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Author: Subject: Run-Your-Car-With-Water
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[*] posted on 17-10-2008 at 18:43


I wonder what would happen if you used the electrolysis to make ozone and then pump that into your engine. I'd think that would help combustion. Too bad I don't have an old scrapper car. I'd try it.
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[*] posted on 18-10-2008 at 09:31


Reduced octane.



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franklyn
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[*] posted on 13-8-2013 at 00:57


I have faith in cold fusion electrolysis and related fringe research purporting
to obtain greater energy product out , typically as heat , than what is put into
these experimental systems. It is entirely consistent that a similar process
can be responsible for reports and claims of water as a source of energy and
this can be obtained as hydrogen. I'm still skeptical but receptive to verifiable
practical application.


<object type='application/x-shockwave-flash' data='http://www.reuters.com/resources_v2/flash/video_embed.swf?videoId=84561&edition=BETAUS' id='rcomVideo_84561' width='460' height='259'> <param name='movie' value='http://www.reuters.com/resources_v2/flash/video_embed.swf?videoId=84561&edition=BETAUS'></param> <param name='allowFullScreen' value='true'></param> <param name='allowScriptAccess' value='always'></param> <param name='wmode' value='transparent'></param> <embed src='http://www.reuters.com/resources_v2/flash/video_embed.swf?videoId=84561&edition=BETAUS' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' allowfullscreen='true' allowScriptAccess='always' width='460' height='259' wmode='transparent'></embed> </object>


These two are both the same video as above
www.reuters.com/video/2008/06/13/water-fuel-car-unveiled-in-...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jivb7lupDNU

www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_energy90.htm


Other similar stories in this brief documentary
www.youtube.com/watch?v=984OWabCtW8
Described in the second report of the video above.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Meyer%27s_water_fuel_ce...
http://vixra.org/pdf/0811.0001v1.pdf

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Related threads
www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=9131
www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=10574
www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=6078

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[*] posted on 13-8-2013 at 12:20


people sometimes forget about thermodynamic when speak about catalysts
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[*] posted on 14-8-2013 at 04:04


Fundamental equation: dU=dQ-dA+MdN and dQ=Tds and dA=pdv (if expansion work only) ds>0 ( in spontaneous process)everything else is just math (jacobians, Maxwel relations and lagrande transformations, euler formula). Forget about pseido science and oil company conspiracy theories, and start solve diferation equations!
p.s. few weeks ago i had exam in thermodynamic, god dem interesting and terrible :D


[Edited on 14-8-2013 by Mildronate]
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14-8-2013 at 15:03
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[*] posted on 14-8-2013 at 18:36


See last link of this page _
www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=860&page=...


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[*] posted on 15-8-2013 at 00:46


actualy this video is litle bit childish. In so smal systems there is no more speak about thermodynamic there need to use some statical physic (like hamilton mechanic and quantum mechanic, which is big blach hole in my head and many others :D )

[Edited on 15-8-2013 by Mildronate]
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[*] posted on 17-8-2013 at 00:16


Who's being childish here Mildronate

That's like saying that osmosis and capillary action are not hydrodynamic.

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A related thread _

www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=9131#pid10554...

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[*] posted on 17-8-2013 at 04:09


In ANY engine or otherwise energy transduction process, heat is Always produced, and heat amounts to nothing but wasted energy.

As you burn gasoline(chemical energy) to produce mechanical energy, heat is formed, energy is wasted.
As the alternator converts mechanical energy into electrical energy, heat is formed, energy is wasted.
As the electrical energy is used to electrolyze water into Hydrogen (and O2 also), heat is formed, energy is wasted.

Every step in the process wastes (and therefore loses) energy, and therefore you CANNOT EVER break even, let alone come out ahead.

Anybody who doubts this should enroll in a class in Thermodynamics.
Anybody who claims to have a kit for sale is a scammer.
Anybody who claims to have built this and reports positive gains, perhaps they should admit at least to themselves that it was a good try, but a failure nonetheless.
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[*] posted on 18-8-2013 at 11:09


To believe in the certainty of knowledge and what you know is beyond question ,
is the definition of religion , not science. It doesn't matter how convinced you are
of infallibility , where there is no doubt science has ceased to exist . There is no
substitute for testing a premise. All it takes is one reproducible contrary result to
disprove a theory. When experimental results cannot be refuted , bible thumpers
damn the experimental rigor.and cite the eternal validity of immutable laws.
Those have all the understanding of what constitutes research as someone who
looks up a destination on a map. Unknown by definition means there is no map.

It doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is , it doesn't matter how smart you are.
If it doesn't agree with experiment , it's wrong.
— Richard P. Feynman

When I was young we had nine planets. Now this has semantically become eight.
That which we call a star , would by any other name still wander the night sky.
Artfully said in this vignette from Shakespeare _
— King Lear, Act I , Scene 5

Fool:
The reason why the seven stars are no more than seven is a pretty reason.
King Lear:
Because they are not eight
Fool:
Yes , indeed , thou wouldst make a good fool.


Most people being socially dependent , share the complicit attitude resulting
from the psychological trauma of the fear of ostracism. Why risk yourself
on untried endeavors. Success has many fathers but failure is an orphan.


Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from
the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are even incapable of
forming such opinions.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.
The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to
hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence.
— Albert Einstein

A man should look for what is, and not for what he thinks should be.
— Albert Einstein

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of Truth and Knowledge
is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods.
— Albert Einstein

Any man who reads too much and uses his own brain too little falls into
lazy habits of thinking.
— Albert Einstein

Imagination is more important than knowledge.
— Albert Einstein

If we knew what it was we were doing , it would not be called research , would it ?
— Albert Einstein

Once we have defined and accepted our limits , we can go beyond them.
— Albert Einstein

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[*] posted on 19-8-2013 at 08:44


I know the coal discussion was last page and years ago. Though I did find this interesting in regards to environmental concerns.

http://www.osu.edu/features/2013/ohio-state-develops-clean-c...




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[*] posted on 29-9-2013 at 15:51


On the original topic, I looked into this technology a few years back when it was "all the rage", and made a few observations.

For one, it's obvious that you can't get more out of the system than is being put into it. I think it's a given that people who "increased their gas mileage 1000%" are scammers.

On the other hand, I remember reading a journal that described a test done with a propane (IIRC) vehicle. They were adding small amounts of hydrogen to the system, to see if they could improve the mpg of the vehicle. It did seem to help a little, but only because the added hydrogen enabled you to run the A/F mixture very lean. In fact, the mixture was so lean that the cylinder head temperatures were actually cooler than normal. NOx emissions were improved, and there was essentially no unburned fuel. Without the added hydrogen though, the engine would misfire badly.

I can see this helping if you are doing a lot of idling in the city, and using an older (10-20 year old) vehicle. Otherwise, it's probably hit or miss, depending on an entire host of variables.
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[*] posted on 29-9-2013 at 19:28


The addition of 5% hydrogen can improve the combustion engine efficiency of methane by up to 20%. I would imagine that the improvement would be even greater for liquid fuels. But what is the efficiency of making that hydrogen?

Still, I think this could justify small pressurized hydrogen storage tanks to provide injection into conventional fuel engines.
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[*] posted on 29-9-2013 at 20:32


I knew someone who tried just that. It surprised him how fast the engine used hydrogen. He figured that the bottle would last a month or so, but it was closer to about an hour or two. And since he bought the gas from a welding shop, he paid too much for it.

But yeah, using a car's engine like it's a gas-powered electric generator is very inefficient. Catalytic dehydrogenation might be cheaper, though. Filling some copper tubing with catalytic beads of choice (like a single-bead-string-reactor), and wrapping it around the exhaust manifold would work easily for something like methanol. Many catalysts are so active that they not only dehydrogenate methanol, but decompose the formaldehyde as well. Deactivation from overheating could be a problem, though.

I have too many projects going to try this on my car right now, but I am working on the dehydrogenation part. Currently, I'm directly dehydrogenating ethanol in a stream of N2 over copper/magnesium oxide beads. The reaction tube (borosilicate) is enclosed in an aluminum block, that is then heated directly on a hot plate. I'm going to post the details in the acetaldehyde thread once I get the documentation together.
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[*] posted on 2-2-2014 at 18:29
www.youtube.com/embed/xHISTsiR9qc


The above link replaces the expired link for " Other similar stories in this brief documentary "

here => http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=11102&...


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[*] posted on 5-2-2014 at 05:32
- continuing on the previous post above


This is true of sooo many things. Science is not gatekeeping by
know it all elitists protecting what they regard as their exclusive turf.
The broader issue of conspiracy by the globalist cabal is implied
www.youtube.com/watch?v=htgV7fNO-2k
www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kb_T8sCWL8


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[*] posted on 5-2-2014 at 08:27


Quote: Originally posted by franklyn  
www.youtube.com/watch?v=htgV7fNO-2k
This is some of the most biased, sensationalized, deceptive, and divisive reporting I've ever seen. It's unabashedly unscientific. This uninformed political commentary has no place in the Technochemistry forum. Please spam your conspiracy-theorist propaganda elsewhere. [closed]

[edit] franklyn, stick to science posts in Energetic Materials, or don't post at all. Nobody comes to this website to read your copy-paste political and conspiracy spam.

[Edited on 5.2.14 by bfesser]




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