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Quince
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 09:26
Ouch, Canada


http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2006/12/08/toxic-chemicals.ht...
So long, OTC sources...




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Darkblade48
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 09:54


:( The problem is that it doesn't specifically say what chemicals will be targetted. By saying "toxic", it could refer to any number of chemicals that are available OTC. Engine degreasers often have NaOH in them, so would they be considered toxic? Drain cleaners, too, contain NaOH or sulfuric acid, so I guess I'll have to start stocking up on them.

It's likely that even mundane hydrogen peroxide will be taken off, since it could potentitally be used to make *gasp* acetone peroxide (along with acetone, which I imagine would be taken off the shelves too).

Frankly, I believe the level of paranoia in Canada is starting to become excessive and exaggerated, to the point that it'll create fear. We might as well be creating a generation of kids that are so afraid of chemicals that they'll stay inside their homes.

[Edited on 12-9-2006 by Darkblade48]
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 12:01


In the US the kids already are secured in their homes where they watch flims, play video games, IM each other, and eat junk food. This makes their soccermoms feel comfortable as no perverts can get them. But they won't be breathing better air as it is well known that inside air is much more contaminated that fresh outside air.



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The_Davster
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 12:12


*sigh* I read this in the paper this morning, was going to post it as well. I am worried about which particular ones that are going to be the ones targeted. Time to buy certain things I guess...:(

Legislation targeting concentrated peroxide has been in the works for quite some time now. The new laws might even remove the 3% stuff unfortunatly.

I wonder how many laws us Canadians are in violation for our labs under such legislation?:mad:

Fascist cocksuckers

I swear, I am so close to running for political office...:o




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Quince
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 13:07


LOL, I voted for Harper.



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The_Davster
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 13:08


:( So did I:(



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S.C. Wack
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 14:16


It's been obvious for some time that your country is overly fond of regulation and this will only get worse. It's not like it's going to stop with this. Sadly this can be said of everywhere else.
http://www.chemicalsubstanceschimiques.gc.ca/challenge-defi/...

"The comment period will be six months. Following this period, government scientists will review the information provided. The Government of Canada will then decide what actions are taken."

Some of the simple things that I found most interesting:

lots of basic industrial chems and consumer product solvents
naphthalene
nitromethane
toluene diisocyanate (goodbye polyurethane foam industry!)
catechol
hydroquinone
methyl chloride
formamide
dimethyl and diethyl sulfate
methyl eugenol
butane
isobutane
hexane
dioxane
hydrazine
Sb2O3
V2O5
C
Co
CoCl2
CoBr2
CoSO4
SiO2
KBrO3
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woelen
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 14:29


In the Netherlands we have had such a wave of tightening rules for chemicals in the 1990's and at the end of the 1980's. But surprisingly the impact of those rules on availability of reagents was not very high.

This kind of regulations affected all kinds of consumer products (and still is affecting them), but niche-uses were not affected. E.g. hydroquinone still is available, because it is used in photo-developers by a small niche group. The same is true for something like Sb2O3 and V2O5, which are used by hobby ceramics people. In main-stream pottery, ceramics, and other household items, however, Sb2O3 is hardly used anymore. Only a few chemicals were really affected, such as CCl4 and CHCl=CCl2, which were widely available for degreasing purposes and now are hard to obtain.

So, I expect that these new rules in Canada will lead to 'cleaner' household and comsumer items, but the (small) hobby market hardly will be affected. You still can obtain your chems, but you may need to be looking a little harder.

What we have seen here, is that the multi-tonne usage of certain toxic and harmful chemicals has been abandoned, while at the same time, the small quantities, used in the hobby-place hardly have been affected. Those few kilo's which are used by the hobbyists are not of a real concern.

What is much more harmful to us home-chemists is the attitude of the general public. This kind of regulation makes each chemical sound evil in the ears of the general public. That does irk me, even if the chem itself still is available.

[Edited on 9-12-06 by woelen]




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Quince
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 14:39


It's obvious that some of these items will not be affected due to common usage:

Quote:
Originally posted by S.C. Wack
naphthalene

Mothballs. There are at least two alternatives sold in stores here, but they all have similar toxicity.

Quote:
nitromethane

Glow fuel for model aircraft/boats/cars always contains this, and the RC model people will raise a huge racket.

Quote:
butane

Torch lighters.

Quote:
hexane

So now K2r will be illegal? Great, I'll have to pay for the dry cleaner...

As for
Quote:
hydrazine

What consumer products contain hydrazine?

Quote:
C

They'll forbid carbon?

Quote:
SiO2

They'll forbid sand and glass?




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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 15:35


A salt of Hydrazine(HCl I believe) is used in solder fluxs.
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Quince
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 16:22


For a moment there I thought you meant hydrogen chloride...



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S.C. Wack
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 16:34


Quote:
Originally posted by Quince
It's obvious that some of these items will not be affected due to common usage


It's obvious that the gov't is giving the impression that it doesn't care, given the quotes in the article and wording like "The Government of Canada will be taking immediate action on five substance categories confirmed to be harmful to the environment and to human health in the long run, moving toward prohibiting most uses. Industry recognizes the necessity of these actions and in many cases has been moving to find solutions. The Government of Canada will also be establishing the Virtual Elimination List under the Canadian Environmental Protection Act, 1999 (CEPA 1999) and adding the first substances to that list."
How it comes out for real is anyones guess of course. The big list:
http://www.ec.gc.ca/CEPARegistry/subs_list/dsl/DSLsearch.cfm...

[Edited on 10-12-2006 by S.C. Wack]
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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 17:34


Some weird ones:
silver bullion
erbium oxide
ammonium perchlorate
calcium ammonium nitrate
deuterated sulfuric
NaPdCl4
zinc ammonium sulfate
thorium nitrate
lanthanum
lead
lithium
lutetium
Mn
Ni (hehe our nickels are made out of nickel)
Hg
zinc hydroxide
copper hydroxide
iodine
alkali chloroplatinates
ammonium hexachloirridate
ammonium chloride
ammonium fluoride
nickel hydroxide
deuterium
PtCl4
cerrous sulfate
naptha
asphalt :P
silver sulfide
rhodium hydroxide
HgO
HgS
lithium azide
zinc nitrate
zinc sulfate
silver nitrate
copper sulfate:o
cuprous chloride
ammonium sulfamate
sodium chlorate
yttrium fluoride
vanadate
calcium nitrate
GdCl3
HoCl3
gold chloride
TiO2
Ag2O
alum
Ce(OH)3
Ba(OH)2
silver
bismuth carbonate
copper acetate
talc
quartz
NdCl3
lead azide
P2O5
ZnS
ammonium nitrate
tin
scandium oxide
BaCl2
boric acid
hydroxylamine sulfate
NaNO3
NaNO2
HCl
PdCl2
KI
NaOCl :P
NaI
HNO3
BaSo4
PbO
ammonium acid fluoride
borax
toluene
resorcinol
NaCN
ethanol
acetic acid
methanol
NaN3
chloroalkanes
petroleum distillates


After reading this...methinks this will have less effect on us as I feared initially. Much to broad of a scope. I think there may be some hidden agenda here...with AN and calcium ammonium nitrate being on that list.




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[*] posted on 9-12-2006 at 19:10


Well for those who voted for Harper: no comment, you did know that this would happen anyway

And by seeing the list of the chemical, I'm not sure if it'll have an impact at all, it seem that they simply made list of some chemicals which can be considered hazardous for health and are more or less common in everyday life. They'll probably make a 10 years study on each of those and make some recommandations which will prolly get lost when the conservator are replaced.




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[*] posted on 10-12-2006 at 01:45


Quote:
Originally posted by The_Davster
Some weird ones:
silver bullion

Price of silver will go up!
Quote:

deuterated sulfuric

You can buy deuterated sulfuric acid?
Quote:

Ni (hehe our nickels are made out of nickel)

Apparently, it's time to ban nickels
Quote:

asphalt :P

And roads, apparently. Maybe we'll have flying cars soon?
Quote:

TiO2

This is the white pigment used in urinals and hospitals. It's supposed to have antiseptic properties, and they're planning to get rid of it?
Quote:

talc

Babies will have itchy bums and serious cases of diaper rash
Quote:

quartz

How do they plan to regulate this? Are they going to go to beaches and comb through all the sand? What a good use of the taxpayer's money
Quote:

NaOCl :P

:P
Quote:

borax

Isn't this harmless
Quote:

ethanol

Ban booze! The entire country will throw a big fit
Quote:

acetic acid

Banning vinegar too
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[*] posted on 10-12-2006 at 10:12


Once the big business realizes they're going to suffer from this, the government will have to back off. Economics still precedes everything else.



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Quince
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[*] posted on 10-12-2006 at 19:31


Quote:
Originally posted by vulture
Economics still precedes everything else.

Thank goodness for that.




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