metalresearcher
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Which chemicals do you NOT want to have at home ?
Because of too toxic, flammable, oxidizing, etc.
I kick off:
ClF3
FOOF
F2
HF (even aqueous)
compressed Cl2
compressed O2
KCN
NaCN
NaN3
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chempyre235
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I'd second the reactive fluorinated compounds and sodium azide.
Also, dimethyl cadmium, and several natural toxins, like batrachotoxin are a big "NO."
No sensitive explosives either, save small amounts of nitrogen triiodide for fun demonstrations.
No anhydrous hydrazine or peroxide.
[Edited on 9/30/2025 by chempyre235]
"However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results." -Winston Churchill
"I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride." -@Madscientist
"...the elements shall melt with fervent heat..." -2 Peter 3:10
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woelen
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For me, the criterion is how safely the material can be stored. It is a combination of corrosiveness, toxicity and stability. Compounds, which quickly
decay outside of their container to non-toxic stuff are less of a problem than stuff, which remains toxic for a long time (e.g. NaCN vs. As2O3 or
HgCl2).
I'm not talking about stuff like FOOF or ClF3, nor about war gases like sarin, novitchok and mustard gases. These are beyond home chemistry anyway and
I'll never get in contact with these. I probably even will never see these in real life at all. So, I confine the discussion to chemicals, which can
be obtained (albeit not easily).
I have no problem with KCN and NaCN. I actually have some NaCN, which is useful for experimenting and handling this can be done fairly easily (it is
just a solid, not extremely corrosive and easily dissolves in water). Just use common sense and avoid spilling it. The same is true for NaN3.
I also have oleum, PCl3, PCl5 and SO2(OH)Cl. All of these are very corrosive, but they are not extremely toxic (they very quickly react with water to
not so toxic compounds like dilute HCl, dilute H2SO4 and dilute H3PO3/H3PO4). Storage of this kind of chemicals can be a pain in the ass, but risks in
terms of health are not large.
A compound, which I do not want is AsCl3. I once had the opportunity to buy some AsCl3 for a good price, but I decided to let it go. AsCl3 is volatile
and extremely toxic. Handling this safely is beyond what I can do. Even tiny amounts of vapor (e.g. when opening the bottle) can have nasty effects.
I, however, do have a little As2O3, which also is very toxic, but this is a non-volatile solid, which can be handled safely in aqueous solutions. I,
however, feel more restrained to use As2O3 in experiments than using NaCN. As2O3 remains toxic, while NaCN's toxicity only is transiently. It quickly
degrades to non-toxic compounds like ammonium salts and carbonates and also easily can be destroyed by oxidizing it.
Summarizing what I absolutely do not want:
- AsCl3, nor any other volatile arsenic compounds
- HF (more than azeotropic 48%)
- volatile mercury compounds
- anhydrous hydrazine (stability issues, chance of rupture of containers with subsequent massive release of carcinogenic volatile hydrazine)
Yet another criterion is how many interesting things I can do with a certain chemical. A toxic compound like NaCN is quite interesting. It has
interesting aqueous chemistry, certainly when combined with transition metals. So, that is why I do have some NaCN. I also could buy dimethylsulfate,
but I let that one go. It is very toxic (a really strong methylating agent, making it highly carcinogenic and also mutagenic). For me, this compound
does not offer sufficient interesting opportunities for experimenting. this does not outweigh its high toxicity. If it were less toxic, then I
probably would have had a bottle of it. For all chemicals, I banance their usefulness against their risk. Bromine is another one, which I do have.
Fairly risky (volatile and quite toxic), but very interesting for experimenting.
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Texium
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Thread Moved
1-10-2025 at 06:10 |
bariumbromate
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NAN3 is useful to have around though... i have about 100g in my shed
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Radiums Lab
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Did you make this ?
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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MrDoctor
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For me, its toluene and DCM, which i do have, and begrudgingly store outside. but i would rather keep benzene in my house than toluene.
for reasons i do not quite understand, toluene has this slightly unique ability to slip out of any container it is sold in, and finding decent ones
one might store 5L of it in, is tricky. DCM does the same too but, like diethyl ether, it dissolves into most plastics and with the aid of the high
vapor pressure at room temp can squeeze its way out of even a PTFE tape sealed GL45, unless apparently, its a really good GL45 and/or has a teflon
liner too.
the reason i dont want to have them in my house is, i once purchased 5L of toluene from sydneysolvents, i had never bought toluene before in a large
volume, so i thought nothing of it. i used it once, to clean/dry/distill to put into a 500ml glass bottle for convenient use, i closed up the HDPE
bottle it came in and forgot about it in the corner of the room. at some point i grabbed an extra 1L which lowered the fluid level so i didnt notice
what happened next right away. 6 months later, my purified toluene had run out, i went to get some more, the toluene bottle was down to about 1.5L, i
had taken out 1.5L, meaning over 6 months, in my basement, 2L of toluene had evaporated and i didnt even notice. long term exposure to toluene like
that is really bad, even if its not detectable. the bottle wasnt puffed up, and didnt have any obvious signs of leakage, plus was in the same state it
came in, so i chalked it up to maybe there was some slight defect or something. nope. i buy another bottle from sydneysolvents, the one i currently
have now. its lost about 1L in the last 6 months stored outside. the DCM next to it, has lost less oddly enough, but some nontheless, however the DCM
swells up like a balloon so im not surprised.
I have heard mixed things about DCM, amateurs tell me its liquid cancer, but then an actual chemical engineer that works with it, says its relatively
benign compared to the standard selection of non-polar solvents we use, like hexane and toluene. Either way, its just so damn volatile it will
inevitably leak out of its container as well, and while maybe (i dont know how to interperet the toxicology studies properly) acute exposure is fine,
chronic i think is where it gets you, so any plastic lidded container will inevitably leak, and unless its stored in a ventilated solvent cupboard, or
a negative pressure room, it will find its way into you.
The timescale of effect from these is different, which is why they are so scary, they are relatively common but depending where its from, cheap bulk
technical grade stuff can possibly have a negative impact on your health stored in the house without you even knowing it.
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bariumbromate
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no i brought the sodium azide from a chemical supplier
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chloric1
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Quote: Originally posted by MrDoctor  | For me, its toluene and DCM, which i do have, and begrudgingly store outside. but i would rather keep benzene in my house than toluene.
for reasons i do not quite understand, toluene has this slightly unique ability to slip out of any container it is sold in, and finding decent ones
one might store 5L of it in, is tricky. DCM does the same too but, like diethyl ether, it dissolves into most plastics and with the aid of the high
vapor pressure at room temp can squeeze its way out of even a PTFE tape sealed GL45, unless apparently, its a really good GL45 and/or has a teflon
liner too.
the reason i dont want to have them in my house is, i once purchased 5L of toluene from sydneysolvents, i had never bought toluene before in a large
volume, so i thought nothing of it. i used it once, to clean/dry/distill to put into a 500ml glass bottle for convenient use, i closed up the HDPE
bottle it came in and forgot about it in the corner of the room. at some point i grabbed an extra 1L which lowered the fluid level so i didnt notice
what happened next right away. 6 months later, my purified toluene had run out, i went to get some more, the toluene bottle was down to about 1.5L, i
had taken out 1.5L, meaning over 6 months, in my basement, 2L of toluene had evaporated and i didnt even notice. long term exposure to toluene like
that is really bad, even if its not detectable. the bottle wasnt puffed up, and didnt have any obvious signs of leakage, plus was in the same state it
came in, so i chalked it up to maybe there was some slight defect or something. nope. i buy another bottle from sydneysolvents, the one i currently
have now. its lost about 1L in the last 6 months stored outside. the DCM next to it, has lost less oddly enough, but some nontheless, however the DCM
swells up like a balloon so im not surprised.
I have heard mixed things about DCM, amateurs tell me its liquid cancer, but then an actual chemical engineer that works with it, says its relatively
benign compared to the standard selection of non-polar solvents we use, like hexane and toluene. Either way, its just so damn volatile it will
inevitably leak out of its container as well, and while maybe (i dont know how to interperet the toxicology studies properly) acute exposure is fine,
chronic i think is where it gets you, so any plastic lidded container will inevitably leak, and unless its stored in a ventilated solvent cupboard, or
a negative pressure room, it will find its way into you.
The timescale of effect from these is different, which is why they are so scary, they are relatively common but depending where its from, cheap bulk
technical grade stuff can possibly have a negative impact on your health stored in the house without you even knowing it.
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I have a small 4 ounce bottle of DCM used in cementing plexiglass. I keep it in the refrigerator and the liquid stays same volume for 2 yrs plus. So
I would strongly recommend refrigeration then.
Fellow molecular manipulator
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yobbo II
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Compressed O2?
Was that a typo ?
I have a 3000psi. 20 litre bottle of the stuff (living on the wild side!)
Yob
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chempyre235
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| Quote: Originally posted by yobbo II |
Compressed O2?
Was that a typo ?
I have a 3000psi. 20 litre bottle of the stuff (living on the wild side!)
Yob |
I wondered that, too. Maybe compressed O3? I wouldn't want that, either. 
@Bariumbromate: I don't know if my fears are just exaggerated due to lack of experience, but I'd think that azides would be worse than cyanides,
because: (a) azides have no known antidote for possible poisoning, and (b) they form many sensitive explosive compounds, and (c) azides have fewer
uses I've seen for organic and inorganic chemistry outside of the synthesis of energetics.
"However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results." -Winston Churchill
"I weep at the sight of flaming acetic anhydride." -@Madscientist
"...the elements shall melt with fervent heat..." -2 Peter 3:10
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MrDoctor
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i have 110 bar of the stuff just rolling around the floor here under my desk, just one of those small disposable bottles for welding purposes, got it
for in the event i wanted to do some actual high efficiency ozonation
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Texium
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I think this was discussed in another thread recently, but if you’re storing volatile organic solvents or highly corrosive liquids in bottles with
GL45 caps, you’re doing it wrong, regardless of what color the cap is. Somehow those media bottles with GL45 caps have acquired the reputation of
being the gold standard for chemical storage, but they’re actually not great. They are favored for preparing stock solutions and buffers in biochem
labs because they are easy to autoclave, the wide mouths make it easy to dump salts into them, and the graduations allow them to be topped up to the
desired volume.
But as far as making a good seal, the lids are too large and tolerances too loose to ensure a vapor tight seal around the entire edge, and unless you
are using the fluoropolymer lined ones (funny enough, the best ones in my experience are the white lids from Fisher’s 4 L aluminum diethyl ether
bottles, rather than any lid you can buy directly) there is a lot of exposed plastic that can absorb vapor, become brittle, and fail, or at least
become warped and make the seal even worse.
So what’s the real gold standard? These: https://shop.qorpak.com/products/GLC-02004/32-oz-amber-glass...
And I believe you can still buy used ones of various sizes at an excellent price from Dr. Bob.
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metalresearcher
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| Quote: Originally posted by yobbo II |
Compressed O2?
Was that a typo ?
I have a 3000psi. 20 litre bottle of the stuff (living on the wild side!)
Yob |
Yes, I mean compressed O2. Such oxygen cylinders are OK when stored outside or in the shed, but not indoors. In case of a fire, they get an unguided
missile.
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bnull
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Diazomethane.
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greenlight
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| Quote: Originally posted by MrDoctor | For me, its toluene and DCM, which i do have, and begrudgingly store outside. but i would rather keep benzene in my house than toluene.
for reasons i do not quite understand, toluene has this slightly unique ability to slip out of any container it is sold in, and finding decent ones
one might store 5L of it in, is tricky. DCM does the same too but, like diethyl ether, it dissolves into most plastics and with the aid of the high
vapor pressure at room temp can squeeze its way out of even a PTFE tape sealed GL45, unless apparently, its a really good GL45 and/or has a teflon
liner too.
the reason i dont want to have them in my house is, i once purchased 5L of toluene from sydneysolvents, i had never bought toluene before in a large
volume, so i thought nothing of it. i used it once, to clean/dry/distill to put into a 500ml glass bottle for convenient use, i closed up the HDPE
bottle it came in and forgot about it in the corner of the room. at some point i grabbed an extra 1L which lowered the fluid level so i didnt notice
what happened next right away. 6 months later, my purified toluene had run out, i went to get some more, the toluene bottle was down to about 1.5L, i
had taken out 1.5L, meaning over 6 months, in my basement, 2L of toluene had evaporated and i didnt even notice. long term exposure to toluene like
that is really bad, even if its not detectable. the bottle wasnt puffed up, and didnt have any obvious signs of leakage, plus was in the same state it
came in, so i chalked it up to maybe there was some slight defect or something. nope. i buy another bottle from sydneysolvents, the one i currently
have now. its lost about 1L in the last 6 months stored outside. the DCM next to it, has lost less oddly enough, but some nontheless, however the DCM
swells up like a balloon so im not surprised.
I have heard mixed things about DCM, amateurs tell me its liquid cancer, but then an actual chemical engineer that works with it, says its relatively
benign compared to the standard selection of non-polar solvents we use, like hexane and toluene. Either way, its just so damn volatile it will
inevitably leak out of its container as well, and while maybe (i dont know how to interperet the toxicology studies properly) acute exposure is fine,
chronic i think is where it gets you, so any plastic lidded container will inevitably leak, and unless its stored in a ventilated solvent cupboard, or
a negative pressure room, it will find its way into you.
The timescale of effect from these is different, which is why they are so scary, they are relatively common but depending where its from, cheap bulk
technical grade stuff can possibly have a negative impact on your health stored in the house without you even knowing it.
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I recommend a 5 litre metal fuel can that are sold at hardware stores and service stations for emergency refilling or fuel storage for lawnmowers.
The caps are designed to hold the volatile mixture of solvents that petrol is for extended times. I havent had any loss of volume from toluene stored
in one of these.
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jackchem2001
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Toluene has a distinctive odor at a very low level so I doubt you could get exposed without noticing. The odor threshold is also below published
permissible exposure values so I wouldnt worry
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Radiums Lab
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I think I dont want to have some [Ni(CO4)] around.
Water is dangerous if you don't know how to handle it, elemental fluorine (F₂) on the other hand is pretty tame if you know what you are doing.
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