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Author: Subject: Storing HNO3
Melgar
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[*] posted on 25-2-2010 at 15:44
Storing HNO3


Fuming HNO3 is incredibly useful, but I'm curious how that should be stored. IIRC, it's light sensitive, and I'm guessing it'd oxidize just about any polymer besides polyethylene and teflon. I was thinking of storing it in empty HOOH bottles, after first peeling off the label and clearly relabling it, although I suppose there's a good chance of it oxidizing the plastic liner of the bottle cap. I'll probably pull that out anyway, just so the bottle doesn't build up pressure for any reason.
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[*] posted on 25-2-2010 at 17:35


Iam storing 95% HNO3 for about a half year now, i did not noticeably decompose yet, just a faint yellow colour.
I keep it in an erlemeyer with a stop in a turned off fridge in the basement ( max 15 deg ).
Oke, the fridge smells like hell but it stores more/every acid I have :P
It's fine so far and i dont expect any problems.
Anyone?




What a fine day for chemistry this is.
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mnick12
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[*] posted on 25-2-2010 at 17:47


Ahh I am glad you asked this question!
I am glad for two reasons, the first being that I have tried a number of different ways and have found the best ones that don't cost an arm and a leg (like teflon bottles...). The second reason is I am glad you asked before you tried putting HNO3 in some unknown plastic, because this could hurt you and ruin your HNO3!

I have found two ways that work rather well and are very cheap. Both these methods require narrow mouth Amber Reagent bottles ( around 3.00 for a 500ml one), but you may use clear though your acid will likely decompose after time. For the first method take the stopper for the bottle(it should be ground glass) and wrap it with around 3 layers of PTFE tape, and... thats it! For the second method do the same thing but instead of PTFE tape use vaccum grease.

Notes: In my opinion both these methods work well, but you need to be careful of how many layers of PTFE tape you use since it can make so the stopper "float" on the rim of the bottle. Second thing is you must not fill the bottle more that 3/4 of the way! Also keep it in a fridge it will minimize light exposure and keep vaporization down. One thing that suprised me was a while ago I had 87mls of RFNA in a 500ml amber teflon-lined reagent bottle in the fridge, I took the acid out and unstoppered it but I noticed on the stopper there was HNO3 that had evaporated and condensed on stopper of the flask. Moral of the storry is just because it is cold does not mean it doesnt fume anymore.

Anyway I hope this helps, and if you want tomorrow I may be able to post a picture of the bottle so you get a clearer understanding.
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Melgar
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[*] posted on 25-2-2010 at 20:36


Quote: Originally posted by mnick12  
Ahh I am glad you asked this question!
I am glad for two reasons, the first being that I have tried a number of different ways and have found the best ones that don't cost an arm and a leg (like teflon bottles...). The second reason is I am glad you asked before you tried putting HNO3 in some unknown plastic, because this could hurt you and ruin your HNO3!

I have found two ways that work rather well and are very cheap. Both these methods require narrow mouth Amber Reagent bottles ( around 3.00 for a 500ml one), but you may use clear though your acid will likely decompose after time. For the first method take the stopper for the bottle(it should be ground glass) and wrap it with around 3 layers of PTFE tape, and... thats it! For the second method do the same thing but instead of PTFE tape use vaccum grease.

Notes: In my opinion both these methods work well, but you need to be careful of how many layers of PTFE tape you use since it can make so the stopper "float" on the rim of the bottle. Second thing is you must not fill the bottle more that 3/4 of the way! Also keep it in a fridge it will minimize light exposure and keep vaporization down. One thing that suprised me was a while ago I had 87mls of RFNA in a 500ml amber teflon-lined reagent bottle in the fridge, I took the acid out and unstoppered it but I noticed on the stopper there was HNO3 that had evaporated and condensed on stopper of the flask. Moral of the storry is just because it is cold does not mean it doesnt fume anymore.

Anyway I hope this helps, and if you want tomorrow I may be able to post a picture of the bottle so you get a clearer understanding.

Ah, I don't have any of this stuff, but thank you very much for the info. I did look up the compatibility tables for nitric acid, and learned that it is usually stored in HDPE or teflon containers. It'll corrode glass a little, but probably not enough to damage its integrity.

I'm still leaning toward storage in an empty peroxide bottle, because it's HDPE and also dark plastic, and because I just finished a bottle of peroxide. :P

Most of my chemicals I store in LDPE squeeze bottles, but for nitric acid I don't think I want to take a chance. Also, I'd have to buy a special refrigerator/freezer to put chemicals in, since I wouldn't want anyone else who lives in the house to try and figure out what's in it by taking a whiff. Reading labels is not something everyone here does consistently...

[Edited on 2/26/10 by Melgar]
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 26-2-2010 at 03:39


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http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=12358#...

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[*] posted on 26-2-2010 at 19:17


I recently bought 12 1000mL amber glass bottles with teflon lining, and I was guarenteed by the saleswoman that they could handle storage of conc. HNO3 no problem.

http://www.inglass.com/

plus it was pretty cheap, only like $25 IIRC. they have a $50 min order and with the shipping it was like $75
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mnick12
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[*] posted on 26-2-2010 at 19:43


Melgar:
HDPE will work just probably not for a long time, also be you may consider wrapping the rime of the peroxide bottle with some teflon tape. The reason why you would do this is I am fairly sure the seal inside the cap is some sort of plastic coated paper which will not hold up well to HNO3.

Also you mentioned that FNA might corrode glass a little, are you sure? Maybe you are thinking of HF or maybe if the glass is soda-lime, otherwise I am pretty sure glass should do fine.

Good luck though tell us how it goes since HDPE bottles are cheaper than glass ones.
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Melgar
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[*] posted on 27-2-2010 at 11:55


@hissingnoise - i don't get it...

@agorot - thanks for the link! I've been looking for something to store the more dangerous chemicals in. can you pour slowly with those bottles without dripping down the side?

@mnick12 - yeah, i pulled out the liner. true, it may leak if knocked over, and gas may slowly escape, but glass will break if you drop it on the hard floor so I suppose everything has its risks. I may move to glass though. I thought HNO3 corroded glass because it left a permanent mark on my borosilicate glassware. I guess there's a chance the marks were there already from NaOH, but I was pretty sure it was the HNO3 that did it.
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[*] posted on 27-2-2010 at 12:03


Quote:
I thought HNO3 corroded glass
I've used lab grade glass bottles, some Pyrex, some not, to store HNO3 for about 50 years now and have never noticed anything that I would call corrosion. That's what everybody used for many centuries before the invention of plastic. Just learn not to drop bottles of chemicals on the floor.

[Edited on 27-2-2010 by entropy51]
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[*] posted on 27-2-2010 at 18:40


I keep all of my high purity, high percentage HNO3 in clear good quality
borosilicate (Pyrex) glass flasks with ground glass joints TS24/40
and use Teflon sleeves from Wilmad Labglass, then store in the freezer of my lab refrigerator.

No fuming, no fuss, no problem.




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[*] posted on 27-2-2010 at 21:07


@meglar yes they do not drip down the sides either. very nice. the only thing is you have to be careful when ordering them. they asked me what company I was with and naturally I said I didn't have one. I said my "daughter" was doing a science fair project where we were testing the thermal conductivity of several different kinds of containers, and I bought some HDPE bottles and those amber glass ones. :D

might want to think up another situation though. be careful what you say. do your research.
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Melgar
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[*] posted on 4-3-2010 at 13:35


Quote: Originally posted by agorot  
@meglar yes they do not drip down the sides either. very nice. the only thing is you have to be careful when ordering them. they asked me what company I was with and naturally I said I didn't have one. I said my "daughter" was doing a science fair project where we were testing the thermal conductivity of several different kinds of containers, and I bought some HDPE bottles and those amber glass ones. :D

might want to think up another situation though. be careful what you say. do your research.

Yeah, I'd probably say I was using them to store photography chemicals or something. I heard nitric acid is explosive and should be stored in HDPE or PTFE, which is convenient because I have a HDPE peroxide bottle right here. I did pull out the liner and see if it dissolved in the nitric acid, and it was stained yellow but not dissolved. I left it out, and just put the cap on without the liner. I may order some of those bottles though, since sometimes when pouring really slowly, some of the acid will drip down the side. Just gotta make sure to hold it such that there's no way it'll touch my hand if it drips. I made the acid a few days ago, and it's still virtually colorless, so that's fortunate.
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hissingnoise
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[*] posted on 4-3-2010 at 15:49


Quote:
Just gotta make sure to hold it such that there's no way it'll touch my hand if it drips.

Yes, there are people who'll find bright yellow spots on your fingers somewhat unsightly.
And after a few days they'll itch and possibly even sting a bit. . .
A few small ones are no big deal, but rinse anyway!



[Edited on 4-3-2010 by hissingnoise]
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[*] posted on 4-3-2010 at 21:17


I put it in glass bottles in a fridge. Works for me.



We've been doing so much with so little for so long, we can do everything with nothing in no time at all.
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