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Author: Subject: Thickeners in cleaning solutions - what are they?
RogueRose
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 13:05
Thickeners in cleaning solutions - what are they?


I've used a number of cleaning solutions where the liquid is thicker than normal water and the active ingredient has a fluidity almost identical to water, so there must be something else in the solution. One example is toilet bowl cleaner. Active ingredient is HCl and nothing else is listed but the stuff comes out like a thin syrup (so it sticks to the bowl). I have looked at the MSDS of a number of these products and it doesn't list anything besides HCl.

Does anyone know what may be used to thicken this? Guar gum, Gum arabic, propylene glycol?
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NEMO-Chemistry
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 17:32


Quote: Originally posted by RogueRose  
I've used a number of cleaning solutions where the liquid is thicker than normal water and the active ingredient has a fluidity almost identical to water, so there must be something else in the solution. One example is toilet bowl cleaner. Active ingredient is HCl and nothing else is listed but the stuff comes out like a thin syrup (so it sticks to the bowl). I have looked at the MSDS of a number of these products and it doesn't list anything besides HCl.

Does anyone know what may be used to thicken this? Guar gum, Gum arabic, propylene glycol?


Dont quote me on this but, i think the reason they dont list the ingredients is because if under a certain % the MSD dosnt have to list it and its classed as a minor component.

It can be really annoying at times, for example trying to find out what anti caking agent is used in a table salt, or what else is in washing soda apart from upto90% sodium carbonate.

Thos are two recent ones i have had trouble finding out, the washing soda one is a bit sneaky, i have a feeling its pretty much sodium carbonate and the bit they leave out the MSD is the water!
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violet sin
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 17:55


also consider, if the substance in non-toxic/dangerous, it doesn't have to be listed in a material SAFETY data sheet. many additives are free from the need to disclose and are proprietary in nature. you could ask the company, but I have had HORRIBLE results in that regard. even stating intent, affirming it is a non-business venture and a final offer to personally sign and mail in a non-disclosure document, won't even get a response as to yes or no. But it never hurts to ask, and don't forget to try looking up company patents. in some cases that works nicely.




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argyrium
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 18:37


Some common thickeners are cellulose ethers. Pemulen, xanthan gum, and silicone gels are common in cosmetics.
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RogueRose
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 18:46


Quote: Originally posted by NEMO-Chemistry  
Quote: Originally posted by RogueRose  
I've used a number of cleaning solutions where the liquid is thicker than normal water and the active ingredient has a fluidity almost identical to water, so there must be something else in the solution. One example is toilet bowl cleaner. Active ingredient is HCl and nothing else is listed but the stuff comes out like a thin syrup (so it sticks to the bowl). I have looked at the MSDS of a number of these products and it doesn't list anything besides HCl.

Does anyone know what may be used to thicken this? Guar gum, Gum arabic, propylene glycol?


Dont quote me on this but, i think the reason they dont list the ingredients is because if under a certain % the MSD dosnt have to list it and its classed as a minor component.

It can be really annoying at times, for example trying to find out what anti caking agent is used in a table salt, or what else is in washing soda apart from upto90% sodium carbonate.

Thos are two recent ones i have had trouble finding out, the washing soda one is a bit sneaky, i have a feeling its pretty much sodium carbonate and the bit they leave out the MSD is the water!


If you are talking about A&H washing soda, then it is 89.5% carbonate and the rest is the hydrate. It took me a little while to figure that out as well. I guess they could list it as 100% (99.99??) if they wanted and just put they hydrate type.

OR the rest is bi-carb (since they produce so much bicarb, I suspect they make the carb from that so maybe some is unreacted..?) If it is thus, I'm not happy.
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argyrium
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 19:27


I had meant to add the polyacrylic acids (e.g.Carbopol) as well.
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macckone
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[*] posted on 23-7-2016 at 20:16


Some solutions use glucose or sucrose as a thickener.
polypropylene glycol is also popular.
even sodium silicate is used.

Basically anything generally recognized as safe can be added.
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NEMO-Chemistry
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[*] posted on 24-7-2016 at 09:27


No where i live in Scotland it seems every shop sell D&P brand of washing soda. It says it has an anti caking agent but cant be much in it as the bag sets solid in a couple weeks without opening :D.

Going to recrystallise for the hell of it anyway.
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PHILOU Zrealone
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[*] posted on 27-7-2016 at 06:13


For soaps and laundry wash liquid, at Procter & Gamble, we used NaCl to increase viscosity aside sometimes with texturants (depending onto the product and brand: carbo polymers, polyethers, silicone oils, ...) some products holding a lot of ingredients (>20)...

[Edited on 27-7-2016 by PHILOU Zrealone]




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[*] posted on 27-7-2016 at 12:15


Quote: Originally posted by PHILOU Zrealone  
For soaps and laundry wash liquid, at Procter & Gamble, we used NaCl to increase viscosity aside sometimes with texturants (depending onto the product and brand: carbo polymers, polyethers, silicone oils, ...) some products holding a lot of ingredients (>20)...

[Edited on 27-7-2016 by PHILOU Zrealone]


Now that really surprises me! I would never guess that many compounds in a cleaning product. I tend to go for the ultra cheap stuff, the theory being with stuff like bleach the cheaper the price the less stuff they put in.

Although all local sources of acetone are now gone! Its some other horrible gel stuff. So looks like i will have to buy online.

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