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pdb
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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 06:56
Cutting with primary


Cutting test of bristol board with a primary explosive.The primer is nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate, with a linear density of 4.5 mg per cm.

Unfortunately, other than Edmund Herz's 1911 patent and its mention in COPAE, there are no studies of this primer that I know of. It has not found use because diazonium salts have a bad reputation for instability, and also because it is said to be hygrometric. I dispute this last point: I have kept samples of it for more than twenty years without noticing any hygrometry, nor any degradation except a darkening of its color.

It was used routinely in the laboratory by Henri Muraour (a French explosives researcher in the 1930s and 1940s) when he needed a particularly powerful primer. In my own tests, I estimate its priming power against PETN and RDX to be about twice that of AgN3 of equal weight.

I do not know its VOD.As for its sensitivity to mechanical actions, I tend to subjectively equate it to that of Hg(CNO)2. DDT is immediate, with no perceivable induction time.



PXL_20211021_142610575-00.02.19.249.jpeg - 194kB PXL_20211021_142610575-00.02.19.282.jpeg - 114kB PXL_20211021_142610575-00.02.19.315.jpeg - 77kB

Edit(woelen): Fixed issue with one of the pictures on request of user pdb.

[Edited on 2-12-21 by woelen]
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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 07:36


Next try with a 41 cm path. Photo quality is poor due to lack of light.


PXL_20211021_151404849-00.01.09.650.jpeg - 61kB PXL_20211021_151404849-00.01.09.684.jpeg - 43kB


Edit(woelen): Fixed issue with one of the pictures on request of user pdb.

[Edited on 2-12-21 by woelen]
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Brightthermite
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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 09:51


These are so cool
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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 10:32


Bravo!



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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 13:13


Finally someone with Art of primary compounds. Sometimes the VoD is not so important a like results. And this is the case.
Great work...:cool:
Maybe try use thin Copper plate. 0,1 mm I estimate. Detonography
is very interest art.


D1.jpg - 435kB




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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 16:46


Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov  
Finally someone with Art of primary compounds. Sometimes the VoD is not so important a like results. And this is the case.
Great work...:cool:
Maybe try use thin Copper plate. 0,1 mm I estimate. Detonography
is very interest art.




Beautiful!! Once I find something to act as a backing that is my next project!
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[*] posted on 21-10-2021 at 22:59


Quote: Originally posted by Laboratory of Liptakov  
Finally someone with Art of primary compounds. Sometimes the VoD is not so important a like results. And this is the case.
Great work...:cool:
Maybe try use thin Copper plate. 0,1 mm I estimate. Detonography
is very interest art.





Yes, I have done detonography with a sheet of plexiglass to transmit the detonation wave. But your method with a water balloon is much easier and effective!

By the way, could you please check in the Russian literature if there is a study on nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate? Some years ago someone found a paper in Russian about dinitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate, but this compound is of no interest because it only deflagrates: even priming it with another primer, I couldn't get it to detonate.

Speaking of art, I have a "work" that I could call "entanglement". Look at the pictures



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[*] posted on 22-10-2021 at 02:46


nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate? Is that the one where you start with 3-nitroaniline, dissolve it in HClO4/HCl mixture and add NaNO2 to perform diazonation? I vaguely recall reading yourself and Microtek posts about it many years ago.

I also cannot for the life of me remember if HClO4 was strictly needed, or if a perchlorate salt worked fine.

Edit: Also, what are you using to "bind" your material here? Painting it on while wet and allowing to dry, or nitrocellulose/similar as a binder? I wonder if a thin layer of this material, bound with NC or similar painted onto an object such as a leaf, affixed to a metal plate could work for making artwork?

[Edited on 22-10-2021 by katyushaslab]

[Edited on 22-10-2021 by katyushaslab]
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[*] posted on 22-10-2021 at 07:29


Quote: Originally posted by katyushaslab  
nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate? Is that the one where you start with 3-nitroaniline, dissolve it in HClO4/HCl mixture and add NaNO2 to perform diazonation? I vaguely recall reading yourself and Microtek posts about it many years ago.


Yes !

Quote: Originally posted by katyushaslab  
I also cannot for the life of me remember if HClO4 was strictly needed, or if a perchlorate salt worked fine.


Never tried. It should work with an excess HCl.

Quote: Originally posted by katyushaslab  
Edit: Also, what are you using to "bind" your material here?


I didn't bother, I just added about 10% flour.

Quote: Originally posted by katyushaslab  
I wonder if a thin layer of this material, bound with NC or similar painted onto an object such as a leaf, affixed to a metal plate could work for making artwork?


You must first find a material that can produce "art" after being subjected to a shock wave. Ideas welcome !
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[*] posted on 22-10-2021 at 09:40


Could you guys elaborate on the water balloon, the plexiglass or point me to other topics that I might have missed where you talk about that ?
You made me curious :)




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[*] posted on 22-10-2021 at 11:40
detonography


Yes, ballon water works
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeAEwi04PoI


feather.jpg - 687kB

[Edited on 22-10-2021 by Laboratory of Liptakov]




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[*] posted on 23-10-2021 at 01:39


The plexiglass assembly consists, from top to bottom, of a sheet of explosive (PETN preferable because the critical thickness is very low) with a centered detonator, then a plexiglass disk of about 1cm thickness to homogenize the shock wave, then the object to be engraved (a vegetable leaf), and finally a polished copper or brass plate.

It works, but it is more complicated than the water balloon method.
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[*] posted on 26-10-2021 at 02:02
Cutting with AgN3


The same cutting experiment with AgN3 does not work well: the size of the crystals (much larger than the nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate crystals) and especially their high density prevent them from remaining suspended in the water + flour mixture. So it is difficult to spread the mixture on the cardboard.

Another detail: I never managed to capture a nice flame from an AgN3 explosion, whereas nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate always gives great pictures with sparks all over the path.

Attachment: PXL_20211026_080654359-00.02.16.046-00.02.22.544.mp4 (5MB)
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[*] posted on 26-10-2021 at 06:02


Thank you both.
Your solutions are way better than anything I have thought of so far.
The water balloon contraption is art in itselft.




The spirit of adventure was upon me. Having nitric acid and copper, I had only to learn what the words 'act upon' meant. - Ira Remsen
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[*] posted on 2-11-2021 at 08:36
Trial with (NCN3)3


This time I tried to form a trail of CTA (cyanuric triazide) by melting (m.p. 94°).But once liquid, the CTA soaked the cardboard, in which it diffused giving it a certain translucence, like an oil stain.


As a result, the behavior in the flame is quite strange: I put two extracts in the video. You can see that the CTA crackles, without continuity in the detonation, but with continuity in the crackling.

It is in a way halfway between nitrobenzene diazonium perchlorate which detonates in one go, and AgN3 which detonates in segments, without continuity between the successive detonations

Attachment: PXL_20211102_153733429-cut-merged-1635869700052-00.00.00.233-00.00.12.070.mp4 (7.9MB)
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[Edited on 2-11-21 by pdb]
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[*] posted on 4-11-2021 at 11:08


Quote: Originally posted by pdb  
The same cutting experiment with AgN3 does not work well: the size of the crystals (much larger than the nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate crystals) and especially their high density prevent them from remaining suspended in the water + flour mixture. So it is difficult to spread the mixture on the cardboard


I theorize a small additional % guar gum or xanthan gum would provide a stiffer gel capable of keeping your larger/denser crystals suspended.

Prepared wallpaper paste might be better with heavy crystals than plain than flour/water

Or maybe COOK the flour/water mixture? Brinnng it to a simmer while stirring and allow to cool before adding primary? Explosive gravy...

I keep food grade xanthan and guar gums on hand. Useful for everything from making hot sauce that doesn't run off your ribs & wings to making cut stars.

[Edited on 11-4-2021 by Bert]




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[*] posted on 4-11-2021 at 12:33


pdb:
Spectacular video with paper. Great work. Magic paper. A like shooting into paper from invisible laser 1000W. Or beams of death. All others important for better results said Bert...:cool:




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[*] posted on 24-11-2021 at 14:03


Again, the nitrobenzenediazonium perchlorate provides a beautiful image, captured at 240 fps. I think this is due to the recombination of the detonation products, from the raw formula C6H4ClN3O6, which lasts longer than the detonation itself (which, as a thin trail, must be quite low, maybe 2000 to 3000 m/s... however enough to travel about a meter per image). By the way, the smell of the explosion is very pleasant... well, I think so.

With inorganic azides, or fulminates, the detonation products are too simple to cause a recombination. So it is rare to capture the detonation at 240 fps, and at best you just see a white flash.

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[*] posted on 24-11-2021 at 15:27


Mad perchlorate. Exotic formula. Spectacular photos...:cool:



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[*] posted on 24-11-2021 at 16:20


That paper video was so so cool. Please do more experiments for that. It’s like a detonating fuse. There has to be a use for it.
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[*] posted on 30-11-2021 at 02:32


This time I shot the back of the Bristol to avoid the camera being blinded by the flash of the detonation. I also put a black background screen to avoid any reflection of the light.

Too bad, the detonation was captured on 2 frames. On the first one, the detonation occurred at the half of the sensor scan. And the second one is particularly nice. However, I hope next time to capture the entire detonation on a single frame.

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thumbup.gif posted on 5-12-2021 at 07:04


Incredible art work...Hat off....:cool:



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[*] posted on 2-6-2022 at 04:11


Wow, really cool.
I liked the different types of leaf on the metal plates, looks like the ancient fossils they find enbedded in stone.
I really have to try this some time.

Does other explosives work too if one work out how big charge to use by some trials?
The waterballon method seem very good.
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[*] posted on 2-6-2022 at 10:01


Really beautiful, should be published in some scientific-popular journal.



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