BILLBUILDS
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differences and similarities between LiAlH4 and NaBH4
Ive got a fair amount of NaBH4 but all the synthesis require LiAlH4. when can i use sodium borahydride instead of lithium aluminium hydride and how
much does it really matter.
just for example when reading these synthesis how much of a difference would it make. am i going to have to shell out $800 instead of using my sodium borahydride.
and for haters out there there are a lot of reaction to learn from shulgin, i am not suggesting i am going to synthesise anything illegal.
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laserlisa
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So you want to make tryptamines by the "Speeter Anthony" route?
Then you need to recude amides, and plain NaBH4 is not capable of that.
[Edited on 17-3-2017 by laserlisa]
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PirateDocBrown
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Well, the usual reduction ladder is carboxylic acids > carbonyls > alcohols > alkanes.
But carboxylic acids are quite resistant to reduction, and NaBH4 is not normally strong enough to kick it to carbonyl. Borohydride can normally make
the jump from carbonyl to alcohol.
If you are moving around nitrogen-containing materials, the rules will vary, of course.
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PirateDocBrown
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Have a peek at this, a good summary.
http://leah4sci.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Orgo-Oxidatio...
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Racconized
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You need to learn some chemistry before try making drugs, you clearly only read drug recipes and not chemistry books. Just because someone uses
reagent X, doesn't mean it's the only reagent suitable for that purpose. Anyhow AFAIK NabH4 isn't strong enought to reduce nitro groups(that is by
itself, of course ), however it will reduce the alkenes of the compounds you (I assume) have/want. Figure out the rest, no one here enjoys spoon
feeding cooks
[Edited on 17-3-2017 by Racconized]
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Melgar
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Look into borane/THF complex. It can be made from NaBH4 and THF, and it has similar, but not exactly the same, reduction power when compared to
LiAlH4. It also doesn't have the solubility issues that LiAlH4 does either, so typical reductions won't take a day or more like LiAlH4 reductions are
prone to do.
LiAlH4 is used a lot in laboratories though, because it supplies its own hydrogen, can (only) be used in solvents that are very unlikely to react with
the substrate, can reduce functional groups that very few other reagents can, and it's very predictable in what it does and doesn't reduce. NaBH4's
popularity comes from the fact that it can be used in more solvents, is easily modified to change its reductive ability, and is far less sensitive to
moisture. It's also quite a bit cheaper, likely due to the fewer precautions that need to be taken when shipping it.
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Amos
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Are we really haters, though? You've contributed nothing to the forum but bad grammar, bad manners, and a lot of pointless threads that are extremely
transparent in their purpose, which despite your claims, is to make drugs in the end. Multiple threads were about isolating or synthesizing safrole,
and now you're linking directly to syntheses from PiHKAL.
How in the world does someone that actually cares about the chemistry completely gloss over some of the most basic material covered in any organic
chemistry class and yet wind up looking through Shulgin's work? It's not exactly at the top of search engine results when you search things like
borohydride reduction.
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Nicodem
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Thread Moved
17-3-2017 at 09:52 |
BILLBUILDS
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Quote: Originally posted by Amos  | Are we really haters, though? You've contributed nothing to the forum but bad grammar, bad manners, and a lot of pointless threads that are extremely
transparent in their purpose, which despite your claims, is to make drugs in the end. Multiple threads were about isolating or synthesizing safrole,
and now you're linking directly to syntheses from PiHKAL.
How in the world does someone that actually cares about the chemistry completely gloss over some of the most basic material covered in any organic
chemistry class and yet wind up looking through Shulgin's work? It's not exactly at the top of search engine results when you search things like
borohydride reduction. |
yes i find drug chemistry interesting , i dont plant on ever making drugs and or do anything other than read. i never tried to make safrole. i tried
to make oil from a plant, have you ever tried to extract an oil from a plant? well then write it up so i can get some help doing mine. if i wanted
safrole i could easily get it but i have no intention of ever doing that.
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PirateDocBrown
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I extract oils from plants on a nearly daily basis. I use them to make cosmetics and toiletries.
Extraction isn't even "chemistry", per se. And yet you don't know how to do it? Clearly, you have no interest in the science, if you can't even be
bothered to pick up an undergraduate O-chem lab text. Spoon-feeding, indeed.
You are more than welcome to learn chemistry and talk about it, at any level. But try starting with operations that don't lead to psychoactive drugs,
if you want to build trust.
Drug chemistry IS interesting. How about something other than psychoactives? I'm looking at chloramphenicol. NurdRage is famous for going after
pyrimethamine. Pick a drug that doesn't get you high.
The world doesn't need any more Jesse Pinkmans.
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Tsjerk
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Do you know if there are places where these synthesis' are discussed? I had a quick look at chloramphenicol, but that looks like one hell of a
cracker... I'm interested though to give something like this a try as well.
[Edited on 19-3-2017 by Tsjerk]
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PirateDocBrown
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NurdRage has a whole series of videos about his synthesis.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLU79801KtVAU1XsTwHaKk...
I was so impressed, I'd like to do the same, with a different compound. I'm looking seriously at chloramphenicol.
First, I have to get a video camera...
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tsathoggua1
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Hades, if one had enough balls, one could even potentiallly reduce chloramphenicol to an absorbent. And just a point, anyone that can see more than
a foot in front of their front, do share. Its a pain in the arse being barely able to see things that aren't inches from one's front or do not go off
violently. As of now, I can just about make out Na being dropped into water.
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