-12-2013 at 18:41
If you've managed to pull it off then it's something I'll keep in mind at least then. I'd agree that your location probably helps a lot though, and
I'd just as soon avoid any shady business at the moment.
zenosx - 5-12-2013 at 19:02
Older thread pushed I suppose from the resent NaBH4 going out.
I'd be interested VERY MUCH in TLC plates. They are prohibitively expensive from what I have found for what I would use them for, and the home-made
versions have never turned out the way I expected.
Second on the Hydroxylamine HCl, although I would only purchase `100g at most.
Highly volatile solvents I would think would be pretty much off the list because of shipping issues (ether for ex.)
*FWOOSH* - 5-12-2013 at 22:23
This is actually a very recent thread zenosx, the dates are posted DD-MM-YYYY not MM-DD-YYYY if that's what confused you.
The TLC plates I purchased from Ebay should be shipped soon, I'll let you guys know when I have them.
It looks like there's interest in me splitting up the boxes so here's a preliminary pricing scheme:
1 box of 100 full 5x20cm plates - $100
50 plates - $60
25 plates - $35
10 plates - $20
5 plates - $12
None of these prices include shipping, but I don't think it'll be expensive, no need to use a courier like FedEx this time.
I want to offer them precut, but I need to figure out how much effort/money it's going to be before I can start quoting prices on that.
[Edited on 7-12-2013 by *FWOOSH*]
testimento - 6-12-2013 at 15:09
I'm interested in 25L of benzyl alcohol.
Metacelsus - 6-12-2013 at 18:13
What about something like crown ethers?
thanos thanatos - 7-12-2013 at 08:14
A couple of things come to mind which are somewhat hard to source but are not List 1 (or List 2) and aren't dangerously reactive (I wouldn't want you
trying to repackage tert-butyllithium or risking exposure to things like nickel carbonyl or trimethylsilyldiazomethane):
1) Pyridine
2) Triphenylphosphine
3) Thionyl chloride
As to Pyro's suggestion of Br2, I think that would fall under the too hazardous to repackage category, but may I suggest N-Bromosuccinimide?
thanos thanatos - 7-12-2013 at 08:24
Just after I posted, I thought of a couple of other useful reagents that are hard or expensive to come by but very useful as strong dessicants:
1) P2O5 (easy to get, but usually very overpriced)
2) CaH2 (suprisingly hard to find a place that sells this to individuals)
Blue Matter - 8-12-2013 at 18:58
Yes!!!! P2O5 I completely forgot about it this would be a great thing to bulk order.
bismuthate - 9-12-2013 at 03:52
Poisons like arsenic, phosphides, or cyanides are much cheaper in bulk.
Also I would recomend iodides or carbides.
Maybe some more exotic chems like Se, Te, and more.
[Edited on 9-12-2013 by bismuthate]
Pyro - 9-12-2013 at 08:43
I only saw i like dots' post, I can get ether for about 24EUR/l at the pharmacy (including the empty bottles)
I like the idea of CaH2!
I Like Dots - 10-12-2013 at 15:49
Yeah, ether is a pet peeve of mine. I cant make it because I cant find any decent denatured alcohol, it all contains too many ketones and methanol I
don't want in my ether. I can distill it from starting fluid but that comes out to around $30 for 500ml... Better than buying it online at $50/500ml.
Anyway NaCN or KCN, LAH, CaH2, benzyl alcohol or benzaldehyde are suggestions i like.
Blue Matter - 10-12-2013 at 17:09
Barium nitrate would be very helpful as it is extremely expensive.
bismuthate - 10-12-2013 at 18:49
http://www.amazon.com/BARIUM-NITRATE-Domestic-High-Purity/dp...
DubaiAmateurRocketry - 10-12-2013 at 20:34
5-amino-tetrazole ?
see this
http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=27766
*FWOOSH* - 5-1-2014 at 10:18
Forgot to post here, but those TLC plates are in. Priced as shown above. Unfortunately I've decided I don't have time to cut them myself.
And thanks for all the suggestions so far, I'll keep them in mind once I've saved up enough for another buy.
Dr.Bob - 5-1-2014 at 19:35
Not trying to cut in on Fwoosh, but I recently found a box of 100 2.5 x 7.5 cm Merck TLC glass plates if anyone wants smaller ones. 250 um, Silica
gel 60, F254, Merck 15327-1. I'd ask $50 for the box, plus postage, or if no one wants a whole box, I can break it up. They are older, so likely
deactivated a bit, so excellent for more polar compounds. I also have some whole 20 x 20 cm glass plates, make me an offer for them, great for
cutting into smaller pieces.
Also, I found some prepacked silica gel cartridges/columns/tubes, from 1g to 40 g size, in a variety of size, shapes, and types (Biotage, ISCO,
Alltech). Some similar examples are:
http://www.discoverysciences.com/product.aspx?id=6256
http://www.discoverysciences.com/uploadedFiles/Home/SPE_Filt...
http://www.biotage.com/product-group/flash-cartridges
Mostly flash grade silica, might have a few other odd bits like alumina, not sure yet. Samples are available to anyone interested and willing to pay
postage or I can throw in samples with any order.
Lastly, I also found some bottles of C18 sorbants, which is normally unreasonably expensive. I don't know much about it, I a willing to sell cheap as
I don't know much about its quality or type. They are normally used for reverse phase chromatography, such as HPLC, but not sure what grade this is
for, exactly.
*FWOOSH* - 5-1-2014 at 20:40
Don't mind at all Dr. Bob!
Thanks again for all the great glassware
smaerd - 6-1-2014 at 06:00
I wouldn't mind getting my hands on some triethylamine or triethylamine HCl. It's such a pain to find reasonably priced, and a really basic useful
organic base. Or as Cheddite Cheese suggested crown ether's would be quite cool as well. There have been a few experiments I wanted to do with them
but was prohibited by acquisition.
*FWOOSH* - 8-1-2014 at 15:55
@bismuthate
http://www.pyrochemsource.com/BARIUM-NITRATE-Domestic-High-P...
Same source you provided but a bit cheaper because it's on their home site.
zed - 10-1-2014 at 15:37
Until fairly recently, CaH2 was inexpensive and easy to obtain. It was formerly used to inflate balloons via generated hydrogen. Part of an
emergency radio kit. The material was available via military surplus, in cans.
I've checked several times recently, and CaH2 seems to be permanently "Out of Stock".
TheChemiKid - 10-1-2014 at 18:53
I am also very interested in some pyridine.
Texium - 11-1-2014 at 22:59
I've been needing some fine magnesium powder for a couple of experiments but it all seems to be sold in much larger quantities than I need.
*FWOOSH* - 12-1-2014 at 03:30
Search for magnesium powder on ebay. I saw listings as low as $5 including shipping for an acceptable amount of magnesium powder in the US.