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ManyInterests
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Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov  | Casting is much more laborious and the output brisance is no better. When pressed into a solid cavity using a small vise, the density of ETN reaches
1.7g/cc or higher. It's the easiest and fastest. Usually 300 - 400 mg of ETN is pressed. This is followed by manual compression of 100 mg of ETN with
hand pressure of approx. 2 - 5 Kg. This is followed by a primary mixture, usually 200 mg. NHN has proven to be an unreliable substance. The most
reliable is 200 mg of SA-DS. In its own plastic case together with a resistance bridge. The use of plastic shrink tubing has been proven. SA-DS is
poured loosely and secured with a piece of nitrocellulose cotton wool.
The side with the wires is completed with baking soda. And drips 4 drops of instant glue. This results in a very strong plug made of a relatively
inert and cheap and available material. And it holds immediately.
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I saw your video on double salts. I also read about them. They are interesting (especially your use of an olive jar exactly like the improvised
munitions guide!) but in all honesty I really believe that the NHN should have worked. I will add more next time.
And while melt-casting isn't much better than hard pressed ETN, I don't have a press to press it with, so I cannot get the 1.7cm3 density by pressing
by hand. Melt-casting in the detonator as I have been readvised again is much easier and I can do it. I will try that, add more ETN on top after it
cools down and then 0.4 or 0.5g of NHN pressed in by hand as hard as I can. Melt-cast ETN is pretty much the easiest way to get the density to 1.7 or
1.8. ETN is brisant enough on its own, I don't need more! 1.3 or so grams of ETN in a detonator is powerful enough for almost anything.
I also did make some CHP BTW. But the copper oxide I ordered is probably BS which is why I have a LOT of containmation. I've also seen some that
burned super fast while others didn't. I ordered more copper (II) oxide that I hope is more pure so I can use it, since I have lots of ammonium
perchlorate left (around 100 grams, or a little less. Either way it is enough for a good amount of CHP to make) I just need to make or buy more
ammonia to make it as well since my 28% supply is scant at the moment.
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specialactivitieSK
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I read about Bi2O3+Al (maybe with PETN) as potencial mixture for blasting cap.
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Herr Haber
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Dragon Egg composition as an initiator ? Why not...
I've always wondered what would happen if the beads in commercial compositions were bigger but never dared try 
The spirit of adventure was upon me. Having nitric acid and copper, I had only to learn what the words 'act upon' meant. - Ira Remsen
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Bert
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Although the dragons egg granule comps behave quite snappy, they have a limitation in effective sizes- The amount of comp which has reached the
temperature for effect to occur GOES. The interior of any oversized chunk of comp DOES NOT go. The under heated, unreacted ballance gets broken into
crumbs and flung about- Some of it MAY smolder and go "bang" later- a great deal of it generally will not.
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
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2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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Herr Haber
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What if I add neutron reflectors ? /joking
Thanks Bert for that very interesting information. I understand what you mean. I read a couple of threads on the mixture but may have missed some.
My friends are going to be so dissapointed. Some asked if I could do something "bigger" than store bought crackling fountains...
Anyway, sorry for the off topic.
The spirit of adventure was upon me. Having nitric acid and copper, I had only to learn what the words 'act upon' meant. - Ira Remsen
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MineMan
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bert |
Although the dragons egg granule comps behave quite snappy, they have a limitation in effective sizes- The amount of comp which has reached the
temperature for effect to occur GOES. The interior of any oversized chunk of comp DOES NOT go. The under heated, unreacted ballance gets broken into
crumbs and flung about- Some of it MAY smolder and go "bang" later- a great deal of it generally will not. |
But what about confined in a metal tube? I saw some mixture on Russian YouTube… that was similar and it DDT in the open.
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Bert
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| Quote: Originally posted by MineMan |
But what about confined in a metal tube? I saw some mixture on Russian YouTube… that was similar and it DDT in the open. |
Both of the common lead oxides (litharge, minium) when used as oxidizers in pyrotechnic compositions or unthinkingly mixed with fuels in the lab have
surprised a few people with how violent they can be- I've no idea what you saw, could you find it and post WHAT the mixture was/what it did to make
you think it was a primary?
[Edited on 2-8-2023 by Bert]
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
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3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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Laboratory of Liptakov
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Has anyone tried the initiation properties of Bi2O3 + Al...? In a solid cavity...?...Or do only I have to try ..?...A like usually first in whole
world...?....
Development of primarily - secondary substances CHP (2015) Lithex (2022) Brightelite (2023) Nitrocelite (2024)
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MineMan
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bert | | Quote: Originally posted by MineMan |
But what about confined in a metal tube? I saw some mixture on Russian YouTube… that was similar and it DDT in the open. |
Both of the common lead oxides (litharge, minium) when used as oxidizers in pyrotechnic compositions or unthinkingly mixed with fuels in the lab have
surprised a few people with how violent they can be- I've no idea what you saw, could you find it and post WHAT the mixture was/what it did to make
you think it was a primary?
[Edited on 2-8-2023 by Bert] |
I cannot. It was a bismuth based thermite. Nonetheless those tend to be sensitive. Obvious step would be mixing with ammonium perchlorate. Anyways, I
have yet to find anything that is better than my nano mixtures except some stuff explosive laboratories did with partially nitrated organics mixed
with Iodates. I was not able to duplicate. Ammonium perchlorate and aluminum is still in my mind the safest DDT mixtures. I have seen detonation with
only micron aluminum in the correct ratios. But nano is really needed, although low order detonations of these mixtures will kick secondaries, period.
Even flash will set off ANNMAL mixtures with full force.
People miss the forest for the trees in these DDT mixtures. Either use flash, or use a very engineered nano mixture.
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MineMan
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Mix it with ammonium perchlorate, we need some gas generation. Yes. You do )
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Bert
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Anecdotally, have NOT tried this- I prefer not to use lead in fireworks mixtures:
Red thermite (lead tetroxide/elemental silicon) is pretty shock sensitive, made with fine enough mesh ingredients, explodes rather than burns.
Might this be what the Russian YouTube guys were playing with?
I think there is some Bismuth oxide around here, was looking at the non lead dragon eggs mixture years ago but then got too busy, then I got licensed
and REALLY got too busy, stored it away and never made any crackle with it.
I recall the bismuth oxide dragons egg mixture calling for a few % of black copper oxide as well. I think I found that one published in a PGI
Bulletin, perhaps 20 years back. Where DOES the time go?
[Edited on 2-9-2023 by Bert]
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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MineMan
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bert | Anecdotally, have NOT tried this- I prefer not to use lead in fireworks mixtures:
Red thermite (lead tetroxide/elemental silicon) is pretty shock sensitive, made with fine enough mesh ingredients, explodes rather than burns.
Might this be what the Russian YouTube guys were playing with?
I think there is some Bismuth oxide around here, was looking at the non lead dragon eggs mixture years ago but then got too busy, then I got licensed
and REALLY got too busy, stored it away and never made any crackle with it.
I recall the bismuth oxide dragons egg mixture calling for a few % of black copper oxide as well. I think I found that one published in a PGI
Bulletin, perhaps 20 years back. Where DOES the time go?
[Edited on 2-9-2023 by Bert] |
May have been copper oxide, bismuth oxide and magnesium. I can’t remember. All these thermites are too sensitive. Nano thermites were the rage…
till we realized they are more sensitive than primaries. It’s hard to beat wax coated aminoguanidine nickel perchlorate. There are exotic
insensitive primaries that are immune to friction and impact (more so then PETN ). But they are exotic. Anyways. The issue with primaries is one batch
may go off with a tap another won’t start all. Nano engineered ammonium perchlorate mixtures are, something else. It’s an engineering marvel.
Burns like a sparkler, cannot catch in the open but ddt confined what other
primary self extinguishes in the open???
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Herr Haber
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| Quote: Originally posted by Bert |
I recall the bismuth oxide dragons egg mixture calling for a few % of black copper oxide as well. I think I found that one published in a PGI
Bulletin, perhaps 20 years back. Where DOES the time go?
[Edited on 2-9-2023 by Bert] |
Doesnt seem to be any copper in those.
I crushed a couple of them, added a few others full in a bit of water then added a few drops of H2SO4.
Initially there were a lot of bubbles, a cloudy suspension I attributed to Al or Bi2O3 reacting with the acid but no blue.
The spirit of adventure was upon me. Having nitric acid and copper, I had only to learn what the words 'act upon' meant. - Ira Remsen
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Raid
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If you don't have metal or aluminum tubing to make det-caps I have a solution and it's much cheaper.
get some 1/4 inch vinyl tubing, the stuff that I got was called rain-drop tubing or something like that.
next, you're going to cut off around 3-4 inches of the tube.
clamp one of the ends in a wrench and melt it with a lighter or something. While hot, press the end on some glass or a metal pan to seal the end well.
now if you did everything correctly you should have a cheap yet well-functioning det-cap.
I like to fill the end with around 1cm of well-packed ETN and the rest with TATP or HMTD.
having the 1/4 inch tubing allows for little room between the edge of the tube and the fuse I was using.
I use the visco fuse from cannon-fuse.
if you're going to be using store-bought electric fuses then they should fit perfectly with little to no room.
however if your going to be using DIY eclectic fuses your going to have to make them quite small to be able to fit in the tubing.
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Bert
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I believe this is the mixture I'm recalling.
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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Bert
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| Quote: Originally posted by Raid | If you don't have metal or aluminum tubing to make det-caps I have a solution and it's much cheaper.
get some 1/4 inch vinyl tubing, the stuff that I got was called rain-drop tubing or something like that.
next, you're going to cut off around 3-4 inches of the tube.
clamp one of the ends in a wrench and melt it with a lighter or something. While hot, press the end on some glass or a metal pan to seal the end well.
now if you did everything correctly you should have a cheap yet well-functioning det-cap.
I like to fill the end with around 1cm of well-packed ETN and the rest with TATP or HMTD.
having the 1/4 inch tubing allows for little room between the edge of the tube and the fuse I was using.
I use the visco fuse from cannon-fuse.
if you're going to be using store-bought electric fuses then they should fit perfectly with little to no room.
however if your going to be using DIY eclectic fuses your going to have to make them quite small to be able to fit in the tubing.
|
Yup, your ban is over and name isn't "PINKBOII" any more.
I strongly suggest you do not play with explosives, above and beyond that, I suggest you (and everyone else) never play with explosive organic
peroxides.
Why not?
https://youtu.be/0Et-fyyBqyE
That kind of thing seems to happen to people who make organic peroxides. A lot.
[Edited on 2-9-2023 by Bert]
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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Raid
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I don't "play" with them. I only use it because its cost effective.
I've also seen that video before, I feel bad for the guy.
[Edited on 9-2-2023 by Raid]
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mayko
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"penny wise and pound foolish" seems an understatement here.
al-khemie is not a terrorist organization
"Chemicals, chemicals... I need chemicals!" - George Hayduke
"Wubbalubba dub-dub!" - Rick Sanchez
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Microtek
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I agree. If you are serious about experimenting with energetics, you should transition to more predictable primaries as soon as possible. I'm sure
many of us have started out with peroxides, but those of us that are still around quit them long ago.
The economic aspect is only relevant if you use them for other things than just primaries and if that is the case, you are almost certainly going to
kill yourself with it.
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Raid
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I use NHN now, much better and safer.
although when I make organic peroxides they seem to be much less friction and shock sensitive than what people on YouTube make.
[Edited on 10-2-2023 by Raid]
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Microtek
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Yes, peroxides are not necessarily extremely sensitive, the problem is the unpredictability. TATP, for instance, can sublimate and grow more
sensitive, large crystals in whatever container you store it in. In the threads of a screw-on cap maybe...
It is good to hear that you have switched to NHN, that is an excellent choice.
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Raid
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yeah, I've heard about TATP detonating due to the sublimation of it on a screw-cap. Luckily I have never had the problem, probably because I don't use
screw caps, I only use plastic bags.
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Bert
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Raid, what is the outdoors temperature where you are at right now?
| Quote: Originally posted by Raid | | Luckily I have never had the problem, probably because I don't use screw caps, I only use plastic bags. |
Non static plastic bags, of course. In a sufficiently humid environment, with ESD protection bleeds through a hefty resistor to ensure any generated
potentials dissipate slowly.
You DO know about primary explosives sensitivity to explosions from electrostatic discharge (ESD), of course. And can post here a table (or SEVERAL
tables) showing the joules/uf@kV of ESD capable of causing common primary explosives to explode. In some cases, the energy required to cause an
explosion wouldn't even be noticed by you if you if a spark with that energy discharged from your fingertip to a grounded surface.
That information is on this site and in many other places. I'm sure you will research it and post it to this thread by tomorrow.
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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Laboratory of Liptakov
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| Quote: | Every year, several thousand researchers grow up in the world. Of these, several hundred will visit sciencemadness. Of these, most follow the advice
and experience of the wise. And of these, several individuals do not follow anything at all. And they show off in front of others as brave young male
monkeys.
Conclusion: I am convinced that we are descended from apes. |
No arguement here-
https://youtu.be/aRHqs8SffDo
[Edited on 2-12-2023 by Bert]
Development of primarily - secondary substances CHP (2015) Lithex (2022) Brightelite (2023) Nitrocelite (2024)
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Bert
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| Quote: | Yeah, I know about ESD. and to counter that I store in a ESD proof bag I got when I built my PC.
and the temp where I live is around 0-30 ish |
°F or °C? Always specify units... Around here, SI units would be best.
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Great! I am pleased that you know all the answers, it must be an impressively large anti static bag for you to climb inside and fabricate/test your
detonators.
Tommorow I will look for your post on relative ESD sensitivities of a range of primary and secondary explosives. Including some typical values for
charges developed by a human body under various conditions of temperature and humidity while conducting various activities...
[Edited on 2-12-2023 by Bert]
Rapopart’s Rules for critical commentary:
1. Attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly and fairly that your target says: “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it
that way.”
2. List any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. Mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
Anatol Rapoport was a Russian-born American mathematical psychologist (1911-2007).
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