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Author: Subject: Make Potassium (from versuchschemie.de)
oberkarteufel
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[*] posted on 14-5-2019 at 00:54


Thank you for your answer. Currently I don't have an access to (or rather, excess money to spend) these alcohols, so in the fortunate event I have the place again to work further on this reaction I will rather try again the menthol, changing other variables.

I've checked all nearby stores (and some further ones) and all brands of "hypoallergenic" baby oil contained things like vitamins, palmitate esters, etc. Thus, liquid paraffin I used looks like the best option, since it's reasonably pure, cheap and available in virtually every pharmacy.

I also want to strongly encourage you to try this reaction.
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DavidJR
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[*] posted on 14-5-2019 at 03:39


Quote: Originally posted by oberkarteufel  
Thank you for your answer. Currently I don't have an access to (or rather, excess money to spend) these alcohols, so in the fortunate event I have the place again to work further on this reaction I will rather try again the menthol, changing other variables.

I've checked all nearby stores (and some further ones) and all brands of "hypoallergenic" baby oil contained things like vitamins, palmitate esters, etc. Thus, liquid paraffin I used looks like the best option, since it's reasonably pure, cheap and available in virtually every pharmacy.

I also want to strongly encourage you to try this reaction.


I tried making potassium with KOH, menthol, and baby oil and it didn't work. The baby oil I bought does claim to be hypoallergenic but according to the ingredients it contains isopropyl myristate and "parfum" (god knows what that is).
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walruslover69
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[*] posted on 14-5-2019 at 09:00


I have tried with walmart brand hypoallergenic baby oil with some sort of fragrance with baffling results. The first attempt it went perfectly with maybe 5g of potassium being synthesized, but i have never been able to replicate the results. The second time huge plumes of white fog (not smoke) were generated after it reached ~150C. My 3rd and 4th attempts were very similar to what you reported with nothing happening except the oil turning a tan or light brown color.
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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 14-5-2019 at 21:11


I'm pretty sure the white fog or smoke is the parfum being boiled out as it was when I tried baby oil heating baths.

[Edited on 15-5-2019 by draculic acid69]
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MrHomeScientist
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[*] posted on 15-5-2019 at 05:51


Has anyone else reported success with menthol? I don't recall that being used for this before.
It's good practice to start by replicating a known successful process first, then trying modifications.
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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 15-5-2019 at 06:12


Are you completely unaware of nurdrages research into sodium production using the same rxn as the KOH method above?
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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 15-5-2019 at 06:20


If you aren't here's where it's at: NaOH/mg in baby oil w/menthol catalyst= Na metal.
People are now trying to make potassium with menthol catalyst. Pok has made rubidium and nurdrage is trying to do lithium with the same rxn.my theory is K might be too big to fit on the menthol molecule the way sodium does and the steric hindrance is affected.might have too stick to tertiary alcohols for K formation.
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MrHomeScientist
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[*] posted on 15-5-2019 at 06:23


Not at all. I haven't watched every video though; does he succeed with menthol in one of them? That would have been more helpful information than a personal attack.

Even if he did use menthol for sodium, that doesn't necessarily prove it will work for potassium.


Edit: I didn't see your second post. Thank you, that is much more valuable information. I'll have to watch the newer videos.

[Edited on 5-15-2019 by MrHomeScientist]
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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 15-5-2019 at 06:31


Glad to be of help,yes he succeeded with menthol. If you watch all of his sodium videos it spells out the mechanism what works what doesn't etc etc.
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oberkarteufel
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[*] posted on 3-12-2019 at 04:08
Success!


Well, for longer I've been away from this topic than expected, but I'm back with some new results.
I have tried t-amyl alcohol as a catalyst...
... and well it worked!

DSC_1108.jpg - 141kB

I am also now sure that I have issues with insufficient power output of my hotplate. With a lot of hassle I was able to produce only these little droplets of metalic potassium. Well, at least that's something.
I am inclined to think that either menthol isn't a suitable catalyst for producing potassium or that it is much less active than t-amyl alcohol. Shame, because it's cheaper and easier to get... Anyway - achievement unlocked ;)
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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 3-12-2019 at 19:34


Nicely done.did u perform everything the same as the unsuccessful menthol runs?
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oberkarteufel
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[*] posted on 4-12-2019 at 03:11


Yup, same paraffin oil from pharmacy, heating regime etc. IIRC Total time of heating (first for drying the mixture, then after adding a catalyst) was 5+ hours.
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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 4-12-2019 at 04:41


I think u just proved menthol doesnt work for potassium.
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j_sum1
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[*] posted on 20-12-2019 at 13:31


Quote: Originally posted by fotso  
Funny thing. The minute you posted it I also found out and was reading it :P
I immediately wanted to do this as well. However, I will make slight modifications, I will use i-PrOH instead of t-BuOH.
Also I don't know where to buy Shell D70 solvent, so i will use some high boiling hydrocarbon such as mineral turpetine.
I will still have to order some magnesium. I have some ribbon, I think i will use that to try it this weekend, but it's not enough to prepare more than a gram or two (I don't want to waste all the ribbon).

You are going to want a tertiary alcohol as a catalyst. So isopropyl alcohol will not work.
Also, I think scaling down to a couple of grams will be problematic. Mg ribon is cheap. But if you can get something clean with a better surface area, do so.
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elementcollector1
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[*] posted on 20-12-2019 at 18:24


Shell D70 isn't really the most important part - kerosene/lamp oil works just as well. I personally couldn't make drugstore mineral oil work, though.



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draculic acid69
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[*] posted on 20-12-2019 at 20:40


All the kerosene we get here in Australia is dyed blue which means distillation would be required.

[Edited on 21-12-2019 by draculic acid69]
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j_sum1
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[*] posted on 30-12-2019 at 05:32


I know it is a bit of a read, fotso. But these questions are answered within the thread. It is worth taking some time to go through it.

The tertiary alcohol (it must be tertiary) is a catalyst. The exact mechanism I forget but it is in here somewhere. Some limited success has been had with candle wax but there are other better choices. What seems to be critical is that it is alaphitic and that it has a high enough boiling point.

Happy reading.
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Pok
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[*] posted on 2-1-2020 at 13:44


You are wasting your time. fotso just copies posts from other users.



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Abromination
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[*] posted on 15-2-2020 at 09:52


Did you read what j_sum said? It has to be tertiary, you cant use isopropanol. Isopropanol is a secondary alcohol.
Please read the thread.




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Tsjerk
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[*] posted on 15-2-2020 at 10:07


A catalyst boiling well below the reaction temperature in a liquid reaction is probably not a very good catalyst. Who would guess?

[Edited on 15-2-2020 by Tsjerk]
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[*] posted on 15-2-2020 at 10:50


Also it looks like he literally copied his first post from earlier in the thread.
Tertiary butanol works fine as a catalyst, this has been discussed extensively and doesn’t need further debate.




List of materials made by ScienceMadness.org users:
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--------------------------------
Elements Collected: H, Li, B, C, N, O, Mg, Al, Si, P, S, Fe, Ni, Cu, Zn, Ag, I, Au, Pb, Bi, Am
Last Acquired: B
Next: Na
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