Sciencemadness Discussion Board

The perfect explosive(s)

Theoretic - 3-10-2003 at 04:55

I was just thinking, could triazidoRDX (or even tetrazidoHMX) be prepared like this:
1)C3N3(NO2)3H3+3Cl2=> =>C3N3(NO2)3Cl3+3HCl
2)C3N3(NO2)3Cl3+3NaN3=> C3N3(NO2)3(N3)3.

Or even C(NO2)2(NH2)2 (dinitrodiaminomethane) and C2(NHNO2)4(NH2)2 (tetranitraminodiaminoethane)...
I know I'm dreaming... But dreams sometimes come true! :o

BASF - 3-10-2003 at 05:31

1)C3N3(NO2)3H3+3Cl2=> =>C3N3(NO2)3Cl3+3HCl

... i´ve also thought of this(bromo-RDX-thread), Philou Z. had the opinion it could be possible, at least for the question of halogenation without destroying the
-N-NO2 - connection.

The halogenated nitramine should be an energetic material superior to RDX, although it is not easy to predict which influence the halogenation will have on the crystal-packing(HNFX or ONC are good examples for unexpected ways of crystal packing; for the first, only 1.8g/ccm (2.0g/ccm in theory), 2.1 instead of 2.3g/ccm for ONC have been observed).

...ok, back to topic.
isn´t the azide-group pulling electrons like a halogen?
Therefor the azido-nitramine would benefit from the better oxygen balance and the high heat of formation for N2, on the other hand, the bonds on the ring would be considerably weakened, leading to higher sensitivity.

This is why i thought it would be better trying bromination - a reaction everyone would be able to try with RDX and KBr as starting-material.
Br would not weaken the nearby bonds that much.
Ok, it would be a simple molecule, but not everything has to be as complicated as possible, no? :P:):D

[Edited on 3-10-2003 by BASF]

KABOOOM(pyrojustforfun) - 4-10-2003 at 20:44

dreaming is good but not when making mistake in formula of RDX!:o there's 6 H not 3
the triazido compound isn't @ perfect OB

[Edited on 5-10-2003 by KABOOOM(pyrojustforfun)]

Theoretic - 17-11-2003 at 08:15

OK, in the bin that goes. :(
But what about cyanuric trinitrate - C3N3(NO2)3? Should be preparable by making cyanuric chloride (C3N3Cl3), then reacting it with NaCN to make cyanuric tricyanide(should be interesting - and hot-burning too), hydrolyzing that to ammonium tricarboxocyanurate, heating that with NaOH or CaO to drive off ammonia and eliminate the carboxyl, and finally nitrating that with HNO3/H2SO4. That's it, I hope. :D But it's worth the labour, it's promising to give the nighest VoD so far, since it has perfect OB. :cool::cool:

Madog - 17-11-2003 at 14:46

a while ago i was thinking make a halo-benzene from toluene, then nitrate it to trinitro, then azide it! wonder if it would be of useful sensitiveity.

i think philou mentioned something of the sort somewhere.