Radiums Lab
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Vanilla essence from bay laurel extract ?
I was following a science related anime called Dr. Stone, In chapter 155 the main character synthesized Vanilla essence from bay laurel extract using
sodium hydroxide and ozone.(Please don't consider this as an anime discussion, I just wanted to know what is going on with the molecules ?)
According to me the anime never showed a wrong experiment or performed wrong science. I wanted to know the reaction mechanisms but couldn't find any
sources online or anything related. I know Vanilla essence can be purchased for cheap but I just wanted to know the chemistry. Anyone please help me
with the reaction intermediates.
Is this by chance ozonization reaction ?
If it is feasible can anyone perform this reaction and share the results.
Here's a picture of that page:
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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Maui3
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It's likely turning the eugenol in the bay laurel extract into vanillin..
I geuss sodium hydroxide may react with isoeugenol to form sodium isoeugenol, which reacts with ozone to form the vanillin.. Not sure where the
isoeugenol is coming from though.. I'll let the more knowledgeble people here help me with that one, lol :-)
https://patents.google.com/patent/CN104086390A/en
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Radiums Lab
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The anime version makes the apparatus more clearly visible.
You can find its footage in season 4 episode 6 of the anime (Name : Dr. Stone), time stamps are 18:25 to 19:25. Feel free to watch the English dub or
turn on subtitles if you don't understand japanese.
[Edited on 5-4-2025 by Radiums Lab]
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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Radiums Lab
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Quote: Originally posted by Maui3  | It's likely turning the eugenol in the bay laurel extract into vanillin..
I geuss sodium hydroxide may react with isoeugenol to form sodium isoeugenol, which reacts with ozone to form the vanillin.. Not sure where the
isoeugenol is coming from though.. I'll let the more knowledgeble people here help me with that one, lol :-)
https://patents.google.com/patent/CN104086390A/en |
The MSDS of a certain company which manufactures bay laurel oil says that it contains 40-60% eugenol and 3-5% isoeugenol.
[Edited on 5-4-2025 by Radiums Lab]
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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Texium
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I’ve watched the first couple seasons, and it seems like generally, while the stuff he does isn’t technically impossible, they take some liberties
with simplifying things that would be very difficult to achieve given the limited resources he has access to.
It’s good entertainment, and nice to see chemistry featured heavily in a popular show, but most of it is over-simplified to keep things moving
along.
On the other hand, I think they sometimes choose more ridiculous/difficult ways to accomplish something when there’s another more practical but
still entertaining option, and that kinda annoys me. I just try not to think too hard about it and enjoy the show. 
This specific case seems like one of those. Bay laurel oil is mostly eucalyptol and other terpenes. Treat that with the prescribed conditions and all
you’ll get is a tarry mess. It would make way more sense to start with cloves, which you can easily get 99% pure eugenol from. You can make a
hand-wavy argument that’s good enough for Dr. Stone that heating eugenol neat with NaOH will cause the alkene to isomerize to the more stable
conjugated isomer. I don’t know the context for this particular episode though, as I haven’t gotten there yet.
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Radiums Lab
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| Quote: Originally posted by Texium | I’ve watched the first couple seasons, and it seems like generally, while the stuff he does isn’t technically impossible, they take some liberties
with simplifying things that would be very difficult to achieve given the limited resources he has access to.
It’s good entertainment, and nice to see chemistry featured heavily in a popular show, but most of it is over-simplified to keep things moving
along.
On the other hand, I think they sometimes choose more ridiculous/difficult ways to accomplish something when there’s another more practical but
still entertaining option, and that kinda annoys me. I just try not to think too hard about it and enjoy the show.
This specific case seems like one of those. Bay laurel oil is mostly eucalyptol and other terpenes. Treat that with the prescribed conditions and all
you’ll get is a tarry mess. It would make way more sense to start with cloves, which you can easily get 99% pure eugenol from. You can make a
hand-wavy argument that’s good enough for Dr. Stone that heating eugenol neat with NaOH will cause the alkene to isomerize to the more stable
conjugated isomer. I don’t know the context for this particular episode though, as I haven’t gotten there yet. |
Hi Texium thank you for replying, in this episode they wanted to make icecream for some American character and they were not able to find vannila pods
in America, so the main character comes up with the following idea. Thanks for specifying that cloves contain more eugenol than bay laurel but I don't
think you find it growing in California (the place which they are now).
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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Radiums Lab
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Here are some pictures of the apparatus used :
This is bottom look of apparatus
This is the top look of it
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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Radiums Lab
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Finally found a decent explanation of this on YouTube here’s the link :
https://youtu.be/vzsBHPrCle8?feature=shared
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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DraconicAcid
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| Quote: Originally posted by Radiums Lab | | Quote: Originally posted by Maui3 | It's likely turning the eugenol in the bay laurel extract into vanillin..
I geuss sodium hydroxide may react with isoeugenol to form sodium isoeugenol, which reacts with ozone to form the vanillin.. Not sure where the
isoeugenol is coming from though.. I'll let the more knowledgeble people here help me with that one, lol :-)
https://patents.google.com/patent/CN104086390A/en |
The MSDS of a certain company which manufactures bay laurel oil says that it contains 40-60% eugenol and 3-5% isoeugenol.
[Edited on 5-4-2025 by Radiums Lab] |
Odd. When I search for bat laurel essential oil composition, I gget a lot of hits saying it's mostly cineole (eucalyptole).
Please remember: "Filtrate" is not a verb.
Write up your lab reports the way your instructor wants them, not the way your ex-instructor wants them.
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Radiums Lab
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Mood: Experiencing the elegance of science.
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| Quote: Originally posted by DraconicAcid | | Quote: Originally posted by Radiums Lab | | Quote: Originally posted by Maui3 | It's likely turning the eugenol in the bay laurel extract into vanillin..
I geuss sodium hydroxide may react with isoeugenol to form sodium isoeugenol, which reacts with ozone to form the vanillin.. Not sure where the
isoeugenol is coming from though.. I'll let the more knowledgeble people here help me with that one, lol :-)
https://patents.google.com/patent/CN104086390A/en |
The MSDS of a certain company which manufactures bay laurel oil says that it contains 40-60% eugenol and 3-5% isoeugenol.
[Edited on 5-4-2025 by Radiums Lab] |
Odd. When I search for bat laurel essential oil composition, I gget a lot of hits saying it's mostly cineole (eucalyptole). |
Sources even mention the presence of eugenol and isoeugenol
In an reasonable percentages.
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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