Sciencemadness Discussion Board
Not logged in [Login ]
Go To Bottom

Printable Version  
Author: Subject: 40% to 30%
Berrilium
Harmless
*




Posts: 46
Registered: 31-3-2012
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 09:44
40% to 30%


I have 40% H202 and want to get it to 30%

Would it be right to go

40/100+x = 30/100

x = 1000/30

X = 33

So i add 33ml of water and I'm good to go.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
adamsium
Hazard to Others
***




Posts: 180
Registered: 9-4-2012
Location: \ƚooɿ\
Member Is Offline

Mood: uprooting

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 10:05


You would add 33.33mL, yes.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Nicodem
Super Moderator
*******




Posts: 4230
Registered: 28-12-2004
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 10:14


I wonder if someone so incompetent that can not do such basic mathematics, should be doing HMTD with 40% H2O2. You better do some reading and learning while you still have all the fingers. Meanwhile do some more constructive experiments and leave the destructiveness on hold. Either that, or trust adamsium who cares about your fingers as much as you do.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Berrilium
Harmless
*




Posts: 46
Registered: 31-3-2012
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 10:17


Wouldn't you say that I couldn't do basic maths if I had got it wrong? And in any case how would that be a measure of Incompetence?
View user's profile View All Posts By User
adamsium
Hazard to Others
***




Posts: 180
Registered: 9-4-2012
Location: \ƚooɿ\
Member Is Offline

Mood: uprooting

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 10:43


Quote: Originally posted by Nicodem  
I wonder if someone so incompetent that can not do such basic mathematics, should be doing HMTD with 40% H2O2. You better do some reading and learning while you still have all the fingers. Meanwhile do some more constructive experiments and leave the destructiveness on hold. Either that, or trust adamsium who cares about your fingers as much as you do.


Actually, I totally agree, Nicodem. I thought it odd that someone would even have 40% hydrogen peroxide lying around, but just answered the question as asked. I guess that was my mistake.

Berrilium, you really ought to rethink attempts to make such compounds. If you genuinely want to learn chemistry, there are far safer *and* more interesting ways to do it than by blowing things up.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Hexavalent
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 1564
Registered: 29-12-2011
Location: Wales, UK
Member Is Offline

Mood: Pericyclic

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 10:44


Again, Nicodem, you seem rude. Berrilium had got the correct answer and just wanted to verify it here. He clearly can do 'such basic mathematics' and I am certain that he is a safe, responsible worker.



"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." Winston Churchill
View user's profile View All Posts By User
DJF90
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 2266
Registered: 15-12-2007
Location: At the bench
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 10:59


Quote: Originally posted by Hexavalent  
Again, Nicodem, you seem rude...
...I am certain that he is a safe, responsible worker.


Safe and responsible in the way that you were going to make a relatively large quantity of TATP? Don't make me laugh kid. Nicodem is right to take a stern tone with this kewl, and hopefully it is enough to prevent the OP from making a tradgedy of themselves.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Hexavalent
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 1564
Registered: 29-12-2011
Location: Wales, UK
Member Is Offline

Mood: Pericyclic

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:06


I discarded my plans to make any TATP, and if you'd bothered to read my posts correctly, my intentions were to make a very, very small amount - 50 miligrams at most, perhaps - and run the reaction in a small test tube cooled with copious amounts of ice, whilst working in a fume cupboard, behind a blast screen, wearing full PPE.

I appreciate Nicodem's concerns, but calling someone 'incompetent' is not usually needed. I have no intentions of putting myself forward, making people laugh etc....if I had, I'd have recommended you visit this thread.



[Edited on 12-6-2012 by Hexavalent]




"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." Winston Churchill
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Berrilium
Harmless
*




Posts: 46
Registered: 31-3-2012
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:10


I am not a kewl, and like Hexavalent said I was just seeking verification. In any case why do you care if I lose my fingers and I doubt one gram of HMTD will do such damage unless it is confined and held between your fingers, something a "kewl"would do.

Why do so many of you become so stern and confrontational as soon as anyone mentions engergetic compounds. It is so refreshing to see someone on these sites who doesn't regard others on the internet as inferior and as a complete retard.

I intend to make a small quantity of Hexamethylene Triperoxide Diamine to test the sensitvity on different surfaces, sensitivity to static. Yields gained using different concentrations. And contrary to popular belief I do not intend on making "big boomz" or "blowing shit up"

Sorry if I have offended any of you self appointed safety supervisors.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Nicodem
Super Moderator
*******




Posts: 4230
Registered: 28-12-2004
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:22


Quote: Originally posted by Hexavalent  
Berrilium had got the correct answer and just wanted to verify it here. He clearly can do 'such basic mathematics' and I am certain that he is a safe, responsible worker.

Got the correct answer? Really?
As I see it, either he got the question wrong, because he does not state the volume of the hydrogen peroxide, or he got the answer wrong if the volume is implied to be 1 L. So, you feel competent enough to accuse me of being rude?
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Hexavalent
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 1564
Registered: 29-12-2011
Location: Wales, UK
Member Is Offline

Mood: Pericyclic

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:25


Whilst I understand that he was not *technically* correct, I think we all could figure out what he meant.

How about we stop this childish arguing and resume technical conversations, as this forum is meant for?




"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." Winston Churchill
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Berrilium
Harmless
*




Posts: 46
Registered: 31-3-2012
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:36


Yes, you got me there, I was actually planning on using 100 litres of H202.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
adamsium
Hazard to Others
***




Posts: 180
Registered: 9-4-2012
Location: \ƚooɿ\
Member Is Offline

Mood: uprooting

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:38


I don't think that not wanting to see someone who clearly doesn't have the experience with chemistry injure themselves is at all rude.

There's a good reason that even most experienced chemists with a well equipped, professional lab at their disposal don't play with these compounds, nor would they ever dream of allowing us to make it at uni, and I wouldn't make it if they did allow us to - and I'm far from being 'chemophobic', but I am rather partial to having my limbs where they are. A chemistry student at my (early) level (actually, at any level) doesn't have the requisite experience to make such things, and, it's clear that anyone who is uncertain of a calculation for a simple dilution could not have passed a basic 1st year chem course, hence there is absolutely no way the OP is 'qualified' to do this.

I also fail to see what could be learned from or about compounds like this in an amateur setting, so it is quite difficult not to apply the 'kewl' label here. I hope that the OP can find some genuinely interesting chemistry to learn safely.

As for the calculation, Nicodem is right again. I'd assumed a volume of 100mL, based on the figures given, and meant to write this. After I realised what it was all about, I didn't worry about correcting anything.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Berrilium
Harmless
*




Posts: 46
Registered: 31-3-2012
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:41


So you genuinely care about my health? I find it difficult to believe that.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Hexavalent
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 1564
Registered: 29-12-2011
Location: Wales, UK
Member Is Offline

Mood: Pericyclic

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:44


We are. Someone losing their limbs or being killed (it is believed that an amateur chemist just like us killed himself at age 16 by doing something with hydrazine without proper safety or precautions) will be highly detrimental to the future of our hobby. Someone gets injured and the chemophobia just gets worse.



"Success is going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm." Winston Churchill
View user's profile View All Posts By User
adamsium
Hazard to Others
***




Posts: 180
Registered: 9-4-2012
Location: \ƚooɿ\
Member Is Offline

Mood: uprooting

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:46


Quote: Originally posted by Berrilium  
So you genuinely care about my health? I find it difficult to believe that.


Honestly? No, not particularly. You asked.

Still, I'd rather not see people being injured in such an unnecessary and absolutely avoidable way.

If you genuinely want to learn chemistry, there are far better options. You know this, though. If learning chemistry is not the aim, but flashes and bangs are, the kewl label fits well. I feel like a broken record here...

Best of luck with your endeavours.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
Berrilium
Harmless
*




Posts: 46
Registered: 31-3-2012
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 11:48


Well, I can assure you all that I will not sustain any injuries nor will I injure others. I don't want to blow shit up. I am more interested in the actual science of it.
View user's profile View All Posts By User
DJF90
International Hazard
*****




Posts: 2266
Registered: 15-12-2007
Location: At the bench
Member Is Offline

Mood: No Mood

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 14:54


Quote: Originally posted by Hexavalent  
I discarded my plans to make any TATP, and if you'd bothered to read my posts correctly, my intentions were to make a very, very small amount - 50 miligrams at most...
[Edited on 12-6-2012 by Hexavalent]


The way I recall it, you made the small quantity and it was your dad who stopped you from making the relatively large amount. I would direct you to the thread but you conveniently deleted your original post so whats the point.
As Nicodem states, we don't know what volume he was intending on diluting and so there was no "correct answer". If berrilium were a competent chemist he wouldnt need to verify his "simple calculation" with us, would he?
View user's profile View All Posts By User
woelen
Super Administrator
*********




Posts: 7805
Registered: 20-8-2005
Location: Netherlands
Member Is Offline

Mood: interested

[*] posted on 12-6-2012 at 23:39


Please stop quarreling about someone's competence or incompetence. It's not worth your time and the forum's bandwidth.

I understand all of you and I see both sides of the coin. We should be concerned about safety and we should act reasonably and not blow things up or maim ourselves. That's obvious. On the other hand, I once was fascinated by energetics as well. I really was impressed at high school when we started getting chemistry (first time was at age 14) and the first domonstration we got was the outside burning of a decently sized pile of mix of KClO3 and sulphur (carefully mixed with a feather). I was hooked at once! As a 16 year old boy I made small rockets of KNO3 and powdered sugar (they never got higher than a few meters though :P ).
So, I understand the interest in energetics, especially in younger people or people just starting with chemistry. I do not want to say that people should stop with this kind of experiments, but they have to know about the risks.
On my website you also can find a few experiments, involving energetics (such as making silver acetylide, ammonium bromate, ammonium periodate, mixing red P with KClO4, making Mn2O7). No one can deny that it is this kind of things which many people find fascinating. I just want to add that only very small quantities should be made and for true energetics (high explosives) 1 gram is too much. A gram can destroy parts of your hand, it can send shrapnel all over the place. Think of 100 mg at most, and even that can hurt. Do not store the energetic compounds, make them and use them up in experiments, preferrably the same day or the next day after one day of drying.

A serious issue of course is the lack of experience and knowledge with (mostly) young people who mix up energetic chemicals. Especially in energetics there is a high inherent risk and this does not combine very well with over-enthusiastic experimenting without real thought. For this reason I really want to ask people to think over their experiments twice or thrice before conducting them. Understand me well, I do not say you should not do the experiments, but think and rethink before you do and also think about what might go wrong and how you could handle the situation if the "might go wrong" changes to "goes wrong". The really enthusiastic person does not only mix chemicals and experiment, but also tries to build up a theoretical understanding and some fluency in calculations. From personal experience I can say that understanding makes things even more interesting and the initial 'wow' (which is very volatile) then changes to a more deep wondering about the endless possibilities and the freedom it gives in designing experiments yourself to test your understanding and expand your understanding.

[Edited on 13-6-12 by woelen]




The art of wondering makes life worth living...
Want to wonder? Look at https://woelen.homescience.net
View user's profile Visit user's homepage View All Posts By User

  Go To Top