undead_alchemist
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Chemicals in Canada
I just got a look at the RCMP chemicals precursors list, some of items include:
Sodium Chloride
Sodium Bicarbonate
Sodium Hydroxide
Sulfuric Acid
Hydrochloric Acid
Citric Acid
Aluminum foil
All flagged as restricted.
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hissingnoise
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And I thought Canada had a saner society than most countries. . .
I'll have to revise my opinion!
How they can restrict salt, baking powder and aluminium foil is beyond me.
The lunatics are now running the asylum. . .
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undead_alchemist
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This is on the RCMP List, not the two Federal (legal) lists
The RCMP list is over 6 pages long.
This list is more like the DEA watch list that no none gets to see.
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Magpie
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| Quote: |
All flagged as restricted.
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What does the RCMP mean here? Do they mean that Suzy Homemaker can only buy 2 rolls of aluminum foil or 1 kg of salt at one time, for example?
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JohnWW
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RCMP means Royal Canadian Mounted Police, or Pigs if you like. A correspondent of mine in Montréal, Québec, once told me that he considered them to
be "Canada's red-coated Gestapo" (sic).
I simply cannot fathom how they could possibly ban as precursors such basic household chemicals, which are, or should be, freely available in
groceries/supermarkets and hardware/home-improvements stores. Common salt, sodium bicarbonate (baking soda), citric acid, and aluminium foil are
kitchen culinary items; sodium carbonate (washing soda) has laundry uses; HCl is used as a soldering flux and metal cleaner; sodium hydroxide (caustic
soda) is used as a heavy-duty industrial and commercial cleanser and drain cleaner and in the restoration of rusted iron artifacts; and sulfuric acid
is used as a drain cleaner (Drâno) and to "pickle" steel articles to remove rust prior to "galvanizing" them by dipping them into molten zinc or
zinc-aluminium mixture. So do Canadians have to obtain Pig permits EVERY TIME they go shopping for these items??
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chemrox
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@JohnWW
They do just that in the US. Especially in the PRC (California) where carbon tet has to be explained and I2 is on the watched list. Na2CO3 is off
the grocery store shelves and MeOH is banned in some counties. Dry ice to older than 18 with picture ID on and on... the WOD has made a sick society.
"When you let the dumbasses vote you end up with populism followed by autocracy and getting back is a bitch." Plato (sort of)
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woelen
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In NL things are not as bad as in California, but what we see here is that common chemicals more and more are going to specialty stores and that in
mainstream drugstores less and less interesting materials can be purchased.
Most of the common chemicals still can be purchased in drugstores and supermarkets, but we see dilution as a weapon against illicit use.
Some examples:
Acetic acid was available at 80% as 'vinegar essence' 25 years ago, then its concentration went down to appr. 30% and now its only available as 8%
(for cleaning purposes, but pure enough for chemistry-related stuff) and 4% (for consumption, often loaded with additional flavors).
Ammonia was available at 25% concentration 20 years ago, then it dropped to 15% in the early nineties, and it dropped to 10% near the turn of the
century and nowadays it only can be purchased in 4...5% concentration. Some people even want it to be diluted more, to 1 or maybe 2%, such that in
some applications it should be used without dilution.
Sodium hypochlorite and hydrochloric acid are the same. NaClO went from 12.5% active chlorine to 4% active chlorine and HCl went from 30% to 10%.
The concentrated chemicals still can be purchased over here, but you have to .do some searching and for newbies in home chemistry this can be a rather
big hurdle which they have to take, especially if they are younger than 18.
Chemicals like NaOH, Na2CO3 and NaHCO3 still are easy to obtain here. Also stuff like Na2SO3, Na2S2O5 and Na2S2O3 are easy to obtain. These are just
mild reductors and are not regarded dangerous.
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Vogelzang
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RMCP
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hissingnoise
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Magpie knows what RCMP means---his question was rhetorical. . .
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hissingnoise
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I have to laugh at the picture---the cop on the horse, deaf to the two rockets fired from behind the stables by some guys who could be members here. .
.
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watson.fawkes
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Quote: Originally posted by Magpie  |
What does the RCMP mean here? Do they mean that Suzy Homemaker can only buy 2 rolls of aluminum foil or 1 kg of salt at one time, for example?
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Without knowing specifics, I will speculate that they have such a list to inform pattern matching about what
counts as a "drug lab". Even if certain chemicals will not be restricted because of multiple uses, having a full list allows officers with
zero-to-very-little chemistry training to make categorization judgements more readily.
Note that the presence of such indistinctive chemical on such a list would tend to exhonerate rather than to implicate. A lab without adequate stores
of salt can't salt out a precipitate, for example. Like many things Canadian, it seems far more level-headed than the analogous activity in the USA.
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quicksilver
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I'm not sure "level headed" would be the description I would use. More like "all encompassing tools for the Prosecution".....This wide swath of
precursor descriptions allows the untrained idiot to label something a "drug lab" & not be held legally accountable for having someone's tiny
micro-biology lab raided & his butterfly collection taken as evidence as development of WMD production or other such tripe. Mistakes made by nosy
assholes "trained" to report possible "clandestine laboratories" need some sort of legal insurance. Idiotic precursor lists like that provide such
insurance.
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Magpie
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| Quote: |
More like "all encompassing tools for the Prosecution".....
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I agree.
In reference to the above picture of a RCMP, I would submit that the picture below is more appropriate:
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undead_alchemist
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Here is a one page from the list:
The page does say that it makes reference to if it is a cash sale.
OCR Scanned.
ACETALDEHYDE
ACETAMIDE
ACETIC ACID
ACETIC ANHYDRIDE
ACETDNE
ACETONE CYANOHYDRIN
ACETONEDI CARBOXYLI C ACI D
ACETONITRILE
N-ACETYLANTHRANI LIC ACI D
Q-ACETYLPHENYLACETONITRILE
ALLYLBENZENE
ALLYL CHLORIDE
4-ALLYL-1 , 2, t1ETHYLENE DIOXYBENZ ENE
ALUMINA
ALUMINUM FOIL
ALUMINUM CHLORIDE
ALUMINUM OXIDE
AMINOACETALDEHYDE D,IMETHYL ACETAL
2-AMINO-5-CHLOROBENZOPHENONE
AMt10NIA(GAS)
AMMONIUM ACETATE
AMMONIUM CHLORIDE
AMMONIUM FORMATE
AMMONIUM HYRDOXIDE
AMYL ALCOHOL
AN ISALDEHYDE (METHOXYBENZALDEHYDE)
ANTHRANILIC ACID
BARI Ut1 CARBONATE
BAR I UM SULFATE
BENZALDEHYDE
BENZENE
BENZ ENESULFONYL CHLORIDE
BENZILIC ACID
BENZOIC At~HYDR ID E
BENZOYL CHLORIDE
BENZYL CHLOR IDE
BENZYL CYANIDE
BENZYLMETHYLKETONE
4-BENZYLOXYINDOLE
BORON TR IFLUOR IDE ETHERATE
BROMINE
BROMOACETYL BROMI DE
BROMOBENZENE
BROt10ETHANE
5-BROMO ISATIN
I-BRDt10-3-METHYLBUTANE
2- BROMOPENTANE
3-BROt10PROPENE
BROMOPROPI OPHENOt~E
2-BRDt10PYR IDINE
2- BRot10THIOPHENE
[Edited on 11-5-2009 by undead_alchemist]
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jon
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next it will be toilet paper then you won't be able to shit without them knowing how many sheets.
literally.
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The_Davster
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It is for compliance with environmental laws. One can only buy so much TP per week.
Canada does NOT have a saner society than other countries.
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Hydragyrum
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Many periods in history in various countries can be considered quite insane. We are going through another insane period.
You know what they say: "May you live in interesting times"
Chemistry is life (and a whole lot more)
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chemrox
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@Hydragyrum - you're right. We're going through a time that is characterized by the Talibans; the ones in the US like Cheney-Bush-Palin and their
mirrors in Afghanistan. Charlie Wilson warned us about them...
"When you let the dumbasses vote you end up with populism followed by autocracy and getting back is a bitch." Plato (sort of)
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