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Author: Subject: magnitude of the particle in chemistry
freedomwm
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shocked.gif posted on 20-12-2004 at 00:24
magnitude of the particle in chemistry


Now I have a question to ask all of you for help. I want to mix three kinds of chemicals equally. Then the three kinds of chemicals are partical in shape . So I want to ask how much the diameter of the particle is. Then in this diameter I can mix these particals equally.
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Joeychemist
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[*] posted on 20-12-2004 at 00:40
What are you talking about???


Do you mean you want to know how to calculate the volume and density of these 3 different chemicals so you can mix them in equal proportions, or may be something along those lines???Because all I can understand from you're post is something about mixing three different chemicals together, then after that it seems like you’re speaking nonsense:D

[Edited on 20-12-2004 by Joeychemist]
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freedomwm
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thumbup.gif posted on 20-12-2004 at 01:42
about the particle


sorry , I haven't express my mean clearly.
I want to mix the three chemicals uniformily. Then the diametre of the three chemicals should reach small enough. So I ask you the question . what is the diameter should the particle ? Then I ask you the diameter . ok? thank you for your advice.
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HNO3
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[*] posted on 20-12-2004 at 16:44


What chems are you mixing? What reaction is this for?:)



\"In the beginning, God...\" Wait a minute, God doesn\'t exist!!!!!!!!!! \"OK, in the beginning, ummm, hydrogen...\" Wait a minute, what about the laws of thermodynamics? \"OK, in the beginning, ummm.....UMMMMM, what\'s left to choose from?
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freedomwm
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[*] posted on 20-12-2004 at 17:44
about the particle


first ,thank you for help!
There's none reaction between the three chemicals . One of the three is sodium hydroxide. the other one is EDTA4Na.2H2O. and the last one is sodium grape sugar.
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[*] posted on 21-12-2004 at 10:23


IIRC grape sugar (glucose) decomposes in strong alkali to give carbon monoxide.
I realise that this has nothing to do with the question, but it might stop you gassing yourself.
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freedomwm
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[*] posted on 21-12-2004 at 18:42
about the particle


I have to explain the whole thing . One of the three is sodium hydroxide , the other one is EDTA4Na, and the last one is sodium gluconate .Three of them are sodium salt . Three chemicals in my hand are all powder or small crystal. So I want to mix them together equally . In my opinion ,there is none reaction between them. But if there is some reaction between them(if you know),please tell me . Thank you.
Then whether I have to make the powder and the crystal small enough to mix the equally.
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HNO3
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[*] posted on 21-12-2004 at 20:26


"mix them together equally"
Equal weight?
Equal moles?
Equal particle size?
Please pardon my confusion. :(
PS Its 'no' not 'none' as in There is no reaction between them.;)




\"In the beginning, God...\" Wait a minute, God doesn\'t exist!!!!!!!!!! \"OK, in the beginning, ummm, hydrogen...\" Wait a minute, what about the laws of thermodynamics? \"OK, in the beginning, ummm.....UMMMMM, what\'s left to choose from?
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freedomwm
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[*] posted on 21-12-2004 at 21:22
about the particle


I am so sorry . "mix them together equally" mean when taking any part and any quantity of the mixture , I can achieve them at the percent I mix them at the beginning.
and there is no reaction between them.
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Joeychemist
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sad.gif posted on 21-12-2004 at 21:50
???


Nope, still don’t understand you man. Just flat out say one of the following three then we’ll go from there. Ok. You want to mix them together equally by;
Equal weight?
Equal moles?
Equal particle size?
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[*] posted on 22-12-2004 at 09:56


So you want it to be a homogenous mixture? You don't care about weight, moles, particle size, etc?



\"In the beginning, God...\" Wait a minute, God doesn\'t exist!!!!!!!!!! \"OK, in the beginning, ummm, hydrogen...\" Wait a minute, what about the laws of thermodynamics? \"OK, in the beginning, ummm.....UMMMMM, what\'s left to choose from?
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[*] posted on 22-12-2004 at 11:58


What I take from this is that he wants to know how small he has to grind his chemicals, in order to ensure that that any sample he takes from the mixture will have the same composition. ie, how small do they have to be to make the mixture homogenous.

If so, it is an impossible question to answer. If you take one particle out of the mix, then that one particle can not be all of the compounds, so it will not be the same as every other particle. Basically you need to know the minimum size of the sample, and how homogenous it has to be.

And even then, there is a chance that after you mix it, even for days, that it will be nowhere close to mixed. It is theoretically possible for you to end up with all the bits of compound A to end up in the left top corner of your container :D. So, there is a probability aspect to it too.

Given all that, if you told me all the information, I would have no idea how to find an answer :(.




"Our interest's on the dangerous side of things" -- Browning
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[*] posted on 22-12-2004 at 17:41
about the particle


thank you all for your help:P,
The sample I take from the mixture is of course more than thousands of particles . So that I can gain the mixture consist of the characters of the three chemicals .
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[*] posted on 22-12-2004 at 17:45
about the particle


Yes , I don't care about the weight ,the moles, particle size.
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The_Tsar_Bomba
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[*] posted on 22-12-2004 at 17:52


Man, Just clearly tell use what your doing and maybe we can help!
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Joeychemist
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[*] posted on 22-12-2004 at 18:09
Maybe???


Ok, I think I might know what you’re saying now,But lets make sure, correct me if I’m wrong.

You want to mix three powder chemicals together as equally distributed in the mix as possible.(as close to a homogenous mixture as possible).The mix will of course still be an heterogeneous mix but you just want to mix these powders with almost every particle evenly spaced from the others?

We are all try to help you but you really need to clean up you're english.;)
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[*] posted on 23-12-2004 at 04:03


My take on it is that he wants to know how small to make each particle so they mix as evenly as possible, forming the closest to a homogenous mixture as he can.

I'm just curious... whats the mixture for?

EDIT: oops, i just realized Oxydro said roughly the same thing... i was skimming through this too fast... my mistake :D

[Edited on 23-12-2004 by cyclonite4]




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[*] posted on 19-12-2005 at 08:47


Hmm - sorry to drag this up as it's an old thread, but I found it amusing reading... ;)


Anyway - (if it's still relavent) - What about just grinding it all up in a mortar and pestle?

[Edited on 19-12-2005 by DrP]
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[*] posted on 19-12-2005 at 14:31


Ball milling is used for gunpowder manufacture. You start with three separate powders, mill for a while, and end up with a very finely mixed powder. I will admit that this does have something to do with the porous structure of the charcoal used, but it should work for this nonetheless.

[Edited on 19-12-2005 by neutrino]
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[*] posted on 20-12-2005 at 10:51


I don't expect that will work well if one of the ingredients is NaOH. That is VERY hygroscopic and soon you'll have a nasty and sticky mess.



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[*] posted on 20-12-2005 at 14:33


Many ball mills are air and water-tight. I suppose this is to prevent dusts from flying around, igniting, and flashing back to the mill.

If the cylinder is sealed in an inert atmosphere, you shouldn't have much of a problem.
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