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Author: Subject: Quick question on a potassium chlorate cell
Laboratory of Liptakov
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[*] posted on 20-3-2017 at 23:33


This thread relates to the issue of preparing xClO3 in cell. For questions on usage will probably be somewhere else.....:cool:....LL



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[*] posted on 21-3-2017 at 05:20


I have done a great job with some homemade mno2 electrodes over a titanium plate. It is a kind of a MMO electrode. That is how i made my naclo3. Next time i will try with kcl. I used a computer power supply. The cell was running at 75-80 °C.

[Edited on 21-3-2017 by underground]
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[*] posted on 21-3-2017 at 06:06


Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov  
1) And still question: multi metal oxide (MMO) anode has how final surface ?
2) Important is good experience with really use anodes. Because e-bay can be fake, false... your recommend link for buy please ?
Thanks.....:cool:....LL


I have used MMO material from the seller "laserred" on ebay:

http://www.ebay.com/usr/laserred?_trksid=p2047675.l2559

At least the electrodes that I bought were excellent and served their purpose very well. That was a few year ago, so I can not comment on current quality of materials on sale.




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[*] posted on 21-3-2017 at 13:03
Titan anodes


Well, thanks, markx....of course conditions is not same during a few years....:cool:



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[*] posted on 27-4-2017 at 11:58
MMO run


OK, MMO anode now running. But sellers recommend 250 - 300 mA on 1 cm2. But Anode is mesh, sieve. What hell measure it ? One side, both side ? Maybe will better hold only Voltage under 4 Volts. Momentaly is active surface (measure from one side) 50,8 cm 2. And current is 14 A at 4,1 Volts. It are 275 mA / cm2. It is right ? Or I am counting bullshit...:-) Next thing, the connecting strip of anode is pretty hot, about 70 Celsia. Yet, that his surface is with contact with Copper plates in long 6 cm from both sides. Very weird. ...:cool:...LL



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[*] posted on 27-4-2017 at 15:29



Area of LaserReds mmo mesh has been discussed before somewhere or other and it was agreed that the area is equal to lenght by breath just as if it were a flat solid piece of mmo. The holes get cancelled out by the extra area on the 'inside' of the holes.
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[*] posted on 28-4-2017 at 01:43


Thanks. Other words 1 cm2 on mesh = 1 cm solid planar surface, counting on one side. Thus, 1cm2 anode (mesh) = 2 cm2 surface as total large for counting of current. Right ?



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[*] posted on 28-4-2017 at 06:23


Run slightly smaller cathodes on both sides of your anode. Keeps you from pushing your MMO surface too hard.
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[*] posted on 28-4-2017 at 07:37


Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov  
Thanks. Other words 1 cm2 on mesh = 1 cm solid planar surface, counting on one side. Thus, 1cm2 anode (mesh) = 2 cm2 surface as total large for counting of current. Right ?


It is around two times the length x breath of the piece of mesh.

"A major MMO manufacturer told me that their MMO mesh was 2.2 times the basic dimensions."

This quote from here
http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/topic/3981-the-bucket-cell...

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[*] posted on 6-5-2017 at 06:57


Beware of this seller. Sells very low quality platinum anodes.
http://store.theamateurchemist.com/platinum-titanium-anode-2...
All describe here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xV-SaP2iv7s




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[*] posted on 13-7-2017 at 09:25


I bought my MMO anode from The Amateur Chemist, and I haven't had any issues with it. Works very well. I run 5V/5A since I'm in no hurry, and so far I get 50-65% yield over a period of 3-4 days. I spike my juice with a little potassium dichromate to reduce back-reduction at the cathode, and I have an old IV drip adjusting pH with 10% HCl solution.

The low amperage doesn't give off a lot of heat though, so I apply external heating to keep the cell at 70 C. My next development is automatic pH and temperature control through a pH sensor and electronic thermometer connected to an arduino.

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[*] posted on 13-7-2017 at 12:15


OK, I am glad, to hear it. My MMO also run without problem for chlorates. But I writted beware of Platinum (for perchlorates) was damaged during a few hours. Therefore I beware on Platinum active surface wherein the main problem. Dr.



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[*] posted on 5-7-2018 at 18:14


Quote: Originally posted by The WiZard is In  


On a small-scale basis, successful chlorate/perchlorate production is a
real challenge, and this chemist was largely a failure at the effort. The
requirements of a high-amperage, low-voltage power source largely rule out
batteries on any continuous basis. The common 6-volt battery charger is the
most convenient power source but suffers from lack of variability. The large
types used by garages can deliver an output of 50-100 amperes. The
problem of varying the voltage might be solved by use of a rheostat hooked
in series with the positive or negative output lead, but amperage would
(suffer.



The problem of voltage is solved on the INPUT lead with a variac.





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[*] posted on 5-7-2018 at 19:04


Phone charger 5v power supply some provide 2.1 A of power
Is that a good power supply for chlorate?

[Edited on 6-7-2018 by symboom]




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[*] posted on 11-7-2018 at 13:03


It is 10 Watt only. You need minimal 100 W power supply. And A / V meter. Normal amateur cell on 1 liter is 6 V/20A.
= 180 W = power supply 200 W trafo. Trafo must had power cooler fan.




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[*] posted on 12-7-2018 at 04:55


Using low frequency iron core transformers for conducting amateur electrosynthesis on any appreciable scale is a dead artform in my opinion. The system is bulky, tends to have high losses and keeping the temperature under control is of essence. They are quite "bombproof" if dimensioned correctly and simple as dirt though...
On the other hand there are very efficient and cheap switch mode power supplies available and most of them have variable output voltage (at least to some degree). I find these vastly superior to the old school bulky transformer setups.




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[*] posted on 12-7-2018 at 05:37


I would stay away from using an "off-line" switcher, like the kind you find in a computer. Too limited in voltages
and the current limiting is fixed. I would use a lab supply, especially if I was collecting data as to what voltages are optimal and what currents
are really needed. Also, the outputs are variable DC, and have current limiting and short circuit protection.

Something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/SUNCOO-Precision-Variable-Adjustable-...

They're all over Amazon and eBay. This particular one is fairly inexpensive and has a pretty good range and output. (0-30V,0-10A)

And, as you can see, the price is right. ;)

Also, a question:
I noticed that someone posted a Variac (auto-transformer)
Unless you use it with a rectifier, wouldn't that produce an AC waveform?

If so, wouldn't that alternate the polarity at the electrodes at (50 or 60 hz )

What would that do to any yields?


[Edited on 12-7-2018 by MJ101]
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